best rating for the real world?

[homersimpson]

im just going into nuke school, i was wondering what rating would be best for the real world...i was told ET...?

[Fermi2]

im just going into nuke school, i was wondering what rating would be best for the real world...i was told ET...?

Who told you that Bullcrap, someone who's never worked in the real world?

Mike

[Clerisy]

Who told you that Bullcrap, someone who's never worked in the real world?

Mike

That was the general impression I got from the forums at military.com.

Then I came here and MM/ELT seemed to be the preferred rating.

To be honest, in matters of opinion, I tend to agree with people here.  The reason being, most of the ex-nukes at military.com are bitter about the job they chose.  Most of the people here liked it enough to stay in the field.

Read some threads, decide what sounds best to you, and go for it.  No one can tell you what you want to be.

[Charles U Farley]

Sonar Tech.  Hands down.

I'm going out on a limb to say a large portion of the nukeworker community on this site is involved with radcon or radhealth physics.  Naturally, that would lend a preferential nod to ELT. 

Mechanics are like the stereotypical jarhead marines.  Stupid proud.  Happy to go into any situation blind, dumb, and deaf, covered in lube oil and come out with a smile on ugly mugs, only their mothers would think was handsome, like there is no better job in the world. 

Now, being an ET,  everyone, together, hold your hand over your hearts.  I will say that being one of God's select few... doesn't really matter. 

A nod to Jason, and what he said.  You will recieve enough cross rate training that you will have some level of proficiency at just about anything.  Apply for whatever interests you personnaly.  As anyrate, you can always cross qualify on any watchstation (a few exceptions apply).  The best lower level watch I ever saw was an electrician.  The best Engineroom Supervisor was an ELT.  The best mess crank I ever saw was an ET.  Do what you want and don't worry about the rest. 

[Rad Sponge]

I guess I would say the best combo nuke to crossover into operations would be
an ELT that is a great MM who is heavy on EM/ET theory.

Is that vague enough?

[Roll Tide]

It depends on your definition of real world. I would say MM qualified EWS would be the best preparation for OPS at a commercial nuke. But some wouldn't consider that the real world. And yes, you need a lot of cross-rate knowledge (which is why EWS is so important).

Additionally, get a B.S. while you are in. It will help inside and outside the Navy, and isn't expensive.

[M1Ark]

It depends on your definition of real world. I would say MM qualified EWS would be the best preparation for OPS at a commercial nuke.

Absolutely true.  ET's are a lock for I&C work but probably the least skilled than the other 3 ratings for anything else.  An ET that was a good EWS is the exception.

[Roll Tide]

Absolutely true.  ET's are a lock for I&C work but probably the least skilled than the other 3 ratings for anything else.  An ET that was a good EWS is the exception.

Besides Ken Atkins, were there any good ones? When ETC was the EWS, I felt better having the EOOW touring the spaces. 
ELTs are more likely to go Radcon, but those with a strong OPS mentality do great in commercial OPS.

Again, depending on the definition of real world. Nuke EMs are in high demand in non-nuke applications (elevator, assembly line, and crane come to mind). But I prefer the commercial nuke world.

[navytwinmom]

Well as you can see for some of the relys the best rating depends on who you talk to. I have twins in "A" school now one ET one EM...guess if I had knew the topic would come up I would have had triples just to help put an end to the controversy. 

The MM's ET's and EM's all rag on each other. MM's being knukle draggers. ET's hold the EM's back ect ect....

Do lots of research, listen to the guys on the board then sit yourself down and you will pick what is right for you! Oh and yeah the Navy will help you also!! Remeber you put togoether your wish list and they pick the rate.

Best of luck.

[SubEMNuke]

As everyone has said there is no best rate, especially if you want to work in the Nuclear or power plant community.  I am somewhat partial to the Electrical rate though, as almost all companies need some sort of electrical maintenance Technician or Supervisor, as everything runs on electricity and some electrical utilities will take you right out of the Navy and train you as an Electrical Distribution Operator or Power Dispatcher (Control Room Job in shift work like a Nuke plant). New England ISO as an example wants ex-Navy Nukes (only Electrical,Electronics or Officer Submariners) with Bachelors degrees as System Operators(Transmission or Grid Operators). To me it just seems a little more versatile in the civilian world.

[shayne]

I'm fairly certain that any of the Nuclear Navy rates are successful outside of the Navy.  It mostly depends on the individual and what you want to do.  I have seen many ex-nukes working in capacities that would be considered cross rate in the Navy. 

EWS (if it was a rating, it would be the best) is an excellent preparation for just about any job.  So regardless as what rate you end up, make the best of it by getting some college and work toward EWS quals.  Personally, as a EM, I spent almost an equal amount of time in the box (EO, TH, SRO, LR/PT) and the engineroom (Feed Control, AE->hanging out with all the MMs), so it helped me understand the entire operation of the plant, which made my quals much easier.

If I decide to get out of power plant design and get back into operations, more than likely I would move into a system operator position.

[Fermi2]

You don't need any electrical background at all to be an STO or GRid Operator. The best ones are those who have experience in the Commercial Industry whether it be at a Nuke or a Dirt Burner.

Mike

[Marlin]

You don't need any electrical background at all to be an STO or GRid Operator. The best ones are those who have experience in the Commercial Industry whether it be at a Nuke or a Dirt Burner.

Mike

So they shouldn't bother with the Navy? It's a waste of time?

[SubEMNuke]

Here is a quote from a major utilities' employment part of their web site:

Military veterans have the skills and experience that match up well with opportunities at FirstEnergy. Understanding and acknowledging your transferable skills is the first step toward a successful transition to the civilian workforce.

Serve your community as a FirstEnergy employee the same way you served your country. We have outstanding opportunities within our Energy Delivery, Power Generation, Nuclear, and Corporate Services organizations that are ideal for many levels of skill and expertise acquired during military service.

These include all engineering disciplines, Navy Nuclear, Naval Electricians and Machinists Mates, Logistics, Telecommunications, Communications, Technicians, Administrative and many other enlisted experiences. For example, Navy Nuclear or Naval Electrician's Mates offer great transferable skills for electric distribution dispatchers, generating plant operators, nuclear, or line worker positions.

They wouldn't put this statement on their web site if they didn't think ex-Nukes are superior.

[M1Ark]

I think what Mike was trying to say is that you do not need to be an electrician in the nuclear navy to be a grid operator.  Any of the rates will do.  He knows because he has personally witnessed all three rates well represented as a load dispatcher / system operator.  I've spent a shift hanging out with load dispatchers and their job is less electrical than my job as a licensed operator producing 1200 MWe.  As a matter of fact, DTE had previous HR folks and customer service folks as load dispatchers right alongside ex-navy nukes.

[Fermi2]

Here is a quote from a major utilities' employment part of their web site:

Military veterans have the skills and experience that match up well with opportunities at FirstEnergy. Understanding and acknowledging your transferable skills is the first step toward a successful transition to the civilian workforce.

Serve your community as a FirstEnergy employee the same way you served your country. We have outstanding opportunities within our Energy Delivery, Power Generation, Nuclear, and Corporate Services organizations that are ideal for many levels of skill and expertise acquired during military service.

These include all engineering disciplines, Navy Nuclear, Naval Electricians and Machinists Mates, Logistics, Telecommunications, Communications, Technicians, Administrative and many other enlisted experiences. For example, Navy Nuclear or Naval Electrician's Mates offer great transferable skills for electric distribution dispatchers, generating plant operators, nuclear, or line worker positions.

They wouldn't put this statement on their web site if they didn't think ex-Nukes are superior.

LOL wait, are you currently in the Navy or have you worked on a real reactor in the real world?

I used to help hire at my old plant and I do so at my new plant. Navy nukes are NOT superior in anyway. I'll take a deconner with 2 years commercial experience over a Navy nuke because I won't have to train them in the stuff thats really applicable to a commercial nuke. The rest is just text books and qualifying.

Oh M1Ark said it better, being an Electrician doesn't help one in any way in Load Dispatch. My guess is most the ones at TVA are not ex Navy, in fact I party with a crew from our oad Dispatch Dept and only one is ex Navy. And he was a MM.



Mike

[Marlin]

Are these comments helpful to the original poster or a mother who is interested in her sons future? Please get back on topic.

[SubEMNuke]

Don't wrestle with pigs...

Don't argue with idiots

I am sure glad that the Human Resources people at my company were disillusioned( as were several other companies I interviewed with) and hired me only because I was an ex-Nuke Electrician.  I could have just been an HR person or Call Center person at Wal-mart and got hired just as readily--LOL.

[ChiefRocscooter]

LOL wait, are you currently in the Navy or have you worked on a real reactor in the real world?

I used to help hire at my old plant and I do so at my new plant. Navy nukes are NOT superior in anyway. I'll take a deconner with 2 years commercial experience over a Navy nuke because I won't have to train them in the stuff thats really applicable to a commercial nuke. The rest is just text books and qualifying.

Oh M1Ark said it better, being an Electrician doesn't help one in any way in Load Dispatch. My guess is most the ones at TVA are not ex Navy, in fact I party with a crew from our oad Dispatch Dept and only one is ex Navy. And he was a MM.



Mike

OK I will start by saying that as a guy just walking in the door I am not truly qualified to make broad sweeping judgements about the industry but here is what I think  (for what it is worth):

Being a Navy Nuke is an advantage when trying to get hired, no if and or buts about it.  The companies I interviewed and talked to were mostly interested because I had a Navy Nuke background, would they have talked to me if I had been an army Ranger, or Navy Airdale??? Likely not!  Would they have hired a college grad over me?? (well since I have degree this is hard to say)  My guess is that once I got the interviews it was not being a Nuke that got the job, but what I said and did during the interview.  Now how much of what I said and did was influenced by my Navy background.... TONS.  But just because I was a Navy Nuke does not mean I am worth anything, it is just another factor in what make up me as a person.  I have met lots of useless Nukes that I would not hire to mow my yard, I am sure we all have.  In this same vein I have met lots of college grad engineers who are clueless and would not stand a chance against me in a job interview.  I have also met ones who I would be nervous about having to compete against.
Ok so all in all I am saying being a good "whatever you are" is the key and that being a NAVY Nuke just opens doors, it does not give you free pass or garuntee sucess!

Now as for the rating thing.. I was an ET but never fit in RC Div very well.  My two best friends were EM's (had to filp coin to pick my bestman) and I spent more time off boat with EM/MMs than ETs.  I think it would be impossible to say any one rating was better because if you fit and are good in one then it is best for you.  IN general the ET's were the "smartest" and lacked the most common sense.  The EM's were the most laid back, second smartest, and most likely to dodge work.  The MM's were hardest workers (note there is difference between hardest worker and having to work hard), and knew the steam side of the plant the best.  I would say there were one who shined at each and sucked at each rate.  And just to be clear I have met may MM's who were every bit as smart as ET's but they did not like trons cause they could not "see" them .

Mom tell your son s to be the best at what they like and it will not matter what they do!

Rob

[JsonD13]

The rate does not matter.  The best thing you could possibly do is get a stinkin' degree BEFORE you get out of the Navy.  A lot of people say they will just use their GI Bill, but in all reality only 10% of those eligible use it.  Also, I am making the assumption that you are not in the Navy yet, do not opt for the college kicker.  Take the bonus.  36,000 dollars (or whatever it is now) is plenty of money to use on a degree.  In fact, I am using it on my second Masters degree (I havent used much, maybe a quarter of that amount).  Don't let anyone knock the school you choose, just make sure it's a degree you can USE, and the school is ACCREDITED. 
But, like I said the rate does not matter.  There are benefits and downfalls of every rate in the Navy, each of them being partially unique.  Just remember in the end you really don't have a choice.

Jason

[M1Ark]

Great post, Chief!

There are also those that hated the thought of the Navy picking their destiny and selected MM as their first choice in Boot Camp.  Could they possibly be as smart as an ET but trained as an MM. 

I wonder how those folks would fare in the commercial nuclear power community?

M1Ark

[Charles U Farley]

There are also those that hated the thought of the Navy picking their destiny and selected MM as their first choice in Boot Camp.  Could they possibly be as smart as an ET but trained as an MM. 

See, now thats horses**t.  How smart are they really, if they let that make their decision for them. 

There is no class system in the enlisted rating structure, other that what we impose on ourselves.  I am tired of hearing mechanics act as if they are the red-headed stepchildren of the nuclear navy.  I am tired of ET's who think they are king of the world for no other reason than they sit in the middle of an airconditioned maneuvering.  Kidding and ribbing is one thing but this thread is seriously going down a path that pisses me off. 

The only thing that makes one rating take precedence over another is the needs of the navy.  If the navy needs mechanics, despite whatever cognitive aptitude you think you may have, you are going to be a mechanic.  And likewise for electricians and ET's.

Whatever your rating is doesn't make you one up on someone else.  Yes, you can train a houseplant to operate a nuclear reactor.  Much to my chagrin, I prove that everyday.  Regardless of rate, I wouldn't place many of these kids, officer or enlisted, on any pedestal, whatsoever. 

So, to all those that are thinking of enlisting:  Apply for whatever you think suits your interests.  The navy, regardless of your input, will decide if your interests run parallel to theirs.  As for "real" world transitioning, as has been said multiple times, get as much cross rate training regardless of what your rate is.  You'll be successfull no matter what.

[Roll Tide]

Personally I don't think that any ET around could beat me at Rx Theory. 

You may be more correct than you think. The Navy Reactor Operators deal with U-235 almost exclusively, due to the enrichment levels. When you start out with a commercial fuel bundle, it is 95% U-238. You end up with large percentages of your power / reactivity due to isotopes other than U-235. I have found myself explaining commercial Rx theory to most former ET Navy Nukes I have worked with, because they didn't pay attention in commercial class on the subject. After all, they already knew it. 

[navytwinmom]

Well Homer as you can see no shortage of options on this one!! but to get back to your question.....looks like no matter what you pick or gets picked for you they all have application in the "real world".

on a personal note....as a mom it is my option to kick the living stuffing out of my ET and/or EM if I ever hear on of them speaking like they are better than the other or for that matter better than anyone else.....no matter what rate they are, If all the Navy had was ET's or EM's or MM's or anything else for that matter we would not have the greatest Navy in the world.

The fine young men and women that have signed up to protect and serve deserve from all the respect and appriciation we can throw their way.

ok steping off my soap box  

I have found myself explaining commercial Rx theory to most former ET Navy Nukes

I will make sure my ET pays attention!!

Best Wishs

[Marlin]

Navytwinmom,
   Aptitude in a rating has a lot to do with the selection process. I had the highest scores of anyone processing in with me almost across the board. Two others were selected for ET and I got MM but then their mechanical and spatial relationships were on the low side. I found that later it was also easier for the mechanics to qualify on the senior enlisted watch stations probably for the same reason, the overall plant operation is more reactor theory and mechanics or heat transfer and fluid flow. As far as intelligence your sons would not have gotten in without being well above average on their test scores, the Navy does not like to waste their money and standards are set high to help guarantee a high percentage of success. The EM and ET ratings seem to open more doors on the outside other than just Nuke that is one advantage I see in their rates. In a couple of years they will have become "Old Salts" and I think you will like the changes you see in them.

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/navy/l/blnukeschool.htm