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Offline UncaBuffalo

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Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« on: Feb 01, 2008, 07:54 »
I've seen this phrase in a couple of Bartlett communications recently...can someone tell me what it means?  Thanks.
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Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #1 on: Feb 01, 2008, 08:17 »
My interpertation of this is tha Bartlett is creating the illusion that the progression from deconner to ALARA Engineer is somehow natural, and not a product of the old-boy practice of rewarding the loyal employee by promoting him or her to a higher paying job.  (We all know how it works:  "Just work this one more outage for me as a ..... and I'll get you in as a ..... at ........")  Actually, it was always more like keeping them loyal by promising them a move up.

Hey, deconning is a hard job.  Sometimes, to get someone to stick with it, you have to give them a reason.  You have to promise some upward mobility.  This does not mean that there is any such thing as a "pipeline".  What it means is that nuke plants need deconners, deconners see RP's making more money and sweating less, and the implied promise is always that if you work hard as a deconner you will be an RP.

This is the same as saying that if you do a really good job at picking up those towels and jockstraps, you will someday be the person who fills the Gatorade.  Do a good job at that, and we might put you in at Wide Receiver a few times.  Eventually, you will be Head Coach.  But, if you ever want to lift the Lombardi Trophy over your head on the cover of SI, you gotta wash those socks and jocks for one more season.

I will reiterate for the zillionth time that many of the best technicians I have ever been provileged to work with got into the game as deconners.  But, in my opinion this is the result of their own individual desire to better their station in life along with the ability to learn the job.  They saw a better job than the one they had; they learned it.  This does not mean that you need to be a deconner to be an RP.  The fact is that most of the ex-deconner RP's that you find in the business were wasting their time as deconners in the first place, and should have started off as Junior RP's.

I also note the interjection of the word "safety", which has significance to me.  As many have noticed, there are a number of former RP's who have made the career switch to EH&S positions (myself included) and bettered their incomes, working conditions, and professional development.  Naturally, this has caused a lot of techs to consider making such a move themselves.

Enter the NEW BARTLETT!!!!  Now comes Big Blue to offer a "total package" to the utilities of combination RP and EH&S services.  I wish them luck and welcome them to the exciting world of industrial safety.  It should be considered, however, that we who left the employ of Bartlett for greener pastures didn't just become wealthy on the spot as the result of switching from a purple hat to a green one, but that the name of the company stencilled on the front of the hat may have made all the difference.

I have to be up front and remind all that I am working for a competitor to Bartlett.  Like Bartlett, I recognize that a good RP can be a good EHS specialist.  In fact, I intend to hire as many of them as I possibly can.

Why am I on this like a hobo on a hot dog?  Well, perhaps it is because I think it is terribly BAD FORM to show up at a site where your competitor has the contract and start holding meetings with their employees.  Recruiting them in-person, over the phone, by email, by advertisement, or just networking are all acceptable ways to attract employees away from the competition.  But, renting a room right outside the gate to give a wholesale sales pitch is just a little unsophisticated.  I hope they realize before it is too late that the competitor they are targeting this time is not tiny Numanco from Tulsa.  This one is as big as a whale, and can hurt them bad if they decide to strike back.  The meetings at the casino by Prairie Island are a low-class move, and Bartlett would HATE it if somebody did that at one of their sites.  It would not take a vivid imagination to picture a Bartlett Site Coordinator taking names at the door of such a meeting if Rock Nelson or I were having one outside the gate at Limerick.

You want to attract employees?  Try treating them like people and paying them what they are worth.
« Last Edit: Feb 01, 2008, 11:15 by BeerCourt »
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Marvin

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #2 on: Feb 02, 2008, 07:36 »
Beercourt, you said a mouthful in one very lucid, well informed post.  It's good to see stuff like this.  Reminds me that we live in a great place where we can speak our minds without the fear of big brother smacking us around.  Well said.

duke99301

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #3 on: Feb 02, 2008, 08:31 »
If you can work hard you can move up is what I see! And there are those who have why dash someones dreams?

Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #4 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:25 »
Who's dashing dreams?  There is no correlation at all between being an RP and being a deconner.  If you have the stuff to be an RP, why should you let them make you push a mop for two years first?  On the other hand, if you happen to be an excellent deconner, why should you wait until you are not doing that anymore before you get good money?  The reward for being good at your job should be good pay and benefits for doing it - NOT the promise that you will someday get a different job as long as you don't make us mad.

All this BS about "career development" means that they will help you pass the NEU/NUF exam when you need to, and they'll dangle a carrot in front of you just as they have always done.  Now, go be a good little deconner, and maybe we will let you doserate your own trash bags (and count half your time as junior time so that you will be a Senior RPT sooner without any training at all).
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Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #5 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:44 »
Dosimetry 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Respiratory protection 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Counting room 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Control point 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Laundry monitoring  12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Decontamination 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
General Employee Trng 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
HP Tech training  50% x 2 yrs = 12 mos


http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html
« Last Edit: Feb 02, 2008, 10:45 by Rennhack »

Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #6 on: Feb 02, 2008, 01:25 »
They have - of course -used loopholes in the past, such as the Junior/Deconner designation, where your time counts 50% instead of 25% because you were a JR RP "half" of the time.
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Offline Marlin

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #7 on: Feb 02, 2008, 02:40 »
Dosimetry 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Respiratory protection 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Counting room 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Control point 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Laundry monitoring  12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Decontamination 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
General Employee Trng 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
HP Tech training  50% x 2 yrs = 12 mos


http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html
They have - of course -used loopholes in the past, such as the Junior/Deconner designation, where your time counts 50% instead of 25% because you were a JR RP "half" of the time.

Creative resumes, nepotism, the good old boy network, and interpretation of requirements have circumvented these "guide lines" as long as I can remember. The license holder or Radiation Protection program define a tech. This definition is part of the contract for tech support and can change from one outage to the next depending on facility needs.

Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #8 on: Feb 02, 2008, 03:00 »
Creative resumes, nepotism, the good old boy network, and interpretation of requirements have circumvented these "guide lines" as long as I can remember. The license holder or Radiation Protection program define a tech. This definition is part of the contract for tech support and can change from one outage to the next depending on facility needs.

The NRC reviews resumes during audits.  The site can accept anyone at "Sr HP" pay, and call them a Sr HP. - That dosen't mean they are one.

When I was at Ft Calhoun as an 18.1 (everyone remember I was a deconner for 6 years, and a Jr RP for a short time).  The NRC accepted my time, and agree'd that I was a Sr Tech, but there were one or two others at the site that didn't pass muster.

I am quoting the guidelines that Jerry Hyatt of Bartlett published Sept 1988 in the RPM journal, and has been accepted as the indusatries guidance since.
http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html

I'll be honest with you, I thougth it was 2 for 1 up to 3 months.

By the way, I googled "ANSI 3.1", and guess what came up #1??
http://www.google.com/search?q=ansi+3%2e1
« Last Edit: Feb 02, 2008, 03:03 by Rennhack »

Offline G-reg

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #9 on: Feb 02, 2008, 04:20 »
By the way, I googled "ANSI 3.1", and guess what came up #1??
http://www.google.com/search?q=ansi+3%2e1

Next thing you know, the NRC is going to be calling you:
"Hey, Mike, we got this problem we can't figure out, and we were hoping you could help us out..."

 :) :) :)
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Offline Marlin

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #10 on: Feb 02, 2008, 04:30 »
The NRC reviews resumes during audits.  The site can accept anyone at "Sr HP" pay, and call them a Sr HP. - That dosen't mean they are one.

When I was at Ft Calhoun as an 18.1 (everyone remember I was a deconner for 6 years, and a Jr RP for a short time).  The NRC accepted my time, and agree'd that I was a Sr Tech, but there were one or two others at the site that didn't pass muster.

I am quoting the guidelines that Jerry Hyatt of Bartlett published Sept 1988 in the RPM journal, and has been accepted as the indusatries guidance since.
http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html

I'll be honest with you, I thougth it was 2 for 1 up to 3 months.

By the way, I googled "ANSI 3.1", and guess what came up #1??
http://www.google.com/search?q=ansi+3%2e1

Ok? What's your point, I don't see any points of contention or are you just restating it in a different way?

Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #11 on: Feb 02, 2008, 08:55 »
Ok? What's your point, I don't see any points of contention or are you just restating it in a different way?

Troy said that you would get 1 yr HP credit for 2 years of decon, and it is just not so.  I don't care who's nephew you are.  How could he possibly have 7 more karma than me, when he gives out that kind of advice?  ;)

Offline SloGlo

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #12 on: Feb 02, 2008, 09:43 »
3.1 requirements suck since they threw out the 3 years experience at an operating commercial nuclear power plant.  imho.
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Offline Shawnee Man

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #13 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:00 »
How could he possibly have 7 more karma than me, when he gives out that kind of advice? 

Probably the same reason that Marlin has 8 more than you.

Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #14 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:47 »
3.1 requirements suck since they threw out the 3 years experience at an operating commercial nuclear power plant.  imho.

It NEVER EVER said that.

Quote
ANSI/ANS 3.1-1978 (Section 4.5.2), as follows: Technicians shall have three years of working experience in their specialty of which one year should be related technical training. They should possess a high degree of manual dexterity and ability and should be capable of learning and applying basic skills.

Quote
ANSI/ANS 3.1-1987 includes qualification criteria specifically for "Radiation Protection " (Section 4.5.3.2), which are itemized as follows:

Education: High School Diploma
Experience: Minimum experience for this position:

  • Radiation Protection which shall include: 2 years
  • Nuclear Power Plant 1 years
  • On site 3 months

I never really understood the 'onsite 3 months' thing...

Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #15 on: Feb 02, 2008, 11:03 »
Probably the same reason that Marlin has 8 more than you.

What are you smoking?  Marlin has 816, I have 1260.

Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #16 on: Feb 03, 2008, 01:19 »
Troy said that you would get 1 yr HP credit for 2 years of decon, and it is just not so.  I don't care who's nephew you are.  How could he possibly have 7 more karma than me, when he gives out that kind of advice?  ;)

I didn't actually say that.  I was referring to the practice that has arisen in the past 6 or 7 years of giving deconners Junior RP time (which is not limited) because they use dose rate meters when they pick up the bags of laundry and trash.  Since their job only entails "junior" work part of the time, they get half the credit that they would if they were actually Junior RP's.  But, since Junior time has no limit, a junior/deconner could get 1 year of junior time in two years.
However, not all plants allow deconners to dose-rate their bags and have no such designation as a junior/deconner.
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Offline Brett LaVigne

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #17 on: Feb 03, 2008, 01:41 »
What are you smoking?  Marlin has 816, I have 1260.

Man...you guys care way too much about what others think of you. Popularity does not necessarily = acurate. Anyway, it isn't about who has the most Karma total points, it is about who has the most Karma points in relation to their total posts...isn't it?

...110+%!!!!! Guess I am living proof that this Karma thing doesn't really matter ;)
« Last Edit: Feb 03, 2008, 01:43 by Bat Man »
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RAD-GHOST

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #18 on: Feb 03, 2008, 06:08 »
BC,

That is simply business as usual for the New and Improved Holding Company!  I was rather surprised to see Mr. Hiatt on the marquee, but from a realist perspective they couldn't send anyone else!  You have to remember the large majority of meetings between the Staff and Management are a paid venue, which translates to a Captive Audience!  How else could they keep techs in their seats when some of those Industry Icons take the stage, especially once they open their mouths!

Pipeline or Pipe Dream?

Actually they are becoming the Pipeline for Pipe Dreams.  Not that I would be privileged to any inside information, but next thing you know they will be implementing a computer program to conveniently arrange there staffing venue, which just might includes a logistics feature, so don't be surprised when your buddy's offered a job somewhere and you aren't!  You've been to that site 6X, sorry their staffed!  Seems like a pretty easy thing to create, pop a name up on the computer, check the site staff numbers and only offer what THEY want, not what YOU want!  I'm sure it will also include all those neat and sweet evaluations, hopefully you'll make the "A" list!  Imagine how an employer could manipulate employee’s opportunities if they incorporated their previous payroll records, "What they make vs. What they'll take"!  I know, that would be utterly ridiculous, who would think of such a thing? 

I know, Probably just another conspiracy theory!

RG   :-\

Offline let-it-ride

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #19 on: Feb 03, 2008, 08:15 »
One can be "promoted" anytime, for any reason!!

I once worked at Surry when on Friday a Sr. Deconner was made a Jr. HP.
After ONE week, he was made a Sr. HP.
The House people liked him and he was one of the 'good guys' at the site.

Next we can talk about all the girl friends that got Jr. and Sr. HP jobs when they could not spell HP.

Of course there are a few women that I would put my career on the line for anytime!!  BUT, they are few and far between.

SO, while we can TALK about being professional and the talk about Pipe Dreams, it always goes back to the age old and never ending 'I rub your back and you rub my....'

We can also say how unfair things are and how it SHOULD be, but I don't know of anyone that would pass up a chance to advance and give it up knowing they got it because of being friends with Bubba, etc.

What is the answer??   



RAD-GHOST

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #20 on: Feb 04, 2008, 05:08 »
Hummm, I'm starting to see a pattern.  Looks like a lot of the thread responders are currently employed by someone else!   :'(

Can They/We Possibly Survive?   :o

RG!    8)

Offline Already Gone

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #21 on: Feb 04, 2008, 06:53 »
That is a wise and astute observation.

However, I bear no malice toward Bartlett.  I still recommend them as an employer to anyone seeking RP work.

I just realize that Bartlett never did a single thing just to benefit me, and I do not believe that they are starting now.  That's fair because I/we don't go to work for them just to keep them in business - we do it for the paycheck.  Now, if/when the company and the employees start thinking like a family, things will change.

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Offline Eric_Bartlett

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #22 on: Feb 08, 2008, 05:38 »
I've seen this phrase in a couple of Bartlett communications recently...can someone tell me what it means?  Thanks.

Sorry it took me so long to reply, but I've been busy making all of Rad-Ghost's nightmares and conspiracy theories come true! 

All kidding aside below you will find what it means...

The Human Capital Crisis: What We are Doing
Addressing the Industry Shortage of Qualified Personnel with Pipeline Development
The opinions & views expressed by me are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of the company.

Offline biloxoi blues

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #23 on: Feb 08, 2008, 07:08 »
The best recruiting tool that I know of is taking care of the people who work for you already.   If the company is good the word gets out, if the company is bad the word gets out faster.  From a simple mind.

Offline Eric_Bartlett

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #24 on: Feb 08, 2008, 07:50 »
The best recruiting tool that I know of is taking care of the people who work for you already.   If the company is good the word gets out, if the company is bad the word gets out faster.  From a simple mind.

Simple, true and accurate.  Thats why I've stated again and again, if you have a problem let me know and i will do everything in my power to rectify the situation - i may not always be successful, but i will always try - after all with out all of you, we dont exist.

The opinions & views expressed by me are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of the company.

 


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