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Fermi2

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #525 on: Oct 22, 2010, 12:41 »
NNPP Director as an 8 year tour??

co60slr

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #526 on: Oct 22, 2010, 01:19 »
NNPP Director as an 8 year tour??
Section 3, Executive Order 12344:
http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/codification/executive-order/12344.html

Note that in Section 4, a Civilian appointed as the Director (e.g., Broadzilla) would have to negotiate his Salary with the DOE/DOE.  (Perhaps I spoke to soon on the earlier "pay cut" joke).
« Last Edit: Oct 22, 2010, 01:22 by Co60Slr »

Fermi2

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #527 on: Oct 22, 2010, 01:50 »
Do I negotiate on my true worth or what I believe to be my worth? :)

co60slr

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #528 on: Oct 22, 2010, 02:58 »
Do I negotiate on my true worth or what I believe to be my worth? :)
Is there a difference?  :o

Salary Negotiation Hint:  Don't call the CNO or DOE Secretary a "T-Baller". [stir]

Offline deltarho

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #529 on: Oct 22, 2010, 04:41 »
Do I negotiate on my true worth or what I believe to be my worth? :)

Do you believe in an objective, absolute moral law or a relative, subjective moral law?  Carefully answer the question Grasshopper...
The above has nothing to do with any real  or imagined person(s).  Moreover, any referenced biped(s) simulating real or imagined persons--with a pulse or not--is coincidental, as far as you know.

Offline HydroDave63

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #530 on: Oct 22, 2010, 11:40 »
Do I negotiate on my true worth or what I believe to be my worth? :)

Perhaps we should take a poll of your peers here on Nubworker? ;)

Offline Preciousblue1965

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #531 on: Oct 22, 2010, 01:09 »
Do I negotiate on my true worth or what I believe to be my worth? :)

If you go with the latter, the good news is that there is still a few BILLION dollars left in the Stimulus Fund, that ought to cover the first year or two, right? [stir] [devious] [whistle]
« Last Edit: Oct 22, 2010, 01:16 by Preciousblue1965 »
"No good deal goes unpunished"

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Offline HydroDave63

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #532 on: Oct 22, 2010, 01:24 »
Is there a difference?  :o

Salary Negotiation Hint:  Don't call the CNO or DOE Secretary a "T-Baller". [stir]

Wouldn't we just love to be a fly on the wall at his initial NR interview, perhaps off to a rocky start? ;)

Offline Gamecock

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #533 on: Oct 22, 2010, 01:48 »
Wouldn't we just love to be a fly on the wall at his initial NR interview, perhaps off to a rocky start? ;)

Pun intended???
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Offline HydroDave63

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #534 on: Oct 22, 2010, 01:51 »
Indeed :)

Fermi2

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #535 on: Oct 22, 2010, 03:45 »
Do you believe in an objective, absolute moral law or a relative, subjective moral law?  Carefully answer the question Grasshopper...

I'm an Ex ELT so what do you want the law to be?

Offline Frankie Love

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #536 on: Oct 22, 2010, 04:15 »
Quote
I'm an Ex ELT so what do you want the law to be?

That explains it! :stupidme: :stupidme: :stupidme: :stupidme:

Offline DDMurray

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #537 on: Oct 22, 2010, 06:24 »
Do I negotiate on my true worth or what I believe to be my worth? :)
Oh, you want a little something for the effort?

There'll be no money.  

« Last Edit: Oct 22, 2010, 07:30 by DDMurray »
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Fermi2

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #538 on: Oct 23, 2010, 12:56 »
LOL!

Dude we need to get together for some beer and burgers!

Offline deltarho

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #539 on: Oct 23, 2010, 07:37 »
I'm an Ex ELT so what do you want the law to be?
No matter how often or hard I try, I cannot get the dichotomous label to stick to an ELT...must be the residual coconut oil from all the slumber parties. ~(;{))
The above has nothing to do with any real  or imagined person(s).  Moreover, any referenced biped(s) simulating real or imagined persons--with a pulse or not--is coincidental, as far as you know.

Offline Jechtm

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #540 on: Oct 23, 2010, 01:24 »
I strongly disagree. The test I performed the worst on in power school was the one where I spent my time re-writing notes. The point is, everyone is different. If you're the type of guy who needs to re-write something 10x for it to stick, then go ahead and do that during your study time. Don't waste class time forcing everyone to do it when it doesn't work for everyone.
 I'm sure that the nuclear Navy would like to slow down promotion, but manning issues at the mid-upper enlisted ranks don't allow for that.

Perhaps hitting the fleet as an E-5 or being promoted to E-5 very shortly after needs to be looked at, but that is one of the selling points for people to join the nuclear pipeline in the first place.

Imdoing pretty well at Pschool  and the only time I look back to study my notes are for specific values like amu's and KE values for crap in the core. Other than that I Use quiz's, applying the knowledge needed to know for the exam and beyond is much more efficient then writing it down a bunch of times. Tried it in A school and I went from getting 3.75's to 3.4's
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M1dn1gh7

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #541 on: Jan 23, 2011, 12:23 »
i know that this topic is old but I just wanted to put my two cents in...

Im a NPTU student who has been in training for coming close to two years and most of it has been in a hold status.
1) my Prototype class is about 200 or so right now. the class behind me is even bigger and there is talk of increasing the size even more. What i find interesting is that even with an increased student population they haven't really increased the staff which makes it even more difficult to get qualled on a platform that is outdated to that in the fleet. Now, I know that it's our job to get check outs and not go DINQ however even spending more then the required 12 hours it's sometimes impossible to get them.
2) the hours program at NNPTC. I was on 35-5 hours program for most of powerschool. granted i know long hours are part of the package with this pipeline however is forcing a bunch of kids (yes i say kids cause that's effectively what we are, kids right out of high school for the most part... but i digress) to sit in a room for hours just because their test scores show that their ability to memorize and regurgitate 4.0 to a key is lacking? this rolls over to
3) physical fitness. Long hours in the Rickover is hardly conducive to a adequate fitness. maybe it was just me but all i wanted to do after frying my brain trying to memorize that the photon calculations are measured in unicorns and leprechauns. (not really but you get my point) was to go to bed and get ready to go to school the next day and not be tired.

im afraid that if i continue with this it's going to turn more into a rant and not anything positive.

edited by GC
« Last Edit: Jan 23, 2011, 08:25 by Gamecock »

Offline LT Dan

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #542 on: Jan 23, 2011, 09:32 »
i know that this topic is old but I just wanted to put my two cents in...

Im a NPTU student who has been in training for coming close to two years and most of it has been in a hold status.
1) my Prototype class is about 200 or so right now. the class behind me is even bigger and there is talk of increasing the size even more. What i find interesting is that even with an increased student population they haven't really increased the staff which makes it even more difficult to get qualled on a platform that is outdated to that in the fleet. Now, I know that it's our job to get check outs and not go DINQ however even spending more then the required 12 hours it's sometimes impossible to get them.
2) the hours program at NNPTC. I was on 35-5 hours program for most of powerschool. granted i know long hours are part of the package with this pipeline however is forcing a bunch of kids (yes i say kids cause that's effectively what we are, kids right out of high school for the most part... but i digress) to sit in a room for hours just because their test scores show that their ability to memorize and regurgitate 4.0 to a key is lacking? this rolls over to
3) physical fitness. Long hours in the Rickover is hardly conducive to a adequate fitness. maybe it was just me but all i wanted to do after frying my brain trying to memorize that the photon calculations are measured in unicorns and leprechauns. (not really but you get my point) was to go to bed and get ready to go to school the next day and not be tired.

im afraid that if i continue with this it's going to turn more into a rant and not anything positive.

edited by GC

The title of the thread is How would you fix the NNPP, not let me whine about my experiences in the training pipeline.

The fact that you were on 35-5 for the duration of Nuke School tells me a lot about you and your work ethic.  35-5, after the first few weeks, is reserved for people with poor GPA who put forth the minimum effort.  I had a friend who graduated with a 2.63 GPA, and he was on voluntary hours from the third week on.  He didn't have to be told that if he wanted to succeed that he needed to work harder then the minimum.  Sitting in a room for hours is probably a direct result of you wasting your time and not being efficient at studying.  Again, your issue.  You don't live at home any more and things aren't going to be handed to you.  Grow up, and man up.

As far as PT goes, that is part of being in the military.  If you aren't meeting the standards by working out on your own, then you get remedial to "help" you.  The standards are published for all to see, so you should know whether you need to focus attention on meeting them on your own.


Cycoticpenguin

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #543 on: Jan 24, 2011, 03:20 »
The title of the thread is How would you fix the NNPP, not let me whine about my experiences in the training pipeline.

The fact that you were on 35-5 for the duration of Nuke School tells me a lot about you and your work ethic.  35-5, after the first few weeks, is reserved for people with poor GPA who put forth the minimum effort.  I had a friend who graduated with a 2.63 GPA, and he was on voluntary hours from the third week on.  He didn't have to be told that if he wanted to succeed that he needed to work harder then the minimum.  Sitting in a room for hours is probably a direct result of you wasting your time and not being efficient at studying.  Again, your issue.  You don't live at home any more and things aren't going to be handed to you.  Grow up, and man up.

As far as PT goes, that is part of being in the military.  If you aren't meeting the standards by working out on your own, then you get remedial to "help" you.  The standards are published for all to see, so you should know whether you need to focus attention on meeting them on your own.



You're lucky my smite button has been depleted for the day. I can think of many examples of people being on high hours programs that were honestly putting in due effort. You dont know this guy, much less, you dont know his work ethic. Im not going to vouch this guy, but at the same time, for you to wantonly bash him for being on hours is ridiculous man. 

Prime example -> friend STRUGGLED in A school and power school. He was on 35-5's because of his GPA. You want to know what he did? He spent at least 50 extra hours in that building every single week. He never took a day off, and he squeaked by, barely passing. Where is he now? He's up for chief this year after being a SPU, making first class first time up, and since he's now an LPO at sea, he's a good candidate for chief.


Offline Preciousblue1965

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #544 on: Jan 24, 2011, 03:47 »
You're lucky my smite button has been depleted for the day. I can think of many examples of people being on high hours programs that were honestly putting in due effort. You dont know this guy, much less, you dont know his work ethic. Im not going to vouch this guy, but at the same time, for you to wantonly bash him for being on hours is ridiculous man. 

Prime example -> friend STRUGGLED in A school and power school. He was on 35-5's because of his GPA. You want to know what he did? He spent at least 50 extra hours in that building every single week. He never took a day off, and he squeaked by, barely passing. Where is he now? He's up for chief this year after being a SPU, making first class first time up, and since he's now an LPO at sea, he's a good candidate for chief.




I gotta agree with Lt Dan in one aspect.  This isn't the "let me complain about my experience with no input for how to correct the situation" part of the forum. 

I have gone on rants myself, but at least try to offer up a solution to the problem I was ranting about.  This particular individual only layed out his gripes about the program, with no contructive input on how to make it better.  It is true that there are all kinds in the Navy with regards to performance and work ethic in NPS and Proto.  I personally was one who put in very little hours, had a pretty decent GPA, and made First Class first time up just after my 4 year point.  I have also seen several who struggled all the way through the program and made it o the fleet to be steller operators.  However, that is less common than seeing those that struggle continue to struggle throughout their career, whereas those who excel in NPS and Proto tend to be the better operators. 

I don't agree that we should automatically bash the kid for his perceived work ethic and performance, but just complaining and not adding solutions is not why I started this thread.



"No good deal goes unpunished"

"Explain using obscene hand jestures the concept of pump laws"

I have found the cure for LIBERALISM, it is a good steady dose of REALITY!

Offline LT Dan

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #545 on: Jan 24, 2011, 03:56 »
You're lucky my smite button has been depleted for the day.
I'm lucky....really???  The fact that you exhausted all your Karma powers for the day (giving ten -K's to one person) tells me alot about you also.  Feel free to smite me tomorrow though.
I can think of many examples of people being on high hours programs that were honestly putting in due effort. You dont know this guy, much less, you dont know his work ethic. Im not going to vouch this guy, but at the same time, for you to wantonly bash him for being on hours is ridiculous man.  

Prime example -> friend STRUGGLED in A school and power school. He was on 35-5's because of his GPA. You want to know what he did? He spent at least 50 extra hours in that building every single week. He never took a day off, and he squeaked by, barely passing. Where is he now? He's up for chief this year after being a SPU, making first class first time up, and since he's now an LPO at sea, he's a good candidate for chief.

I stand by my original assessment of the OP.

BTW...I think you are full of it in regards to your friend also.  I'll double check with my friend who works at NR, but I'm fairly certain that someone who barely scraped by NNPTC would not become a SPU regardless of performance at NPTU .
« Last Edit: Jan 24, 2011, 03:58 by LT Dan »

Cycoticpenguin

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #546 on: Jan 24, 2011, 04:58 »
It's a close one,....

IIRC, back when he was known as CycoticPenguin, Charlie spent about 5 months on medical hold in the pipeline before NPTU, that's gonna make his NPS friend about a six, maybe seven year Chief candidate at best.

Now this friend could have been prior service, or originated somewhere other than the typical nuke pipeline pathway. But, barring something dam special it seems a bit of a stretch. We might need more details to nod in common agreement.

Or not,.... [coffee]

nope, 6 years, up for chief. whether he gets it or not, thats another story, but he's lined up well.


I'm lucky....really???  The fact that you exhausted all your Karma powers for the day (giving ten -K's to one person) tells me alot about you also.  Feel free to smite me tomorrow though.
I stand by my original assessment of the OP.

BTW...I think you are full of it in regards to your friend also.  I'll double check with my friend who works at NR, but I'm fairly certain that someone who barely scraped by NNPTC would not become a SPU regardless of performance at NPTU .

go for it dude. I can give you his contact information if you want to check for yourself.


edit: I will have forgotten about this by tomorrow. I have a cheating wife I have to deal with now, so pardon my rudeness for the next day or so.
« Last Edit: Jan 24, 2011, 04:58 by Charlie Murphy »

Offline HydroDave63

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #547 on: Jan 24, 2011, 05:13 »
Prime example -> friend STRUGGLED in A school and power school. He was on 35-5's because of his GPA. You want to know what he did? He spent at least 50 extra hours in that building every single week. He never took a day off, and he squeaked by, barely passing. Where is he now? He's up for chief this year after being a SPU, making first class first time up, and since he's now an LPO at sea, he's a good candidate for chief.

Actually, your friend is a good positive example of why the "old school" approach works. He was behind the curve, he worked damn hard, increased his skills, enhanced his reputation and as a result is likely to get promoted well ahead of his peers. I'm not seeing the problem here.

Fermi2

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #548 on: Jan 24, 2011, 11:43 »
I'm lucky....really???  The fact that you exhausted all your Karma powers for the day (giving ten -K's to one person) tells me alot about you also.  Feel free to smite me tomorrow though.
I stand by my original assessment of the OP.

BTW...I think you are full of it in regards to your friend also.  I'll double check with my friend who works at NR, but I'm fairly certain that someone who barely scraped by NNPTC would not become a SPU regardless of performance at NPTU .

Incorrect. In my class we had a guy who was on maximum mando which was really beside the point as he was putting in nearly 60-70 hours a week on his own. He ended up being the Anchorman in or class with almost exactly a 2.5 average. Everyone in the entire class admired the heck out of Robbie and I know after our comp exams he might have been the drunkest sailor in Florida for all the beers we bought him. Anyhow Robbie was a classic example of a guy who knew what it would take for him to make it through the program and he went out and did it. He literally tore Prototype to Shreds and ended up being a SPU. I know because I proudly served with him at Nuke School and NPTU.

Again my solution, put me in charge.

Cycoticpenguin

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Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #549 on: Jan 25, 2011, 05:40 »
Chief eligible in 6 years?!?!?,...wow!! I did not think that was possible. I always thought you could test at seven and get paid at eight earliest.

Then again,....
I have not been in for over twenty years and am not really sure why,......I,.......care,........  :P


My A-School instructor (MMC Reneau) made chief in 5 years 8 months. One of our electrician masterchiefs was pinned master chief some time during his 11 year point. My old chief made it around 7 years. Its not common, no, but its definitely possible.

Incorrect. In my class we had a guy who was on maximum mando which was really beside the point as he was putting in nearly 60-70 hours a week on his own. He ended up being the Anchorman in or class with almost exactly a 2.5 average. Everyone in the entire class admired the heck out of Robbie and I know after our comp exams he might have been the drunkest sailor in Florida for all the beers we bought him. Anyhow Robbie was a classic example of a guy who knew what it would take for him to make it through the program and he went out and did it. He literally tore Prototype to Shreds and ended up being a SPU. I know because I proudly served with him at Nuke School and NPTU.

Again my solution, put me in charge.

Yeah my buddy was doing 50-60 hours a week before he even got put on hours. Him and this other dude that just couldnt hack it were basically competing for the "I am trying the hardest" competition, and everyone actually pulled together to get them through. The other guy just couldnt hang with it after a while, and ended up getting converted to ET or something like that.


 


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