Subs and School

[dan11]

How is it pursuing your BA on a sub? Is it even possible with limited/no internet access?

If so, how long does it usually take?

Thanks in advance! This site has been really helpful unlike many of my recruiters.

[arduousartifice]

It is possible, after you are fully qualified, but it is not easy.  PACE courses can be taken underway, and they're coordinated through the boat, so you can take one or two (if you're really motivated) at a time for as long as you want.  Thomas Edison makes it relatively easy to get their BSAST in Nuclear Engineering Technology; they require you take 18 credits through them, but they work with PACE, so you can get those credits easily enough.  If you don't take PACE courses, correspondance courses that don't require online participation (Guided Study at Thomas Edison) are your best bet.  You can arrange with your instructors to deliver assignments in a batch when you pull in, or submit them via email, since you can send and recieve email underway.  As far as time required to finish your degree, that depends on your rate, your previous college credit, and how many courses you are able to handle at a time.  Free time on submarines is limited at best.  Also, the first half of a shipyard period can be really helpful for finishing a degree, the second half of shipyard will not be.  But the real key is you.  If you want it, you can find the time and the tools to finish your degree.

[dan11]

dang is this an unrealistic goal for a MM on sub duty?

[withroaj]

dang is this an unrealistic goal for a MM on sub duty?

Not at all if your boat goes into an extended availability and you are willing to sacrifice some time.  The guy arduousartifice who responded to your question got his on sub duty.  He was my roommate in the shipyard.  Expect to spend a few hours a night or ALL of your weekends reading and doing homework.  PACE courses can be done underway, but if you aren't fully qualified you probably won't be allowed to take courses.  Remember, you don't have to get your degree while on the boat.  There's always shore duty.

[JustinHEMI05]

So in other words, yes it is unrealistic for most sub MMs.

ATQ

Justin

[dan11]

Is it possible to take classes during A school?

[withroaj]

Probably not nuclear field A school in the US Navy. 

[NukeLDO]

Is it possible to take classes during A school?

No!  A school, Power school, and prototype are all about keeping your head above water.  You'll be drinking a solid stream of knowledge from a fire hose at that time.
Get to the boat, get qualified, then get started.  CLEP exams, DANTES courses, PACE courses, and some ingenuity can get it done.  But until you get qualified, you're not going to get alot of support from the COC on outside education.

[93-383]

Is it possible to take classes during A school?

No the TA instruction clearly states TA cannot be used by those in a duty-under-instruction status

[imthehoopa]

There's always shore duty.

With that being said... What shore duty assignments are the most conducive to finishing up a degree? I'm sure that some would allow more time for classes and course work than others.

[LDO4CNO]

The vast majority of shore duty for Nuclear trained folks is teaching in the pipeline.  Either teaching "A" School, Nuclear Power School, or Prototype.  That is not to say we don't have a few guys in recruiting, PMT, Squadrons, MTT's, Detailing, Tycoms and IMA's.  These all have different opportunities.  The realist perspective is try for duty at NFAS or NPS.  These are the biggest employers of NUKE's that have good working hours. 

I would think

PMT would be first (good luck)
NFAS second
NPS third

You can get a degree at any of the above commands easily enough though.  It is remarkably easier to go to college on the toughest of shore duties as opposed to attempting it on the easiest of sea duties.  Your sea experience is crucial to you advancement though.  Cherish both.

Good Luck
JB 

[93-383]

With that being said... What shore duty assignments are the most conducive to finishing up a degree? I'm sure that some would allow more time for classes and course work than others.

Shipyards can be good but the billets are disapearing, as I understand it my billet will not be refilled when I leave next year.

[imthehoopa]

Ok.. Before I get started on this question let me say that I have done enough looking into it to know how you feel about people becoming STAR babies and that is not the direction I would like this question to be taken. Finishing my degree is a huge deal for me as it is for most incoming baby nukes, so planning ahead as to when that MAY (future shore duties, online underway, post-Navy, etc.) be accomplished eases the anxiousness a bit. Knowing my options now really helps me be more comfortable about everything.

1) It seems through other posts that now you have to STAR to become a SPU. I also see that as a SPU you have the oppurtunity to go to RPI (provided you get a billet at Ballston Spa). I have enough engineering credits to finish a Nuclear Engineering degree there in probably 1.5 years (I looked through the curriculum already). Are there any comparable degrees in Charleston (to my knowledge the closest high ranking engineering program there would be at USC)? I have a pretty high opinion of RPI as one of the schools I originally applied to.

My reason for asking is I wouldn't want to become a SPU on the basis of going ahead to get my degree and have just a 50/50 shot of actually doing that (Yes, I know that would still mean 4 years of sea duty and no, I don't know what that is going to be like til I get there.  I am aware.) even though from what I can tell that's better odds than getting most other things I want.

College isn't my only reason for looking into potentially pursuing a SPU spot. It has other its other advantages that appeal to me as well, but they aren't part of this thread.

2) If I so choose that RPI is my goal to finish my undergrad... Do I have better chance getting Ballston Spa as a SPU or sea-returnee?

3) I asked all of it in question 1 and 2 but had planned on a 3rd so I thought I'd end with this. I had a physics professor that went to RPI and he told us one of the gameday chants that I will never forget. Enjoy :

E to the X, DY, DX,
E to the X, DX.
Cosine, secant, tangent, sine
3-Point-1-4-1-5-9.
Square root, cube root, log of pi,
Dis-integrate them, R.P.I.!

[Preciousblue1965]

E to the X, DY, DX,
E to the X, DX.
Cosine, secant, tangent, sine
3-Point-1-4-1-5-9.
Square root, cube root, log of pi,
Dis-integrate them, R.P.I.!

I don't know what is scarier.  The fact that someone actually made this up or the fact that I actually understand all of it. 

But in order to address some of your questions.  I do not believe that there are any engineering schools in Chucktown.  I could be wrong. 

There are, as with all things Navy, certain advantages to being a SPU.  When your time is done, you get to talk to your detailer which means you are more likely to get orders you want ( or at least pretend you want) and since the E5 turnover rate there is so quick you tend to get the EP that much quicker, thus propelling you into the chance to make E6 that much quicker.  You go ahead and get that wonderful instructor tour at Prototype that is SOOOOO crucial to making E7 out of the way early.  Not to mention, you can get some other neat quals there that you might not get anywhere else.  Of course you will be the low man on the Totem Pole for most of your two years there.  Sorry Charlie but when it boils down to a Sea Returnee or a SPU getting to go home early on T-week well, be prepared to "flip you for it". 

If it were me, I would not plan on getting too many credits done while at Prototype.  It is just so odd a schedule to do anything meaningful.  Most of the "colleges" that work with the schedule only offer stuff like MBA's and Human Resource Degrees.  Best bet it get as many non-watch quals done as you can so you don't have to worry about them in the fleet(QAI, 3M, DC, etc) so you will have more time to do classes.  Not saying it can't be done at Prototype, but it will be a lot harder for a SPU to do it than a Sea Returnee.   

[imthehoopa]

it will be a lot harder for a SPU to do it than a Sea Returnee.   

Exactly what I wanted to know. Thanks.

[Gamecock]

I have enough engineering credits to finish a Nuclear Engineering degree there in probably 1.5 years

If you only need 1.5 years to finish your nuclear engineering degree, why aren't you finishing your degree now?


Cheers,
GC

[JustinHEMI05]

Good question GC.

And to add to Blues, yes it would be much more difficult for SPU. Although you say you could do it in 1.5 years, after your quals as staff and staff duties, you likely wouldn't be able to finish RPI in the time spent as a spu. I have known several SPUs that did get started though. Also, I believe recently RPI changed its support for the crews, but I am not positive on that or sure of what changes were made. So there are tons of variables to consider, including the fact that you may not even be considered for spu. I would recommend planning on the sure bet... the fact that you are going to sea and work around that. Trying to plan around getting or not getting spu, credit transfers, time to complete at RPI, unknown work schedules, etc will be difficult.

Justin

[imthehoopa]

If you only need 1.5 years to finish your nuclear engineering degree, why aren't you finishing your degree now?


Cheers,
GC

I should have added "Provided that any classes I need do not overlap." If I stayed at VT where the classes I need DO overlap (and they are not offered in the summer and they will not accept transfers if I took them at another school) add at least another year to that. I tried to take them anyway (they do sometimes allow people to take overlapping classes) but the professors for these particular classes told me that I was not allowed to miss their classes. In coming up with that 1.5 years I was assuming that no classes overlap and I would be able to take some classes I need in a summer. Probably assuming too much, I'm sure.

Good question GC.

And to add to Blues, yes it would be much more difficult for SPU. Although you say you could do it in 1.5 years, after your quals as staff and staff duties, you likely wouldn't be able to finish RPI in the time spent as a spu. I have known several SPUs that did get started though. Also, I believe recently RPI changed its support for the crews, but I am not positive on that or sure of what changes were made. So there are tons of variables to consider, including the fact that you may not even be considered for spu. I would recommend planning on the sure bet... the fact that you are going to sea and work around that. Trying to plan around getting or not getting spu, credit transfers, time to complete at RPI, unknown work schedules, etc will be difficult.

Justin

As with most of the things I ask, this is something that is way down the road for me (2 years or so). I'm going to finish my degree eventually "(future shore duties, online underway, post-Navy, etc.)" I was just asking about a potential way to do it. I don't think I'd want to STAR at the 2 year point anyway. It's fun to say, "I am going to make the Navy my career." but I won't commit myself with a comment like that (i'd like to, but I will wait) to that without getting sea/shore view of both ways of life. Patience seems key in this walk of life. Many of you weren't patient in deciding to "re-sell yourselves to hell" (as it's been affectionately referred to  ) and loved it. Some weren't so patient and hated it. I just need to see how I feel about it and make my decisions based on that. I'm pretty sure I'll go to sea (and because you all seem to like pointing this out... "provided I make it through the pipeline"). I'll have a sea-returnee shore duty and potentially more time in the Navy to worry about it or get out and have plenty of post-Navy GI Bill to take advantage of.

[JustinHEMI05]

I should have added "Provided that any classes I need do not overlap." If I stayed at VT where the classes I need DO overlap (and they are not offered in the summer and they will not accept transfers if I took them at another school) add at least another year to that. I tried to take them anyway (they do sometimes allow people to take overlapping classes) but the professors for these particular classes told me that I was not allowed to miss their classes. In coming up with that 1.5 years I was assuming that no classes overlap and I would be able to take some classes I need in a summer. Probably assuming too much, I'm sure.


As with most of the things I ask, this is something that is way down the road for me (2 years or so). I'm going to finish my degree eventually "(future shore duties, online underway, post-Navy, etc.)" I was just asking about a potential way to do it. I don't think I'd want to STAR at the 2 year point anyway. It's fun to say, "I am going to make the Navy my career." but I won't commit myself with a comment like that (i'd like to, but I will wait) to that without getting sea/shore view of both ways of life. Patience seems key in this walk of life. Many of you weren't patient in deciding to "re-sell yourselves to hell" (as it's been affectionately referred to  ) and loved it. Some weren't so patient and hated it. I just need to see how I feel about it and make my decisions based on that. I'm pretty sure I'll go to sea (and because you all seem to like pointing this out... "provided I make it through the pipeline"). I'll have a sea-returnee shore duty and potentially more time in the Navy to worry about it or get out and have plenty of post-Navy GI Bill to take advantage of.

Exactly, and the new GI bill is SAWEET.

Justin

[Preciousblue1965]

Sounds like you know what you are doing and what you want to do.  Just make sure you keep those in mind when making any major decision.  A lot of guys get into the Navy thinking they will do their time and get out and go to college full time.  A lot can happen in 6-8 years to where you might find yourself married with kids and have a full time job and school is only a couple of classes at night(guilty right here).  Not saying that this is a bad thing, just a fact of life.  If you prepare yourself early and keep on the path, you will find things much easier as you go.  Good luck, fair winds, and gentle seas to you. 

[NukeLDO]

Are there any comparable degrees in Charleston (to my knowledge the closest high ranking engineering program there would be at USC)?

The Citadel offers engineering courses and degrees, and no, you don't have to be enrolled as a cadet to take classes there.  BUT...they have no program that works in conjunction with the prototype schedule.  Pretty tough to make a 0930 M/W/F class when you work two weeks of dayshifts out of five.  The do offer some evening classes, but the course offering is pretty light, and certainly not enough to finish up your degree.