Swimmer qual while in Nuclear Navy??

[surfinobx]

I currently have a NUC contract and I already know that we have many many quals already, but I would like to know if it's possible for a NUC to also take the 2nd or 1st class swimming tests to qualify for rescue swimmer on board? and help would be greatly appreciated!

[Already Gone]

I can't speak to the current situation, but my first ship had about 5 or 6 qualified divers.  Two of them were ELT's.  This was a little goofy in that it put them into three divisions simultaneously.  ELT's were part of M division (EM01), but had an additional work center designation that put us also in Laboratory division (RL01).  Divers had their own division (DV01).  Essentially, the only thing different about it was that they were on three separate Preventative Maintenance Schedules at once.  Their chain of command was still through the Leading ELT, M-Div LPO, Main Propulsion Assistant, ... etc.  I think the Divers also reported collaterally to the Ship's Diving Officer - which was also a collateral duty.

The use of rescue swimmers on a fast attack was limited, since nobody went overboard while submerged, but they did suit up for the Maneuvering Watch (leaving and entering port) and were also assigned to do some maintenance over the side from time to time. 

Both of the ELT's were already qualified submariners and Engineroom Supervisors before they were allowed to attend Diver Training.  Once they completed it, they were both MM1/SS/DV.  Everybody takes swimming tests in Recruit Training.  If you can't swim, they will teach you, but if you can swim, you will test out.  Nobody graduates as a non-swimmer.  The requirement to be a rescue swimmer on a submarine is to be a qualified Navy Diver and carry the designation as such (DV).

If you want to pursue any additional training while a Navy nuke, you either have to get it guaranteed in a re-enlistment contract or do very well at your command and request it through your command.

Best of luck to you.

[surfinobx]

Alright, i've done a little bit more research on the topic and i've found that it is called a NEC or Navy Enlistment Classification.  It states, "in the Navy, enlisted personnel have a rating (such as Hospital Corpsman -- HM), which comprises their general duties. When they receive specialized training (such as a Radiation Health Technician, NEC HM-8407), they would be assigned an NEC for that skill." So in my case, it would be, lets say ET(N) as my rating, could i also have Surface Rescue Swimmer, NEC BM-0170 as a specialized skill? Meaning if a man over board were to happen, i'd suit up and go out to rescue him/her. Anyone have any knowledge on this?

[withroaj]

In boot camp you will have to at least qualify Third Class swimmer.  You will have the option to take the Second/First class swimmer tests while in recruit training.  It will become (literally) a rubber stamp in your service record.

If you are a 3353 (sub nuke ET) you can become a diver, which carries a NEC and a unique warfare pin.  If you are a 3383 (surface nuke ET) you are pretty much just a nuke.  Either way, once you get into the nuke pipeline you will have far too much to focus on to worry about swimmer quals.  This won't let up for your first three years or so in the Navy.

Navy bases DO have swimming pools, though.  If you find some free time you can swim as much as you want.

I sometimes wonder why people DEP in and start looking for the next best thing.  Navy Nuke is a pretty big pill to swallow already, in addition to the challenges of adjusting to the military lifestyle (it's a strange animal).  You might as well focus on those before you decide to branch out.  I do admire the enthusiasm, though.  Try to maintain that attitude throughout your time in the Navy and you'll do fine.

[Already Gone]

Alright, i've done a little bit more research on the topic and i've found that it is called a NEC or Navy Enlistment Classification.  It states, "in the Navy, enlisted personnel have a rating (such as Hospital Corpsman -- HM), which comprises their general duties. When they receive specialized training (such as a Radiation Health Technician, NEC HM-8407), they would be assigned an NEC for that skill." So in my case, it would be, lets say ET(N) as my rating, could i also have Surface Rescue Swimmer, NEC BM-0170 as a specialized skill? Meaning if a man over board were to happen, i'd suit up and go out to rescue him/her. Anyone have any knowledge on this?

To answer that specific question, yes.  A nuke can carry a secondary NEC.  In my example above, those two guys started with 0000.  On completion of NPTU, they carried 3355/0000 (submarine nuclear Machinist's Mate with no secondary).  Upon completion of ELT school, they changed to 3356/0000 ( submarine ELT). Both then qualified as Leading ELT, which changed them again to 3366/0000.  Then finally, after qualifying DV, they added that NEC in place of the 0000.  There are other NEC's that they could have carried if they had attended the schools.  Many nuke ET's carry a secondary, but you can only have two NEC's at any time.  Depending on your assignment (billet) you might drop one NEC in favor of another.  Your primary would still be your primary, but can change with advancement and qualification as in the example above.  Within the nuclear rates, there are NEC's specific to the ability to operate or calibrate individual pieces of equipment.  If your ship has that equipment, they will never go to sea without at least one person who has that NEC.  So, it becomes a priority to have more than one person on the crew with that skill, so the other one is free to go on leave or get sick or something.

Naturally, most NEC's are specific to one rate, but many are also open to other rates.  The ones you noted above are specific to the rates of Hospital Corpsman (HM) and Boatswain's Mate (BM).  You'd have to dig just a little deeper to find out if there are similar ones for your rate, or if those are open to rates other than HM or BM. 

The other guys here are right on the money.  You have a couple of years to go before you start striking for additional NEC's.  Remember that the needs of the Navy, starting with the needs of your command, always come first.
Your priorities will be to complete your nuclear training, get qualified, do well at your job, and seek additional training.  In that order.

[Fast Neutron]

Do you get to wear two warfare pins at the same time (youthful grin)?

[JustinHEMI05]

Yes.

Justin

[Marlin]

Just curious, when did the swimmer come into being. I have seen them in recent pictures but we never had them. When I was the ELT on Maneuvering watch I was the only one topside in a harness and lanyard until the smears I took were handed down the hatch and were determined to be clean. Typically we only had one or two qualified divers for emergancies.

[Already Gone]

Do you get to wear two warfare pins at the same time (youthful grin)?

Yes

[DDMurray]

There are several classes of divers.  SSNs have 4 authorized diver billets (i.e. they can have up to four enlisted get Diver SDAP, I think it's $150.00 per month).  There is a specific NEC for each class of diver.  I think submarine divers are First class divers.

Dive school candidates are selected by their command and are screened by the diver community to ensure they are physically qualified.  Most commands will not allow nukes to apply for Dive school until after they've completed senior-in-rate quals, but there are exceptions.  Dive school is conducted in either Pensacola or Pearl Harbor.  There was some research into eliminating "NEC" divers from submarines based on a cost-benefit analysis.  I'm not sure if that study is complete.

DM

[juggalonic]

  I am pretty sure that there are two different categories of people who get into the water as a collateral duty that are being interchanged in answers here.  There is a Navy Diver collateral duty, and there is a completely separate Rescue Swimmer collateral duty.  The Navy Diver has the already mentioned different levels and you go to the "prestigious" dive school for.  The Rescue Swimmer is a collateral duty that requires much less training and really just means that for the Maneuvering Watch you will hang out in your wetsuit and play with your Anti-Shark knife, while almost everyone else does real work, but don't worry you can still be player in the shutdown once lines are across and you are no longer needed to stand around in your wetsuit, and there is no "warfare" device for Rescue Swimming.  No real offense to the actual Rescue Swimmers out there, if for some reason I ever return to sea on anything other than a cruise ship and fall off please come save me, wait save me even if I fall of a cruise ship.

[Already Gone]

No.  We're not confusing anything.  The poster wants to be a nuke AND a rescue swimmer.  His only chance at that is to be on a submarine.  The rescue swimmers on submarines are chosen from among the handful of qualified Navy Divers assigned to the ship.  Maybe you never noticed it but there are actual Divers (who wear the pin) on every ship in the Navy, but the skimmers don't necessarily limit this duty to Divers.  As noted above, there is an NEC for Boatswain's Mates who are Rescue Swimmers.  It isn't very likely that a surface nuke is going to get in on that deal.

This issue actually points to something that isn't discussed a lot here.  With smaller crews, subs do a lot of job sharing that is not as common on the surface.  You'll have Reactor Operators and Cooks handling lines.  The First Lieutenant is likely to be the Torpedo Division LPO,  The Ship's Diving Officer (who is in charge of maintaining the ship's readiness to dive as well as supervising the divers) is probably the Weapons Officer, the Torpedo Officer, or a Chief Petty Officer in the Weapons and Deck Department.  In my time, the Damage Control Petty Officer was in charge of the movie projector, but these days (with DVD's and LCD televisions) that is probably the responsibility of someone in the NavOps Dept.  You might even find an ELT on the periscope from time to time.  With a crew of about 110, and only 90 racks or so, a fast attack tends to put to sea with as few humans as it can, so everybody does more than what is determined by that little insignia on his sleeve.  Naturally, there are qual cards for all the above.

If you really want to widen your experience at sea, subs are the way to go.  There are many opportunities to get your hands into the operation of the ship from the bridge to the anchor on a sub.

[withroaj]

...The Rescue Swimmer is a collateral duty that requires much less training and really just means that for the Maneuvering Watch you will hang out in your wetsuit and play with your Anti-Shark knife, while almost everyone else does real work...

Aw, come on now.  Let's be honest about "real work."  Are you talking about manning phones, taking logs, adjusting LO cooler outlet every once and a while, sitting on crew's mess in FFE's, or what?

Everyone knows that the only REAL WORK that takes place on the maneuvering watch is the ELT valiantly going topside to take hull swipes, and the Diver accompanying him. 

[JustinHEMI05]

No divers with me 5-9 years ago. But otherwise, his assessment about who does real work during maneuvering watch is spot on. 

Justin

[withroaj]

Maybe it was just a L-Ville thang.  Best of the Breed, what can I say?

[JustinHEMI05]

Maybe it was just a L-Ville thang.  Best of the Breed, what can I say?

Has the L-Ville ever shot missiles in two theatres on one deployment and get ridden by 60 minutes? 

Jusitn

[withroaj]

Has the L-Ville ever shot missiles in two theatres on one deployment and get ridden by 60 minutes? 

Jusitn

Was Miami (you were on Miami, right?) the first boat to shoot Tomahawks in anger?

Ok, hold on.  Before we get too deep...

Junstin's Stream

               ____
             /        \
     O    /            \
     \l/ /               \
      l /                  \
     /\                     X
withroaj's Stream
               ____
             /        \
     O    /            \
     \l/ /               \
      l /                  \
     /\                     X

Both yellow streams look even to me, I guess that means it is a draw

(Thanks, PB1965)

[Already Gone]

I never had a swimmer topside with me either, but I always got up there to take the smears long before they stationed the maneuvering watch.  On the Baltimore, we smeared right after surfacing and stationed the MW at around 2 miles.  Depending on the port, there were a few hours between those events.

Speaking of "real work", it was the divers who had to remove and install the MBT vent covers.  Not many of us had to turn wrenches underwater from our MW stations.

[DDMurray]

  I am pretty sure that there are two different categories of people who get into the water as a collateral duty that are being interchanged in answers here.  There is a Navy Diver collateral duty, and there is a completely separate Rescue Swimmer collateral duty.  The Navy Diver has the already mentioned different levels and you go to the "prestigious" dive school for.  The Rescue Swimmer is a collateral duty that requires much less training and really just means that for the Maneuvering Watch you will hang out in your wetsuit and play with your Anti-Shark knife, while almost everyone else does real work, but don't worry you can still be player in the shutdown once lines are across and you are no longer needed to stand around in your wetsuit, and there is no "warfare" device for Rescue Swimming.  No real offense to the actual Rescue Swimmers out there, if for some reason I ever return to sea on anything other than a cruise ship and fall off please come save me, wait save me even if I fall of a cruise ship.

The rescue swimmer on the maneuvering watch is one of the ship's divers who went to dive school.

[JustinHEMI05]

marssim's stream;


                                                           ____
                                                         /        \
                                                       /            \
               ________________________/               \
             /     \          \         \            \                \
     O    /         \          \         \            \                \
     \l/ /             \          \         \           /\              /\
      l /                \          \         \        /   \           /   \
     /\                     X        X        X    X      X       X      X 

that's right uh huh, uh huh,.....

Well played sir! 

Justin

[juggalonic]

No.  We're not confusing anything.  The poster wants to be a nuke AND a rescue swimmer.  His only chance at that is to be on a submarine.  The rescue swimmers on submarines are chosen from among the handful of qualified Navy Divers assigned to the ship.  Maybe you never noticed it but there are actual Divers (who wear the pin) on every ship in the Navy, but the skimmers don't necessarily limit this duty to Divers.

  Wrong.  There is a diver requirement for each boat, BUT those boats that only go in and out one port (boomers) are only required to carry the minimum, I think that it is one.  The diving on these boats is done by the diver team stationed to those bases.  The rescue swimmers on my boat were NOT divers, nothing even close, they are separate qualifications.  From navy.mil, notice no mention of a navy divers.

Making the Grade as a Navy Rescue Swimmer
Story Number: NNS090114-05
Release Date: 1/14/2009 10:59:00 AM


By Clark Pierce, Jax Air News

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. (NNS) -- The Rescue Swimmer School (RSS) at Naval Air Station Jacksonville (NAS Jax) provides rigorous training and significantly contributes to fleet readiness.

"The U.S. Navy Rescue Swimmer School (RSS) at NAS Jax impacts fleet readiness virtually around the world," said Lt. Thomas Doane, officer in charge. "Our classes are filled with Sailors from as far away as Japan, Hawaii and San Diego – and as close as Mayport and Norfolk."

RSS teaches three courses:
• CAT 1 – a four-week course for surface (ship-borne) swimmers that teaches basic lifesaving procedures and how to use lifesaving equipment. Doane explained, "Each Navy ship is required to have two qualified rescue swimmers on board before it can pull away from the pier – so our graduates are considered 'mission essential.' Their training is centered on the J-bar davit, which is the apparatus on a ship's foc'sle that lowers and raises rescue swimmers."

• CAT II – a two-week refresher course for surface and aviation rescue swimmers whose careers took them away from the water for more than a year. "Before they can come back to fill that billet again, we outfit them, make sure they're physically fit, and run them through any updated procedures," said Doane.

• Aviation SAR (search and rescue) Petty Officer Course teaches senior enlisted how to plan and document training and evaluations of rescue swimmers in their helicopter squadron or wing.

[Already Gone]

Well.  That sounds like a bit of good news for our new member. 

Still, I'll repeat the caution that nuke school and qualification comes first.  Then, use your bargaining power to get one of these schools when they put the arm on you to re-enlist.

[Cycoticpenguin]

go qualify your job before you worry about extreneous opportunities. those will come if you put the effort in.