Really thinking of taking NLO over SRO

[JustinHEMI05]

I hear ya man, hang in there!

[rlbinc]

I'd go with Exelon / Oyster Creek.
I have the dubious privilege of being both an Exelon and a Progress Energy former employee.
Exelon makes no bones about it - perform or die. They also pay you 50% more and work you twice as hard.
Progress Energy is a bit different. They hug the bottom 10% of the industry pay scale and expect top results.

So I'd follow the money. The EXC SRO position is going to pay at least twice what a PGN NLO makes.

All of them ride you like a wet horse, so have a fatter wallet when heading back to the barn.

[rlbinc]

The old adage of an "SRO born from NLOs" is better, is false.

Beg to differ. I started out as an NLO, 5 years later I got a shot at license class.
I was assigned on shift with a myriad of Instant SROs.
Can't tell you how many times an Instant SRO handed the phone across the desk when an NLO called in with a plant problem.
Why? The SRO never had the NLOs job, felt the "ROs born from NLOs" were better qualified to handle it.
Steam Jet Air Ejectors troubles, a smoking CCW Pump bearing, and HV Switching Orders were examples of hand offs I received.

Instants have had trouble on walkthroughs, because they lack in plant experience. NLOs lived in the outside the MCR environs for a sustained period. I never saw a former NLO pooch an NRC Exam Walkthrough.
Wish I could say that about Instants.

I recognize I'm Of Topic, but plant experience at the NLO level was a definite building block in my career. If you don't have it - you may not even know what you missed.

[deadspace1399]

Well thanks for the advice, I don't mind being worked hard(and being payed for it).....That seems to be the consistent report I get about Exelon, they pay well, but you must work for it which is reasonable of course...
Hopefully tomorrow I find out if I have the Instant SRO position with Oyster Creek since the class up begins June 1st.  
I interview with Progress Energy on the 29th of April for NLO and TVA has said the first week of May I can expect to interview for Instant SRO.....
I'm hoping that HR at Exelon does inform me tomorrow I intend on calling them....

As far as the NLO experience, yes I understand it will be an advantage that a few of the other people in the licensing class will have, one guy I met during the leadership assessment has been at Oyster Creek for 12 years, he is an RO born from NLO and I know I will have to work extremely hard to show my competency with people like that in the class.  

I guess the class up for Oyster Creek is intended to be split up into three groups, two students who are RO upgrades, two students who are engineers crossing over, and lastly two outsiders.  
During the leadership assessment I noticed there were only 5 of us as outsiders.  Each one from the navy.  There were two guys who were currently on a shore duty as recruiters and of those, one of them has the thomas edison degree.  There was a 6 and out navy RO who is working on his degree.  There was a 6 and out navy RO who is currently a STA in Crystal River Florida, and lastly there was myself.  
Looking at my qualifications and the fact that even my shore duty has been operating in a plant I think that gave me an advantage over the other guys EXCEPT the guy who is currently a STA and I do have the Excelsior degree.  So I am not sure what they look at as far as all that is concerned.  I felt I did well in the leadership assessment and the BMST.  The interview with the plant OM, TM and HR manager seemed to be a smooth experience.  So I guess I shall see.............

[JustinHEMI05]

Beg to differ. I started out as an NLO, 5 years later I got a shot at license class.
I was assigned on shift with a myriad of Instant SROs.
Can't tell you how many times an Instant SRO handed the phone across the desk when an NLO called in with a plant problem.
Why? The SRO never had the NLOs job, felt the "ROs born from NLOs" were better qualified to handle it.
Steam Jet Air Ejectors troubles, a smoking CCW Pump bearing, and HV Switching Orders were examples of hand offs I received.

Instants have had trouble on walkthroughs, because they lack in plant experience. NLOs lived in the outside the MCR environs for a sustained period. I never saw a former NLO pooch an NRC Exam Walkthrough.
Wish I could say that about Instants.

I recognize I'm Of Topic, but plant experience at the NLO level was a definite building block in my career. If you don't have it - you may not even know what you missed.

Good for you. Its still not necessary to the right instant. 6 months of in field experience is plenty.

[JustinHEMI05]

Yeah that is disappointing. Sorry to hear that, keep us posted.

Exelon ...

[co60slr]

So apparently I have to await until perhaps sometime in May to find out if I am accepted for the job...and yet the class up begins June 1st.  This is pretty low ass S*** because I have to move at some point and giving people two weeks to move is pretty crappy.....So I pretty much am going to take these people as a NO and move on to the other interviews

My advice is to have 4-6 job offers on the table, sit down with your family (if applicable), and make a decision on which to accept.   Give yourself some choices....think outside the box...and most of all, have fun.   It's a great time to be transitioning from military to commercial power, but some HR Reps don't see it that way.  I'll resist the temptation to go off topic there.

Getting into a licensing class is all about timing for both you and the company.  The trainee has to be on site 6 months before starting GFES.   It's even less restrictive and a faster timeline for NLO trainees.  The company doesn't want to pay you to be on site for more than 6 months...that's just additional money wasted on someone that isn't qualified.   In your case, it sounds like HR is behind the curve, (oh wait...big surprise) they're waiting for other applicants, finalizing their offers and will then send out offers to their "top 10" (or whatever).   If people tell them no, then they'll go down their list...only to find in some/most (?) cases that the applicant has accepted a job elsewhere.

If you're very aggressive in this process, then you'll be getting calls for 6-12 months after you're in your new job.  In many cases, I told the HR Rep..."I would have loved to interview with you, but you took too long to respond to my application".

Separately, other threads have chosen to bash on Instant SROs.  In fact, we should simply start an Instant/Direct SRO child board on the forum and get everyone's facts, rants, opinions in one focus area.   My challenge to those ranters will remain consistent:  (1)  If your company doesn't "like" Instant SROs or otherwise views military nukes negatively, please post the name of your company here and save everyone the heartache of trying to apply at your company, (2) If your company has a training program that doesn't get an AUO, RO, SRO ready to execute that position skillfully and professionally (recognizing the different backgrounds) than your training program needs an INPO AFI...(oh wait...that is happening already across the country), and (3) saying that all Instant SROs are "broken" based on one watchstander at one plant on one shift is not very statistically significant.  I've seen the INPO daily downloads, I've seen Navy Incident Reports...I conclude that human beings sometime make mistakes from Sub COs to AUOs.  Managing human error is a very difficult and important aspect to our industry.   So, once you hire a Navy Nuke, he/she is YOURS, not the Navy's.  If you can't grasp that concept, then you're headed down the road of TMI where a Navy Nuke was licensed into the chair after what seems to be a "familiarization course" compared to today's standards.  In short, if YOU think a licensed SRO is unqualified to stand watch than YOU have an unresolved, significant nuclear safety concern at your utility.

So bringing my lengthy post together for the original posters and others job searching:  it's a great time to transition from the NNPP especially if you have gathered the senior qualifications, experience, and maturity to be competitive in the commercial world.  If you get a chance to be an AUO (think ERS, AEA, and RT rolled into one watchstander), we all agree that "growing up" slowly is much better than the nearly impossible 18 month Direct SRO training program.  However, I'm seeing peers (20+ years Navy experience) get jobs in Operations Training, Quality Assurance, Maintenance Management, SRO Licensing, Direct Corporate Management jobs, etc. You most likely will NOT land in a geographical area of first choice, but everyone has been happy with the most important variables: job, local economy, post-Navy taxes, etc.

You need to NETWORK and most of all...have fun.  There is life after the Nuclear Navy and it's better than I expected!

Co60     

[deadspace1399]

I'm sure IF Exelon offers I will take it, but I guess my biggest frustration with the whole job process has been my interactions(Or lack there of) with HR(with most of the company's I've applied/interviewed with).....

As far as "networking" I've called a few guys I know who got out and have jobs in a few plants....one has a class up for SRO in November so I suppose if Exelon, TVA, and Crystal River(just applied) fall through I have yet another chance.

I also am interviewing in May for an engineering position that is for receipt inspection and supply.  Starts out at 76K plus overtime and the typical work schedule is Monday -Friday then the next week is Monday-Thursday.  The job is in MA...most of my co-workers say this is the job they would take, but I still feel I LOVE ops and I really want to take on the challenge of SRO now to prove to myself that I can do it.

So I am looking and trying to minimize my frustrations and keep it fun....I am not tied to locations so it certainly helps!
Thank you all for your Posts and I will keep updating....this is kinda a cool way to see the time line for a Navy Nuke getting out.

[deadspace1399]

Hmmmmmmm,.....

You know how every time you turn around the Navy is completely mucked up?!?!?!?!?

So is the rest of the world,....

LOL yea well I know the rest of the world isn't perfect but hey.....at least I don't have to go back out to sea ever again unless I want to take a cruise 

[Preciousblue1965]

Why operate a plant when you can be the one who signs off for building one?  I am finally certified to do things that even Broadzilla can't do.  It is a lot of paperwork and training, but how many people in the world get to be the final signature on a nuclear power plant?

[Gamecock]

Why operate a plant when you can be the one who signs off for building one?  I am finally certified to do things that even Broadzilla can't do.  It is a lot of paperwork and training, but how many people in the world get to be the final signature on a nuclear power plant?

Doesn't seem like you have much work right now.

[fiveeleven]

  I am finally certified to do things that even Broadzilla cant do.

After perusing this site for these many years, this my friends, is a feat equal in magnitude only to the greatest achievements, here to date, known by mankind. Understanding fission, chipping out of a trap filled with lunar sand, pulling rods on the sun, and the list goes on, bounded only by infinity. Can I get the study material you used to get this sig.? Being dink on this qual. is no longer an option.
MM2/ELT 1980-1984 USS NIMITZ CVN-68.  BOHICA

[co60slr]

Why operate a plant when you can be the one who signs off for building one?  I am finally certified to do things that even Broadzilla can't do.  It is a lot of paperwork and training, but how many people in the world get to be the final signature on a nuclear power plant?

I have no idea what this post means.   What are you certified to do?  My understanding is that the "final signature" is the one from the NRC Region on the bottom of the facility's license application.   Are you talking about a QA inspector position?  Licensing position?

It did get me contemplating/comparing to the Navy NEWCON process.   Even there, while there's an exponential number of "final signatures" on everything from welds to initial crit, I've never heard of the "ultimate final signature".  Perhaps the SECNAV's authority to Commission the vessel?

Interesting...sorry, off topic though.


Co60

[HydroDave63]

but how many people in the world get to be the final signature on a nuclear power plant?

Wouldn't that be the mail room clerk who signs for the Registered Mail from NRC with the final approval paperwork inside? 

[Preciousblue1965]

Ok for clarification purposes, when the plant is finally completed and tested, the Owner has a sheet of paper that has to be filled out called an N-3.  It basically says that all the paperwork is in order and that every component has been tested and has all the required documentation associated with it.  After the Owner signs this sheet, an certified Authorized Nuclear Inspector must countersign saying that everything is up to snuff with ASME Code.  That is the Final Signature for construction of the plant with regards to documentation.  The plant isn't considered to be certified to ASME Section III until the ANI signs off the N-3.  After that, it is all operations paperwork.

[co60slr]

Ok for clarification purposes, when the plant is finally completed and tested, the Owner has a sheet of paper that has to be filled out called an N-3.  It basically says that all the paperwork is in order and that every component has been tested and has all the required documentation associated with it.  After the Owner signs this sheet, an certified Authorized Nuclear Inspector must countersign saying that everything is up to snuff with ASME Code.  That is the Final Signature for construction of the plant with regards to documentation.  The plant isn't considered to be certified to ASME Section III until the ANI signs off the N-3.  After that, it is all operations paperwork.

Congrats on the new certification then.  I'm not familiar with the cert/training process, but many Navy QAI's have posted asking how their quals translate.  Perhaps a thread for our "Getting Out" folks on how to pursue that qual one day if desired and/or if any Navy QA experience translates to commercial?

Also, do I read in your post that Operations signs....AFTER you?   You mean....at a certain nuclear plant, a certain Shift Manager might have to sign after your "Final Signature"?   <grin>

Co60

[Preciousblue1965]

Congrats on the new certification then.  I'm not familiar with the cert/training process, but many Navy QAI's have posted asking how their quals translate.  Perhaps a thread for our "Getting Out" folks on how to pursue that qual one day if desired and/or if any Navy QA experience translates to commercial?

Also, do I read in your post that Operations signs....AFTER you?   You mean....at a certain nuclear plant, a certain Shift Manager might have to sign after your "Final Signature"?   <grin>

Co60

No, the ANI is the final signature for the N-3.  Once it is signed by the ANI then the plant is considered OK for ops as long as they have their operating license or COL.  After the plant is considered built, it falls under Section XI and the ANI has to have the I endorsement(thus ANII for inservice).  Really neat field to get into.  Learn more about welding and design of nuclear power plants every day. 

[deadspace1399]

Well I fly out to NC on Wednesday night....Thursday morning is the POSS and interview for the NLO job for Shearan Harris with Progress Energy...should be interesting....still no word yet from Exelon

[Creeker]

Good luck in New Hill...   Shearon Harris was the first place I worked when coming out of HS back in 82.  Worked for Davis Electrical, then Daniels.  I still have a belt buckle someplace that shows 2 units on it.

Now, if I were in your shoes....  As young as you are, and with the career you have ahead of you, I'd do a couple years as an NLO, then go to class.  I know, it's a short term financial sacrifice, but if you are looking to start at a plant and make a career there... Not hop about the industry, and you're looking for a warmer climate (Great lakes and beaches and mountains in NC), then take the time to build a solid foundation as an NLO.  You have a great pedigree, and the degree.  If you build your reputation as a solid NLO, you'll have no problem getting into class.  They want several things in licensed operators...  Leadership capability; calm, conservative decision making ability... and someone that they have a good degree of confidence that they will make it through class.  Being an NLO for awhile will increase your chance of success in class, teach you a lot about the plant and it's procedures which will be very useful when you're in the control room, and will build strong contacts with the operators which will be useful when you're behind the desk.

That's my 2 cents... Best of luck in your new career, wherever it takes you!

Bill

[deadspace1399]

Good luck in New Hill...   Shearon Harris was the first place I worked when coming out of HS back in 82.  Worked for Davis Electrical, then Daniels.  I still have a belt buckle someplace that shows 2 units on it.

Now, if I were in your shoes....  As young as you are, and with the career you have ahead of you, I'd do a couple years as an NLO, then go to class.  I know, it's a short term financial sacrifice, but if you are looking to start at a plant and make a career there... Not hop about the industry, and you're looking for a warmer climate (Great lakes and beaches and mountains in NC), then take the time to build a solid foundation as an NLO.  You have a great pedigree, and the degree.  If you build your reputation as a solid NLO, you'll have no problem getting into class.  They want several things in licensed operators...  Leadership capability; calm, conservative decision making ability... and someone that they have a good degree of confidence that they will make it through class.  Being an NLO for awhile will increase your chance of success in class, teach you a lot about the plant and it's procedures which will be very useful when you're in the control room, and will build strong contacts with the operators which will be useful when you're behind the desk.

That's my 2 cents... Best of luck in your new career, wherever it takes you!

Bill

I thank you for your input ....its certainly one way to look at it as a career path choice for a more solid base....We shall see what is offered and what I accept I suppose......

[deadspace1399]

Well I finished the POSS and interview today AND got the JOB offer!  Right now Progress Energy and the people at Shearan Harris have pretty much been the most straight forward...no waiting game like Exelon, and well TVA isn't returning calls on the SRO interviews....so I pretty much think this is going to be the route I take and I think when I go for RO and SRO it will make me all the better for it.

[deadspace1399]

Well I start June 1st, so I have the whole month of May to get it together....today I checked out on terminal leave and found a secret bonus...navy didn't pay me sea pay for 2 years and 2 months so I get a small kicker in pay for that!  This combined with getting the NLO job I feel great and can't wait to hit the the plant running and start preparing for RO/SRO with my NLO skills I will learn

[JustinHEMI05]

Congratulations!!!!!!!!!!

[deadspace1399]

Yea life can be such a precious gift......makes ya want to call up mom and dad and thank em....
Anyways here is how I envision myself trying to be successful in civilian power...

[cbguy]

deadspace just a word advice.  You need to consider the tax rate for the state that the job is in.

MA, NJ, NY, CA & OH are among he worst in the country.

Why would you even consider been a SRO?

Many techs make more money than you have mentioned that you were offered.  I just had an interview for a planning job and was told that with OT the low person in the department made $125 K and the top person made $200 K.

Not trying to rain on your parade but who wants all that responsibility? Besides you get to go home at night and leave the job at work.