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Offline HazMat728

Hand held rad meter compatibility?
« on: Mar 21, 2010, 08:19 »
I hope this is the right place for my first post-  I work for a fire department Haz Mat Response Team and have access to the DOE/DHS Homeland Defense Equipment Reuse program (HDER).  The problem is I don't know what many of the items are on the inventory list.  Additionally I don't know if probes and geiger counters from different manufacturers are compatible.  For example, Can a Eberline pancake probe be used on a Ludlum geiger counter?

If this isn't the appropriate web forum please steer me in the right direction.



Offline desertdog

Re: Hand held rad meter compatibility?
« Reply #1 on: Mar 21, 2010, 09:58 »
 Can a Eberline pancake probe be used on a Ludlum geiger counter?


You can interchange an Eberline pancake probe with a Ludlum counter if it was calibrated for that type of probe. 

What is the model of Ludlum?  If it is a 'smart meter', they can be calibrated for several different types of probes. 

Generally, if the meter is calibrated for a 'pancake' probe, you can interchange it with other 'pancake' probes without recalibrating the meter.


  • Guest
Re: Hand held rad meter compatibility?
« Reply #2 on: Mar 22, 2010, 09:36 »
Post your list, there are many knowledgable people on this forum that can tell you what they are and what they are used for.

Offline HazMat728

Re: Hand held rad meter compatibility?
« Reply #3 on: Mar 22, 2010, 11:12 »
We are a fire department haz mat response team in the DC area.  We have transportation, fixed site lab and irradiation facilities, research reactors, and hoax/threat response concerns.  Our mission could include locating a source, contaminated person surveys, establishing contamination boundaries, ruling out radiation involvement when dealing with other chemical and powder incidents, and investigating a point source threat.
My questions:
Which items are compatible with a Ludlum 3A or Eberline FH40G-L or our other survey meters?
Does each probe need to be calibrated with the survey meter? (If so the cost of all this calibration would kill us.)
Which items should be filed in a desk drawer? (A preliminary decision was made to no longer use the Canberra UDR 13A but I have found it to be useful especially since our only other dosimeter is the SE International and Ludlum Pen Dosimeters which measures R nor mrR.)
My haz mat unit has:

Ludlum Model 3A with a Model 43-5 and 44-9 probes,
International Medcom Radalert 50
Canberra UDR-13A (removed from service)
Eberline  FH40G-L but with no attachments. 

Our big sister haz mat vehicle has:

Eberline FH40G-L kit w/telescoping probe, FHZ 672 scintillator, FHZ 612, FHZ 742, FHZ 732 probes.   
Victoreen 290 w/pancake probe and beta probe, and Victoreen 450-B.
Ludlum Model 3A with 43-5 probe
Met One GT521 Particle Counter 
Ludlum Pen Dosimeters (measurers R nor mrR)

I have taken a few rad emergency response courses and realize we need additional equipment.

Mind you, most of this stuff was bought years ago and the troops have had little input in putting together a good survey meter kit.

I placed my first order through the HDER program and received:
Ludlum 44-9, 43-1, 43-5, 43-65, 44-40, 43-90, probes, 44-62 Sodium Iodide probe

Eberline HP210L, 260, 360 probes
Bicron PGM pancake probe, PGM pancake probe 24" extension, SPA3 Sodium Iodide probe, TPGM shielded probe
"Unknown shielded probe"
"Unknown sidewall probe"
"Unknown pancake probe"
"Unknown Sodium Iodide probe"
Victoreen 489-55 Sodium Iodide probe
Victoreen 490 Thyac III survey meter
Ludlum MHV to BNC cable
Ludlum MHV to MHV cable
This week I placed a request for the following items:
NE Technology DP6BD/E dual probe
Ludlum SPA3 Sodium Iodide probe
Ludlum C to C coaxal cable

The equipment is free to public service agencies so I requested things that I thought would work.  I can send photos of the "unknown items" to help me identify them.
Thanks for looking over my list and providing your input.

Offline RDTroja

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Re: Hand held rad meter compatibility?
« Reply #4 on: Mar 23, 2010, 07:43 »
Since you are in the DC area, another source of information that may be available to you is the Health Physics office at the National Institutes of Health (NIH.) Although it was quite a while ago (35 years) I used to go there to collect radioactive waste from their laboratories and they had a very knowledgeable HP staff (small numbers, but good people) that might be able to steer you in the right direction if you feel the need for a face-to-face with someone.

For all I know it is 100% contracted out now, but if they are doing half the work there that they used to do, they still have somebody there that might help.
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  • Guest
Re: Hand held rad meter compatibility?
« Reply #5 on: Sep 08, 2010, 01:45 »
You can mix and match detectors from other manufacturers as long as they are calibrated together and accept either C or BNC cables. You can purchase C cables with BNC ends. Inspect the detector as well making sure it has the Mylar coating is still in place. Once the Mylar coating begins to deteriorate it will experience light leak and reduce the instruments efficiency. If the probe is very old it may also have lost some of the quench gases causing poor efficiency. LND manufacturers most of the detectors they are just wrapped up in a different manufacturers probe.

If you can get the probe to pass calibration with the meter great. Otherwise purchase a 44-9 pancake probe for it.


  • Guest
Re: Hand held rad meter compatibility?
« Reply #6 on: Sep 08, 2010, 03:41 »
Another good source of info would be dept. of homeland security or DOE RAP ( rapid responce teams). The national labs so work for homeland and the rap teams are  set up for radiological emergencies. They can be contacted through individual DOE sites via the web.


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