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DukeMaster87

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Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« on: Feb 28, 2014, 11:01 »
Hi,   I did search but could not find too many posts regarding a physics degree.   I noticed for equipment operators, many of the positions require either a Navy Nuke experience, Bachelors or Associates in Engineering, Engineering Technology or related sciences.  I have applied at a few and when you get into the actual application process the requirements explicitly include physics to make it Engineering, Engineering Technology, Physics or Related Sciences.  I have Physics (B.S.) with many courses in upper level Math and Chemistry. What I don't have is experience in an operator role.  Although the positions I applied for are all either Entry Level or Trainee roles I feel like not having experience might be good since the individual companies would train me how they would want something done.


I was curious on time table.  I know it takes sometime for the recruiters to get all the information forwarded to them but its been abut a week I figure at about 2-3 weeks in they would have called you in to either invite you to take the required tests or decline you as a possibility.   Is this reasonable?  I am just nervous.  I have met the specific qualifications on the postings to at least warrant taking the tests.

Also as an aside,  I notice a lot of the positions (even the experienced ones) have rotating shifts between nights and days.  i wouldn't mind it at all,  but why do they rotate?  I know at hospitals people just either work days or nights so they can keep the same schedule.  It seems it would be more efficient that way then flip flopping everyone around all the time? 

Offline Nuclear NASCAR

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #1 on: Feb 28, 2014, 12:02 »

Also as an aside,  I notice a lot of the positions (even the experienced ones) have rotating shifts between nights and days.  i wouldn't mind it at all,  but why do they rotate?  I know at hospitals people just either work days or nights so they can keep the same schedule.  It seems it would be more efficient that way then flip flopping everyone around all the time? 

There are several reasons for the rotating schedule.  Training usually occurs on days during training weeks which can be every 5 or 6 weeks depending on your plants schedule.  Plants with Union contracts most likely have language addressing fair rotation of shifts and work. 
"There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge."

  -Bertrand Russell

Offline DelayedNeutron

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #2 on: Mar 01, 2014, 01:53 »
There are some nuke plants that are looking for college grads with no experience, but its not very common.  I would recommend applying at every nuke plant on the east coast.  Also, as for time lines, it could be 1 or 2 months before getting word to take a POSS exam, another month before an interview and then another month or two before an offer is made and then another month before starting work ( :old: ). Job postings only come up maybe once a year or every two years for some plants, so finding the right plant at the right time can be a challenge without experience.  Its basically a numbers game, if you keep applying, eventually one will be interested.  The only thing is, do you have the patience to keep putting in applications and waiting for a response...

On a lighter note, the Nuclear Navy is hiring.  :)

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #3 on: Mar 01, 2014, 08:32 »
Thank you for your insight. If what you say is true then they are false-advertising their job position by saying its entry level and only requirement is upper level courses with degree or background in navy nuke.  I'm a little surprised at how long it would take in the year 2014 with technology, the internet.  Its not like I mailed them my application.  You'd have thought I was applying for the government (that I know takes forever).

As an aside, I have seen job postings with GE for entry level and they require a PhD an 10 years experience.   I would like to think Exelon is no GE.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #4 on: Mar 01, 2014, 11:23 »
No they are not false advertising they are posting the minim requirement. Technology has nothing to do with it. Hr has to review the resumes then attempt to screen them. Those making the minimum cut are then sent to the hiring manager for his review. This person probably has an hour a week to handle this as he has more important duties. He then has to create a weighted matrix of the qualifications as to what he deems to be most important experience or education. He has to get this approved by hr to ensure he did not include discriminatory factors. Them he fills on the blanks and sees who meets his minimum requirements. Then he has to submit his proposed interview questions and grading scale to hr.
It's a million dollar investment so you have to get it right and ensure the company doesn't get sued in the process. At minimum I would have 10 spots to fill. I don't get another chance for 2 years and getting the wrong people disrupts other timelines.
Btw from what I have seen you wouldn't make my cut and I have an outstanding record for hiring the right people.

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #5 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:05 »
Thank you for the info.    Why wouldn't I make the initial cut to be contacted.  This isn't screening for the interview, this is screening to take the aptitude tests which I am confident I would pass. If the persons job title is Hiring Manager, they dont seem to spend much time on the hiring part. 

It is misleading though to have the minimum qualifications if the company knows there is no real chance of hiring someone who meets just those qualifications.  If they want experience they should state it and it would drive down the volume of applications and give the hiring manager more time to review real applicants.  Perhaps the company needs to hire another hiring manager to actually have enough time to manage the hiring. 

It shouldn't takes months and months to hire someone.  they are no obvious hurry from what I can tell if that is the pace.

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #6 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:07 »
There are several reasons for the rotating schedule.  Training usually occurs on days during training weeks which can be every 5 or 6 weeks depending on your plants schedule.  Plants with Union contracts most likely have language addressing fair rotation of shifts and work. 

Thank you for the info on the shifts.  Is there a way to side-step it.  i would rather work the night shifts.  I would think it would pay more for shift differential pay ect.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #7 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:27 »
Hiring manager is not a position it is a duty an individual performs to ensure his department hires the right people. Nukes and utilities in general post jobs knowing they won't be filled for 4 to 7 months. The process isn't meant to be convenient for you.

Strike 2 but on my scale you would be gone because you made assumptions vice asking intelligent questions to begin with.

I have been a hiring manager many times including 3 times in the past 4 months. It's something I do on my spare time not my work time and that is pretty much everyone who does it. Again the process isn't to make it easy for a snow flake it's to hire the right person.

When I do it I want to decide who goes to pre testing too because it costs up to 250 a person to test. So I will do stuff like check this forum, Facebook, Twitter to see who will screen themselves out by their attitude.

For every person I hire there are roughly 100 applicants.

Offline HydroDave63

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #8 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:31 »
When I do it I want to decide who goes to pre testing too because it costs up to 250 a person to test. So I will do stuff like check this forum, Facebook, Twitter to see who will screen themselves out by their attitude.

For every person I hire there are roughly 100 applicants.

Dude !!!  Does it pay in Bitcoin?  ;)

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #9 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:32 »
lol well not as of yet

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #10 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:42 »
Hiring manager is not a position it is a duty an individual performs to ensure his department hires the right people. Nukes and utilities in general post jobs knowing they won't be filled for 4 to 7 months. The process isn't meant to be convenient for you.

Strike 2 but on my scale you would be gone because you made assumptions vice asking intelligent questions to begin with.

I have been a hiring manager many times including 3 times in the past 4 months. It's something I do on my spare time not my work time and that is pretty much everyone who does it. Again the process isn't to make it easy for a snow flake it's to hire the right person.

When I do it I want to decide who goes to pre testing too because it costs up to 250 a person to test. So I will do stuff like check this forum, Facebook, Twitter to see who will screen themselves out by their attitude.

For every person I hire there are roughly 100 applicants.



I deactivate my facebook account and dont even use my real name on there.  I'm not that dumb.  I make sure never to put in my race or gender on any application.  I always check 'decline to disclose'.  $250 is a lot for a marginal cost of one applicant.  You would have thought they would have a standardize test similar to Acturaries and other jobs that require certain scores.

My issue is just companies take several months to decide but then want a decision from the applicant on one day notice.  Its a two way street.  I also dont understand why you cant under-negotatie wage to make it cheaper.  If I offer my labor at half the wage of the next applicant and we have similar backgrounds, it would be better for the company to hire me versus someone else.  The minimum wage is $7.25/hour.

What assumptions did I make in my opening paragraph?  All I asked was a general time table since HR people could not answer. If the issue is too many applicants make more stringent requirements.  The applicants still have to pass both tests ( the company could require a 3rd test if they wanted to).

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #11 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:49 »
There is a standardized test it costs roughly 250 to get it graded and administered. You are simply proving why I wouldn't hire you.
As for asking for tote answer in a day the last I checked you were looking for the job not me. As I said I have plenty of options. I will interview 5 guys per opening. Odds are there isn't much difference between the 12th guy I hire and the 13th who I didn't. Life isn't fair and if you want fair do not get into the utility business. It ain't fair or easy.

As for nukeworker I can legally ask you if you are registered on any websites. I can investigate you before I make the decision and you are obligated to tell me if I find out later you lied I fire you. It is that simple.

To be honest here is the pecking order

Internal candidates
Union recommendations
People residing within 60 miles of the plant
Guys who have been through the local community college training program
Navy nukes
Other vets
You

Offline HydroDave63

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #12 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:55 »
1) My issue is just companies take several months to decide but then want a decision from the applicant on one day notice. 2) Its a two way street. 3) I also dont understand why you cant under-negotatie wage to make it cheaper.  If I offer my labor at half the wage of the next applicant and we have similar backgrounds, it would be better for the company to hire me versus someone else.  The minimum wage is $7.25/hour.

Although philosophically I agree with what you say, the reality is:

1) They have internal HR processes, desired new hire billets often change from beginning to end , etc. The snap notice is unfair, but they have way more applicants than Joe Applicant has job options.

2) No, it's more like a Kit-Kat bar. Two for me, none for you. Welcome to the corporate world.

3) They have a strong union contract. The good wage that you seek derives from the same collective bargaining that says you can't undercut the wage, or change the other conditions of the contract. It is how it is.



DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #13 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:57 »
I was asking the marginal costs not the initial costs.  Why not let the applicant pay for the exams.  That is how it is in other industries.  Don't complain about the costs then not allow the applicant to pay for it.  That's the companies fault they are paying the $250/exam.    what about wages?  During the interview I could demand a lower wage to help cut costs.  If the company ignores that then they are part of the problem with determining costs.  The job of the company is to make profit, if I can do it cheaper it would be better.

Sure I am on facebook, but good luck finding me.  I am actually pretty libertarian minded and believe in the free markets,  but companies seem to ignore that.  If a companies management is weak enough to allow unions, it reflects the companies.

and the preferences should be listed on the job posting.  I never worked for the government or union, there goes my chances.   

Its not what you know, its who you know

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #14 on: Mar 01, 2014, 02:57 »
If you undercut your wage to get the job the incumbents will never sign your qual book you will. Never qualify and I will fire you. You really are not very bright are you?

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #15 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:02 »
In the nuclear industry it is what you know.
There is no such thing as being weak enough to allow unions. There is such a thing as national labor law. I am convinced someone at one time said you have to comply with that.

Like I said if I ask you if you have Facebook you have to tell me, if you don't it's easy bye.

You will pay your own way to the test but by law I cannot require you to pay for it. The great thing is guys like you validate my pre screening.

Again I could care less if you need the job. I simply care about hiring the right guy.
If you cannot decide on the job within an hour I really don't want you.
After all you applied to come into my house

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #16 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:03 »
If you undercut your wage to get the job the incumbents will never sign your qual book you will. Never qualify and I will fire you. You really are not very bright are you?

Its called economics.  If I offer my labor for a cheaper price compared to an identical applicant, it would be better financially to hire me.  There are many factors in deciding to hire someone,  but if two applicants have identical backgrounds and ablities, the cheaper one would be better to hire.  You already said it is very expensive to hire someone.  If it is made cheaper it would help.


Lower wages doesn't necessarily mean poor quality.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #17 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:08 »
No I am obligated to offer what is in the pay band not what you offer me to do the job. And as I said you do that and you won't qualify. You would get fired.

As I said I have hired guys or a long time. I wouldn't want you. Too me oriented.

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #18 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:09 »
In the nuclear industry it is what you know.
There is no such thing as being weak enough to allow unions. There is such a thing as national labor law. I am convinced someone at one time said you have to comply with that.

Like I said if I ask you if you have Facebook you have to tell me, if you don't it's easy bye.

You will pay your own way to the test but by law I cannot require you to pay for it. The great thing is guys like you validate my pre screening.

Again I could care less if you need the job. I simply care about hiring the right guy.
If you cannot decide on the job within an hour I really don't want you.
After all you applied to come into my house

I just told you I have facebook.  It is deactivated so no one can view my profile, and again it doesnt use my real name so it would be very difficult to find it to begin with.    You dont have to require that I pay for the test, but I can offer and you can accept.  If you want these specific specifications why dont you post them on the job information posts and not waste company time.  You seem to complain about the costs of hiring someone but do nothing to lower that costs.

and yes unions are a problem. there is an old saying 'unions promote mediocrity'.  If a young brass comes in and can do the job of an incumbent at half the price,  the incumbent is getting fired.  


DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #19 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:11 »
No I am obligated to offer what is in the pay band not what you offer me to do the job. And as I said you do that and you won't qualify. You would get fired.

As I said I have hired guys or a long time. I wouldn't want you. Too me oriented.

If I was 'me oriented' I would be demanding hire wages not lower wages.  Thats the fault of management that lets a union dictate wages and not the company.  Weak management

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #20 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:13 »
Nope it's called collective bargaining. It's the way of the world. You aren't a good candidate for the nuke industry. Try another. You won't get hired. No experience and nothing stands out about you.

Offline HydroDave63

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #21 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:15 »
Its called economics.  If I offer my labor for a cheaper price compared to an identical applicant, it would be better financially to hire me.  There are many factors in deciding to hire someone,  but if two applicants have identical backgrounds and ablities, the cheaper one would be better to hire.  You already said it is very expensive to hire someone.  If it is made cheaper it would help.


Lower wages doesn't necessarily mean poor quality.

Time to put down the dog-eared Atlas Shrugged and tune into the reality here.

From your first post: Although the positions I applied for are all either Entry Level or Trainee roles I feel like not having experience might be good since the individual companies would train me how they would want something done.

The first highlight is all the HR person (much less the hiring manager) would need to see to assign your application a lower priority in the stack.

The second highlight is illogical. Having no experience steepens the learning curve for the trainee. Doesn't rule out success, but diminishes the chances.

This nuclear power thing may not be a good fit....have you considered teaching science instead?

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #22 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:19 »
Nope it's called collective bargaining. It's the way of the world. You aren't a good candidate for the nuke industry. Try another. You won't get hired. No experience and nothing stands out about you.

I told you in the my first posts I had no experience that is why I applied to trainee positions.  those are designed for people like me.  If not then the classification needs to be trained. 

Like i said General Electric has job postings for entry level but then require PhD an 10 years experience.  That is not entry level.
 maybe for that company that is unionized but the laws of Economics dont change.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #23 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:20 »
Agreed I want the most experienced person I can find. The training program is light years faster paced than college with more material. I have hundreds of utility guys and ex navy guys applying. Plus many utilities are using community colleges as pre training facilities. The last class at sqn was picked purely from these guys.

His resume wouldn't make it past the first couple bullets.

Before I turn you loose in my plant get experience elsewhere.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #24 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:21 »
Because it is a trainee job. You are training a person with experience to fill a position via a TRAINING program. Btw with

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #25 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:23 »
I told you in the my first posts I had no experience that is why I applied to trainee positions.  those are designed for people like me.  If not then the classification needs to be trained. 

Like i said General Electric has job postings for entry level but then require PhD an 10 years experience.  That is not entry level.
 maybe for that company that is unionized but the laws of Economics dont change.


Atlas Shrugged????  Where that came from I do not know.  (RON PAUL 2012!)   I agree with that people with more experience would trump me in a general application contest, but these positions limit the amount experience one could have to be considered.

And yes in some fields not having experience might be beneficial.  If you know how to do something one way and have been doing it for 30 years you probably aren't going to change vs a new kid can learn the company way and would be easier to train in that way.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #26 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:23 »
Without experience ge ain't hiring you either. They have nearly the same process. I worked for quite some Time with their hiring manager. Great guy former senior reactor operator .

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #27 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:24 »
Because it is a trainee job. You are training a person with experience to fill a position via a TRAINING program. Btw with

Sounds like you should just remove the job posting for entry level and put an experience posting up.  You would get more job applicants with experience that way and less with no experience.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #28 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:25 »
The people we hire know how to do it the nuclear way. You don't hire people who can't donut the nuclear way. So your theory isn't valid snowflake

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #29 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:26 »
Without experience ge ain't hiring you either. They have nearly the same process. I worked for quite some Time with their hiring manager. Great guy former senior reactor operator .

How do you get experience if they wont even hire you at the entry level position?   If they require a PhD at the entry level, who knows what they require at the high levels...

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #30 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:27 »
Our entry level jobs require experience. This is the nuclear industry. We don't let rookies in. Entry level is just that the job required to enter the company. All industries are like this.

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #31 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:29 »
The people we hire know how to do it the nuclear way. You don't hire people who can't donut the nuclear way. So your theory isn't valid snowflake

again if you are looking for people with years of experience, dont mislead potential applicants with jobs postings containing the words 'entry level'  they are not.  it is considered 'experience' classification.  You say the problem you face is too many applicants and not enough time to go through them.  Part of that is your fault for using the wrong classifications causing the wrong people to apply.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #32 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:30 »
Join the navy. Get a job in the fossil industry. Do something besides whine here. At the current time you don't make the cut. Get a job and grow up. Get the concept of fair out of your view if life and learn the employer cares less if you need the job. Quickest way to get thrown out of my interviews is to even imply I need you.

Fermi2

  • Guest
Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #33 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:32 »
None is my fault. Nuke entry level requires experience. I have spent far too much of my day trying to explain this to a nub. My suggestion find another industry. You won't get hired in this one. Nor the one I currently work in. At least when I am the hiring manager.

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #34 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:35 »
None is my fault. Nuke entry level requires experience. I have spent far too much of my day trying to explain this to a nub. My suggestion find another industry. You won't get hired in this one. Nor the one I currently work in. At least when I am the hiring manager.

good thing I went to college, got good grades and did all that graduate work in a scientific field like everyone was telling everyone to do.....   I am just thankful to the lord that I don owe a mortgage-sized student loan like most of my peers.

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #35 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:40 »
None is my fault. Nuke entry level requires experience. I have spent far too much of my day trying to explain this to a nub. My suggestion find another industry. You won't get hired in this one. Nor the one I currently work in. At least when I am the hiring manager.

I met all the minimum qualifications and was never really being considered to begin with. thats nice   'entry level' does not equal 'experienced professional'  two different options.

Offline Broncos5

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #36 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:51 »
It sounds like you do meet the minimum qualifications.  Just keep applying.  I have a BS in Physics and hired in out of college with no navy experience, as did many NLOs in my class and now most of us are licensed.  We have a hard time finding applicants who even meet the minimum requirements at my facility.  But,  with that being said there is a push to focus on local talent to help minimize attrition. 

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #37 on: Mar 01, 2014, 03:54 »
Btw hey Dave how are ya? I have been launching a new training program that people said couldn't be launched, also am roughing out a supervisor training program and doing a confidential project that I can't discuss here. Also the Sr VP is a nuke so everything that anyone else says is impossible he says hey see if that shift manager we have can take a shot at it. Also even though I am not in generation the generation manager gives me stuff to do from time to time. So I am busy as hell man!

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #38 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:01 »
It sounds like you do meet the minimum qualifications.  Just keep applying.  I have a BS in Physics and hired in out of college with no navy experience, as did many NLOs in my class and now most of us are licensed.  We have a hard time finding applicants who even meet the minimum requirements at my facility.  But,  with that being said there is a push to focus on local talent to help minimize attrition. 

Thank you for the positive posts.  I have applied to a few positions around the country.  Travel is no problem for me (have no kids and single) neither location, I can move anywhere at my own expense.  I have taken courses in Nuclear Physics, Particle Physics ect but no hands on nuclear experience.   I'm happy to hear your success.   

Offline SpaceJustice

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #39 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:07 »
 If a companies management is weak enough to allow unions, it reflects the companies.


Have you ever worked with Union people?  I hadn't until I started my new job and (for the most part) they are extremely professional, competent individuals.  What they ask for in their contract is fair and the fact that they are a Union in terms of day to day is pretty invisible.  I don't see what your problem is with groups unionizing.

Offline SpaceJustice

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #40 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:11 »
again if you are looking for people with years of experience, dont mislead potential applicants with jobs postings containing the words 'entry level'  they are not.  it is considered 'experience' classification.  You say the problem you face is too many applicants and not enough time to go through them.  Part of that is your fault for using the wrong classifications causing the wrong people to apply.

We have people who started as janitors at my plant who worked their way up to operations.  Your pity party is really not productive.  So lets say they revise all the job postings, you're still not qualified.  Instead of wasting your time arguing how something should be vice the way it is maybe you should put in some applications somewhere else in the industry.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #41 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:12 »
Have you ever worked with Union people?  I hadn't until I started my new job and (for the most part) they are extremely professional, competent individuals.  What they ask for in their contract is fair and the fact that they are a Union in terms of day to day is pretty invisible.  I don't see what your problem is with groups unionizing.

Yeah I actually have found the Union people at all 3 utilities I have worked at to be very hard working and reasonable. The union president here has a masters in management. As a rule they hate dirtbags too.

Fermi2

  • Guest
Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #42 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:13 »
Well said Space!

Offline SpaceJustice

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #43 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:17 »
Well said Space!

Thanks.  I'm just finishing up my six months before class starts and have gotten nothing but support from the AOs/ROs in terms of clearing up questions on the systems and pushing me on level of knowledge/locations, so I've got a soft spot for those guys.  Nothing like getting a Makeup/Purification checkout from someone who's been operating that system for ~40 years.

Fermi2

  • Guest
Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #44 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:20 »
Must be a Pwr by the name of the system a B and W plant though I could he wrong.

SRO?

Offline SpaceJustice

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #45 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:23 »
Must be a Pwr by the name of the system a B and W plant though I could he wrong.

SRO?

Sure is.  And yeah, start my classes at the end of this month.

Fermi2

  • Guest
Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #46 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:24 »
I thought so. Let me guess your hpi pumps need to piggyback above 1600 pounds?

If you need any help let me know!

Offline SpaceJustice

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #47 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:35 »
Thanks, I really appreciate it!

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #48 on: Mar 01, 2014, 04:40 »
Which plant? You can PM it if you want

Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #49 on: Mar 01, 2014, 05:59 »
good thing I went to college, got good grades and did all that graduate work in a scientific field like everyone was telling everyone to do.....   I am just thankful to the lord that I don owe a mortgage-sized student loan like most of my peers.

To many degrees out there. A lot of interns in the DOE world to get a foot in the door. Unfortunately the paradigm for employment has changed, BZ is correct and not just for the nuclear industry.


What the employer wants: A track of accomplishment

This year the trend that employers are looking for is your achievements as a strategy and what you can do for them. It is no longer about how skilled you are in specific areas, are your technically savy, what kind of degree you have or certifications do not tell the employer how you will perform in the workplace.

http://www.examiner.com/article/what-the-employer-wants-a-track-of-accomplishment

GPA not best gauge of performance




http://www.dailyutahchronicle.com/index.php/gpa-not-best-gauge-of-performance/

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #50 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:16 »
We have people who started as janitors at my plant who worked their way up to operations.  Your pity party is really not productive.  So lets say they revise all the job postings, you're still not qualified.  Instead of wasting your time arguing how something should be vice the way it is maybe you should put in some applications somewhere else in the industry.

show me a link for a janitor position and I'll apply.  I'll make sure to leave off my college info so they wont say im overqualified.    if they correctly posted i wouldn't have wasted hours of my life applying to jobs I never would get, and the HR people would save hours of time looking through applicants that have no business applying to jobs.  What terms do I put into the search area for job postings if entry level requires years of experience.

companies that list New Grads section for jobs require you to still be in school for any internship.  If I put I graduated they dont want me.


As far as to the other guy about unions.  The companies that I received the most benefits in terms of vacation time, rate of pay ect weren't unionized and actually had better benefits compared to companies in the same industry that were unionized.   

If you want a union fine,  but I elect to not participate. 

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #51 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:20 »
Then you won't get employed in the nuclear or utility industry as they are nearly 100 percent union nub. Given your lack of experience at anything how can you compare union to non union jobs? Last I checked all Burger Kings were non union son

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #52 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:30 »
I agree I dont think this is the industry for me.  If someone of the people on here represent the industry I wouldn't want to work for them.  Not a welcoming group.  There are a few good comments but most offer no direction.  Nothing on how to "get the foot in the door" how to find the companies ect.  

Your right Broadzilla,  I am dumb and stupid for picking a major that seemed to make sense.

Physics = Basketweaving


DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #53 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:34 »
Then you won't get employed in the nuclear or utility industry as they are nearly 100 percent union nub. Given your lack of experience at anything how can you compare union to non union jobs? Last I checked all Burger Kings were non union son
[/quote

you are comparing a nuclear operator to burger flipper at burger king

A&P = unionized and went banckrupt
Whole Foods= Offers health insurance to even part timers vacation pay and pretty good starting pay for the industry, not unionized

There are right to work laws as well allowing you to opt out. 

Sometimes unions are good.  but the workers are paying for it.  Let me keep the money I earned and not some union boss.

I get the feeling you are someone that supports this mess called Obamacare...  Maybe Im wrong

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #54 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:37 »
I never said that and so far as being welcoming. I told you how the system worked . Most nukes know it's a tough industry. No one here is your momma or daddy nor will you get it in the industry. It's most populated by hard a**  people who don't have time for whiners like you. I did it for 30 years and had a great time then again I wasn't a whiner, my advice grow up get a thicker skin and try another industry. If you expect coddling in an industry dominated by ex military people who weren't coddled you need to try something else. What you found here is common in the industry. You got a lot of good advice but it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Now go try something else nub

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #55 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:40 »
Again you make a bad assumption because you are not a very good thinker.
Granted there are right to work states and I will tell you something. Don't join the union and the union operators will not sign your qual card: you will be out of a job in a year and won't have money.

So far as I know the utilities with unions have made plenty of money since their inception.
You honestly are not very bright are you non qual?

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #56 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:40 »
I never said that and so far as being welcoming. I told you how the system worked . Most nukes know it's a tough industry. No one here is your momma or daddy nor will you get it in the industry. It's most populated by hard a**  people who don't have time for whiners like you. I did it for 30 years and had a great time then again I wasn't a whiner, my advice grow up get a thicker skin and try another industry. If you expect coddling in an industry dominated by ex military people who weren't coddled you need to try something else. What you found here is common in the industry. You got a lot of good advice but it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Now go try something else nub

You are right.  I didn't know it would be filled with ex-military personnel.  It wouldn't have crossed my mind.  I thought it was just another private sector job.  Thanks I'll steer clear.


thanks for calling me names.  

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #57 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:43 »
Again you make a bad assumption because you are not a very good thinker.
Granted there are right to work states and I will tell you something. Don't join the union and the union operators will not sign your qual card: you will be out of a job in a year and won't have money.

So far as I know the utilities with unions have made plenty of money since their inception.
You honestly are not very bright are you non qual?

the company could make more money not unionizing.  but hey its their money to throw around.  and see they force the union on you.  Even in right to work states you dont have the right to work.  You just said they will essentially fire you (even if you are fully qualified for the job) just because you didnt sign up for the union

Sounds like the union has the company by the balls if they let that kind of practice go around.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #58 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:45 »
It is private sector dominated by former navy nukes you know guys with practical experience and know how. This honestly shows how little thought you put into posting here and the job in general. 20 minutes of searching would have revealed it us predominantly ex navy. So far as the names they are typical of what a non qual is called in the nuke world snowflake.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #59 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:49 »
You aren't qualified at all until you complete your qual book and I no one can prove they aren't helping you. It is your job to get qualified and unless you have proof.... All they have to do is tell me you don't know enough or you cannot do the job on your own. That's enough for me.

You just said non union companies have better benefits. They must be shelling out more.

Btw union power plants make just as much as non union plants. Cost of labor is not a predominant factor nub

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #60 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:51 »
You could have said that at the start, that unless you worked for the government or know someone in the union you aren't getting the job.  

Where do you suggest a Physics Major with Chemistry and Math Background search for jobs then?  Havent heard anything but 'go someplace else'


DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #61 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:54 »
You aren't qualified at all until you complete your qual book and I no one can prove they aren't helping you. It is your job to get qualified and unless you have proof.... All they have to do is tell me you don't know enough or you cannot do the job on your own. That's enough for me.

You just said non union companies have better benefits. They must be shelling out more.

Btw union power plants make just as much as non union plants. Cost of labor is not a predominant factor nub

I never said all non union companies have better benefits but I did say the ones I worked for do.   and wages are a part of the cost of hiring someone.  That is economics.   and if non union plants make just as much as union plants it sounds like the Union isn't doing their job

DukeMaster87

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #62 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:55 »
and your name calling shows a lack of maturity.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #63 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:56 »
No one said unless you know someone. I have hired hundreds of people and didn't know any of them till the interview and over half have been non military. You have a bad habit of putting your ignorance in someone else's mouth.

As for the your question. Don't know, don't care, your life not mine. I am not your parent, mentor or job aide. It was up to you to figure this out before you went down that path.
You figure it out.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #64 on: Mar 01, 2014, 06:58 »
The names I call you are the exact same ones any non qual gets called.
Unions are not there to make a company unprofitable

As I said  Burger King has no union and you have no basis for comparison

DSO

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #65 on: Mar 01, 2014, 10:22 »
Im going to have to agree with just about everything Broadzilla has said here Dukemaster. Youre attitude is one that will not enable you to make it in the nuclear industry. Right off the bat you talk about undercutting everyone elses wages and getting the job. You seem to be an authoritarian on the ethics of unions, but obvously know nothing of their merits. You have a self righteous attitude that companies are misleading in their advertisements and you are being disenfranchised. You will be like a square plug in a round hole in the nuclear industry and I believe you are just wasting your time on this forum, but are providing some time-consuming entertainment for others. Google Home Depot and Wal-Mart Manager Trainee positions----they aren't union and Im sure they would take your offer to work for less than anyone else in order to get hired.

Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #66 on: Mar 01, 2014, 10:29 »
Im going to have to agree with just about everything Broadzilla has said here Dukemaster. Youre attitude is one that will not enable you to make it in the nuclear industry. Right off the bat you talk about undercutting everyone elses wages and getting the job. You seem to be an authoritarian on the ethics of unions, but obvously know nothing of their merits. You have a self righteous attitude that companies are misleading in their advertisements and you are being disenfranchised. You will be like a square plug in a round hole in the nuclear industry and I believe you are just wasting your time on this forum, but are providing some time-consuming entertainment for others. Google Home Depot and Wal-Mart Manager Trainee positions----they aren't union and Im sure they would take your offer to work for less than anyone else in order to get hired.

DukeMaster87 is no longer a registered user on Nukeworker

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #67 on: Mar 01, 2014, 11:10 »
But the job descriptions were unfair, the testing process is unfair, the selection process is unfair, unions are unfair, his not being able to undercut the pay of his fellow workers is unfair, his degree not being of any help is unfair and he really didn't want to work with military people.

Graphic

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #68 on: Mar 02, 2014, 12:30 »
lol. Great thread. One thing about it you gotta love Broadzilla he tells it like it is, no sugarcoating.  [clap]

DSO

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #69 on: Mar 02, 2014, 12:49 »
But the job descriptions were unfair, the testing process is unfair, the selection process is unfair, unions are unfair, his not being able to undercut the pay of his fellow workers is unfair, his degree not being of any help is unfair and he really didn't want to work with military people.

BAHAHAHAHA

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #70 on: Mar 02, 2014, 10:27 »
lol. Great thread. One thing about it you gotta love Broadzilla he tells it like it is, no sugarcoating.  [clap]


I try my best :)

Offline Higgs

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #71 on: Mar 02, 2014, 10:29 »




This kid is a product of the parenting model that never corrects, always pats on head, and says "everyone is a winner." He is also a product of the college industry lie that everyone should go to college, and that everyone will have a job waiting for them afterwards.

In short, the "me" generation.

In his mind, he is entitled to everything on a golden platter. He reminds me of a couple of the "me" generation that slipped through the hiring process in our most recent NLO classes. They expect to be paid to show up to work, but if you want them to work, that's something extra.

We, as an industry, have to be on our guard with our hiring these days.


As a small aneqdote, one of these "me'ers" was on a 12 hour double day..., getting paid nearly 90/hr. I called him down for some minor clearance work and he responds "I knew you were going to do this!"

I said "Do what?"

He says "Cut into my a$$ time."

I had to count to 10 before I said "You expect me to pay you 90/hr to sit on your a$$ all f*&kin day? Go home, I'll call someone else."

He says "I was just kidding."

"Right."

 [soap]

Me'ers..., avoid them like the plague when hiring.

Justin
"How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic.” - Ted Nugent

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #72 on: Mar 02, 2014, 11:14 »




This kid is a product of the parenting model that never corrects, always pats on head, and says "everyone is a winner." He is also a product of the college industry lie that everyone should go to college, and that everyone will have a job waiting for them afterwards.

In short, the "me" generation.

In his mind, he is entitled to everything on a golden platter. He reminds me of a couple of the "me" generation that slipped through the hiring process in our most recent NLO classes. They expect to be paid to show up to work, but if you want them to work, that's something extra.

We, as an industry, have to be on our guard with our hiring these days.


As a small aneqdote, one of these "me'ers" was on a 12 hour double day..., getting paid nearly 90/hr. I called him down for some minor clearance work and he responds "I knew you were going to do this!"

I said "Do what?"

He says "Cut into my a$$ time."

I had to count to 10 before I said "You expect me to pay you 90/hr to sit on your a$$ all f*&kin day? Go home, I'll call someone else."

He says "I was just kidding."

"Right."

 [soap]

Me'ers..., avoid them like the plague when hiring.

Justin


Excellent post. Btw I owe you an email.

Offline GLW

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #73 on: Mar 02, 2014, 11:40 »

Me'ers..., avoid them like the plague when hiring.

Justin

I like 'em,....

they're gonna keep me the preferred viable option well into my 70's should I choose to be,...

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline Joe_Fission

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #74 on: Mar 02, 2014, 08:29 »
For a while I was thinking that this guy was a puppet account sent here to piss off Broadzilla  [jerry], but he really was serious. I understand some of his feelings, it is tough getting in when you are truly "entry level", but his entitled attitude was a tough one to sympathize with.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #75 on: Mar 02, 2014, 08:36 »
I actually TRIED helping him at first!

Offline SpaceJustice

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #76 on: Mar 03, 2014, 03:20 »
The thing that gets me is that with a high gpa he can probably get picked up for Nuke officer, put in five years making some good money and getting good experience, then get out and have a really good shot at getting into the industry.

Offline RadRooster

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #77 on: Mar 03, 2014, 06:15 »
I never said that and so far as being welcoming. I told you how the system worked . Most nukes know it's a tough industry. No one here is your momma or daddy nor will you get it in the industry. It's most populated by hard a**  people who don't have time for whiners like you. I did it for 30 years and had a great time then again I wasn't a whiner, my advice grow up get a thicker skin and try another industry. If you expect coddling in an industry dominated by ex military people who weren't coddled you need to try something else. What you found here is common in the industry. You got a lot of good advice but it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Now go try something else nub

It is not necessary to have been in the military or have a college degree (although either or both might help) I have neither and have been in the nuke industry for 11 years. I have worked D.O.E. and commercial, union and non union. With minor differences, all were comparable when it comes to wages and benefits. What is truly needed is thick skin and willingness to learn and get off your @$$ and work. If one was truly willing to take an entry level position I suspect they would jump some outages as a decon tech or start as a laborer. There are always postings for those jobs.  Less of an entitlement attitude also goes a long way. 

P.S. I am also the first in my family in this industry so it wasn't a favor to my uncle or anyone to hire me. 

Offline xobxdoc

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #78 on: Mar 03, 2014, 09:09 »




This kid is a product of the parenting model that never corrects, always pats on head, and says "everyone is a winner." He is also a product of the college industry lie that everyone should go to college, and that everyone will have a job waiting for them afterwards.

In short, the "me" generation.

In his mind, he is entitled to everything on a golden platter. He reminds me of a couple of the "me" generation that slipped through the hiring process in our most recent NLO classes. They expect to be paid to show up to work, but if you want them to work, that's something extra.

We, as an industry, have to be on our guard with our hiring these days.


As a small aneqdote, one of these "me'ers" was on a 12 hour double day..., getting paid nearly 90/hr. I called him down for some minor clearance work and he responds "I knew you were going to do this!"

I said "Do what?"

He says "Cut into my a$$ time."

I had to count to 10 before I said "You expect me to pay you 90/hr to sit on your a$$ all f*&kin day? Go home, I'll call someone else."

He says "I was just kidding."

"Right."

 [soap]

Me'ers..., avoid them like the plague when hiring.

Justin
Sounds like they know which buttons to press with you. Lighten up, you'll get an ulcer.

Offline Higgs

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #79 on: Mar 03, 2014, 10:38 »
No, that isn't it.

Justin
"How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic.” - Ted Nugent

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #80 on: Mar 03, 2014, 01:55 »
Bottom line he should never say anything like that to his supervisor

Offline xobxdoc

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #81 on: Mar 03, 2014, 05:08 »
I would expect maybe an Ops manager to say something like " We here at Maui Yankee Nuclear pay you blah, blah, blah. This guy is an SRO saying " I pay you". I would kid around with that senior.

Offline Higgs

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #82 on: Mar 03, 2014, 10:36 »
You don't know me, the guy, or my rapport with the guys to make assumptions.

You're wrong about this one.

Justin
"How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic.” - Ted Nugent

Offline mars88

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #83 on: Mar 04, 2014, 12:14 »
M.I.T. has an opening, and they'll train you.

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #84 on: Mar 04, 2014, 01:47 »
I would expect maybe an Ops manager to say something like " We here at Maui Yankee Nuclear pay you blah, blah, blah. This guy is an SRO saying " I pay you". I would kid around with that senior.

The SRO is my representative so I would expect him to say that...

Willy

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #85 on: Mar 04, 2014, 07:03 »
I agree, you don't joke around about stuff like that.  It only makes you look bad.   

Offline Fizziks1021

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #86 on: Mar 05, 2014, 01:05 »
I could sympathize with this guy, until he continually began beating his head against the wall with the complaints.  I have a physics degree, about a year of HP tech exp, have passed the POSS and BMST batteries, interviewed a handful of times, and am still trying to get my foot in the door.  I am 31, trying to change careers (I teach high school science), and am looking for a little guidance.  I am too old for the navy, so what's my best bet to find a key to a door?  Any advice would be appreciated.  And Broadzilla? I can take tough love, so please feel free to be brutally honest.  I am at the point where if I am spinning my wheels, I would rather move on if there is no hope.

Thanks all!

Offline GLW

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #87 on: Mar 05, 2014, 08:04 »
I could sympathize with this guy, until he continually began beating his head against the wall with the complaints.  I have a physics degree, about a year of HP tech exp, have passed the POSS and BMST batteries, interviewed a handful of times, and am still trying to get my foot in the door.  I am 31, trying to change careers (I teach high school science), and am looking for a little guidance.  I am too old for the navy, so what's my best bet to find a key to a door?  Any advice would be appreciated.  And Broadzilla? I can take tough love, so please feel free to be brutally honest.  I am at the point where if I am spinning my wheels, I would rather move on if there is no hope.

Thanks all!

check your PMs,...

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #88 on: Mar 05, 2014, 08:18 »
I could sympathize with this guy, until he continually began beating his head against the wall with the complaints.  I have a physics degree, about a year of HP tech exp, have passed the POSS and BMST batteries, interviewed a handful of times, and am still trying to get my foot in the door.  I am 31, trying to change careers (I teach high school science), and am looking for a little guidance.  I am too old for the navy, so what's my best bet to find a key to a door?  Any advice would be appreciated.  And Broadzilla? I can take tough love, so please feel free to be brutally honest.  I am at the point where if I am spinning my wheels, I would rather move on if there is no hope.

Thanks all!

Either PM or email me. I'll see if I can help.

Offline jams723

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #89 on: Mar 06, 2014, 06:31 »
I thought so. Let me guess your hpi pumps need to piggyback above 1600 pounds?

If you need any help let me know!

Wrong, at least for the B&W Plant I licensed on.....

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #90 on: Mar 06, 2014, 08:51 »
Wrong, at least for the B&W Plant I licensed on.....


Yours is an outlier. TMI has to piggy back. So does The Bess.

Offline ATLNuke

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #91 on: Mar 07, 2014, 04:53 »
I could sympathize with this guy, until he continually began beating his head against the wall with the complaints.  I have a physics degree, about a year of HP tech exp, have passed the POSS and BMST batteries, interviewed a handful of times, and am still trying to get my foot in the door.  I am 31, trying to change careers (I teach high school science), and am looking for a little guidance.  I am too old for the navy, so what's my best bet to find a key to a door?  Any advice would be appreciated.  And Broadzilla? I can take tough love, so please feel free to be brutally honest.  I am at the point where if I am spinning my wheels, I would rather move on if there is no hope.

Thanks all!

That's how I felt too. I agree with him that I think companies should cut it out by listing "entry level" jobs that require 5-10 years experience. But this dude sounded like a total prick that no one wants to work for or with.

Keep your head up and keep trying. I got hired on to a plant as an NLO with no other experience than an engineering degree, and I know there are many many other NLOs who were the same. I know a few guys who got hired straight out of a tech school with 2 year degrees. They could barely drink (legally)! And most of the guys like that were hired on recently, last 5 years or so. So it's definitely possible.

I think one of the main reasons I got hired on was because I talked about how much I wanted to get into a license class as soon as possible. Show them that you've done your research about the industry, and that not only do you really want the job that you're applying for, but that you know what it entails and why you want it. Give them reasons to believe that you'll stay on for years to come and possibly go to a license class when you can. Training operators is really expensive and takes the company a long time to recoup that investment, so they don't want people who will flee the second another job somewhere else opens up.

Offline jams723

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #92 on: Mar 07, 2014, 08:06 »

Yours is an outlier. TMI has to piggy back. So does The Bess.

Are you sure you are not thinking of LPI in piggyback mode?

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #93 on: Mar 07, 2014, 10:09 »
I never said that and so far as being welcoming. I told you how the system worked . Most nukes know it's a tough industry. No one here is your momma or daddy nor will you get it in the industry. It's most populated by hard a**  people who don't have time for whiners like you. I did it for 30 years and had a great time then again I wasn't a whiner, my advice grow up get a thicker skin and try another industry. If you expect coddling in an industry dominated by ex military people who weren't coddled you need to try something else. What you found here is common in the industry. You got a lot of good advice but it wasn't what you wanted to hear. Now go try something else nub

I have to throw a flag on the idea that the industry as a whole is a bunch of "hard a**" jerks...or is "tough".  While that may have been viewed as acceptable, and still is the norm at some plants, I think the industry as a whole has made great strides at fixing the bullying & other BS that this post seems to say is accepted and acceptable.

For most of us, the nuclear industry is a great place where we can just come in and do our jobs and never worry about the trollish attitude that this whole thread has espoused.

JMO - YMMV.

Have a great day!  :)







modified for grammar
« Last Edit: Mar 07, 2014, 11:52 by UncaBuffalo »
The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

chuckdhuff

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #94 on: Mar 07, 2014, 01:10 »
I have to throw a flag on the idea that the industry as a whole is a bunch of "hard a**" jerks...or is "tough".  While that may have been viewed as acceptable, and still is the norm at some plants, I think the industry as a whole has made great strides at fixing the bullying & other BS that this post seems to say is accepted and acceptable.

For most of us, the nuclear industry is a great place where we can just come in and do our jobs and never worry about the trollish attitude that this whole thread has espoused.

JMO - YMMV.

Have a great day!  :)







modified for grammar

I would have to agree with both of you.  People are more then willing to help you find an answer to a legitimate question, especially concerning safety, procedural adherence, or technical specifications. However, if you show an unwillingness to seek out knowledge and learn how things work and you spend your time whining about how things should be, you will not make it long in the industry. [2cents]

You do need to have thick skin and check your feelings at the gate when you come in to work.

I also think that this forum could us a BS Flag Smiley. Lately it seems like it would come in handy.

Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #95 on: Mar 07, 2014, 01:46 »
I also think that this forum could us a BS Flag Smiley. Lately it seems like it would come in handy.

Gold members do  8)

[BS]   and    [poo]
« Last Edit: Mar 07, 2014, 01:47 by Marlin »

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #96 on: Mar 07, 2014, 02:26 »

You do need to have thick skin and check your feelings at the gate when you come in to work.


I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.  Although (as I noted in my original post) there are a few outlier plants where a thick skin is needed, I still feel that most of the industry no longer tolerates the abusive types that would make a thick skin necessary.
The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #97 on: Mar 07, 2014, 03:30 »
When did I ever say abusive? Or be a jerk. I have always avoided that and yes I am a hard ass. Do it right or you will hear from me. I don't care what your excuses are and will tell you right off. Leave the butt hurt at the door. At the end of the year when they say award everyone 3% and I award you 1 because you didn't cut the snuff, don't whine. Go out and meet expectations.

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #98 on: Mar 07, 2014, 03:56 »
When did I ever say abusive? Or be a jerk. I have always avoided that and yes I am a hard ass. Do it right or you will hear from me. I don't care what your excuses are and will tell you right off. Leave the butt hurt at the door. At the end of the year when they say award everyone 3% and I award you 1 because you didn't cut the snuff, don't whine. Go out and meet expectations.

No.  Those were my words...from how I interpret what you did say...

I do understand that different parts of the country have different social norms...and that being a 'hard-a**' may not come across as 'jerk' or 'abusive' to certain people in certain plants (usually in the NE or northern MidWest.)

However, I do feel that 'hard-a**' does come across as jerk AND abusive in most of the country...and on this website.  And your playing the lots-of-us-used-to-be-military card makes me think that you realize that fact and are just trying rationalize abusive behavior.

I prefer a more professional working atmosphere where people can just go about their jobs without worrying about some 'hard-a**' harassing them...and a more professional website where new posters can ask questions without being hounded away in the first week.


« Last Edit: Mar 07, 2014, 04:08 by UncaBuffalo »
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Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #99 on: Mar 07, 2014, 04:12 »
No.  Those were my words...from how I interpret what you did say...

BZ lost his flyswatter a long time ago, his tool box is full of ball peen hammers and baby sledge hammers now.  [devious] [stir]

BZ has provided a lot of very good guidance but it takes more than a spoon full of sugar to make it go down.  [whistle]
« Last Edit: Mar 07, 2014, 06:13 by Marlin »

chuckdhuff

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #100 on: Mar 07, 2014, 04:16 »
Gold members do  8)

[BS]   and    [poo]

I'm a cheapskate.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.  Although (as I noted in my original post) there are a few outlier plants where a thick skin is needed, I still feel that most of the industry no longer tolerates the abusive types that would make a thick skin necessary.

No worries. I disagree with people often. I don't necessarily consider it abusive behavior. With the high level of pay comes a high level of expectations. Couple that with low threshold for excuses and you are going to get a no nonsense business model. Maybe it has something to do with the military mindset? Sometimes members of this forum do come across as abusive. I try to avoid it at all cost on here, but on the job I give and expect top performance, especially from experienced nuke workers. My BS threshold is very low.

When did I ever say abusive? Or be a jerk. I have always avoided that and yes I am a hard ass. Do it right or you will hear from me. I don't care what your excuses are and will tell you right off. Leave the butt hurt at the door. At the end of the year when they say award everyone 3% and I award you 1 because you didn't cut the snuff, don't whine. Go out and meet expectations.

I have to admit I agree with you. How can you quickly correct a deficiency if you are not straight forward with your approach? If the deficiency has the potential to effect plant performance or safety it needs to be addressed quickly and without prejudice. I do believe there is a difference between being a hard a$$ and being abusive or derogatory.

Example:
"Hey Bob, I think that may have been a bad decision. Could you try not to do that next time, please?"

or...

"Bob, that mistake is going to cost us two days in the outage schedule! If you are not sure of what your doing you need to figure it out or ask for help! Don't ever make such a stupid assumption again!"

Which one is going to stick in your memory?
« Last Edit: Mar 07, 2014, 04:22 by ksheed12 »

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #101 on: Mar 07, 2014, 07:08 »
If at all possible I wouldn't use the word stupid as it is degrading and personal. Otherwise you hit it dead on. If possible I would ask what other paths he thought was available and if I could end it with whatever he did good or right and how he could have applied it for success, that way it ends on a positive note.

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #102 on: Mar 07, 2014, 08:03 »
If at all possible I wouldn't use the word stupid as it is degrading and personal. Otherwise you hit it dead on. If possible I would ask what other paths he thought was available and if I could end it with whatever he did good or right and how he could have applied it for success, that way it ends on a positive note.

Yeah, positive notes are great.  I guess DukeMaster87 just never got his...   :(
The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #103 on: Mar 07, 2014, 08:19 »
Simple he was an idiot. I tried telling him how it worked and why his need for instant gratification was not going to be filled then he revealed what a true douchelord he would be as an employee. I have no idea where anyone gets the idea entry level means no experience. It depends on the industry. If NASA posted for entry level astronauts would that mean anyone who wanted to be an astronaut with a physics degree would be qualified? Entry level is that position which is the lowest in a job classification ie the normal starting point.?it does not imply in the least no experience.

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #104 on: Mar 07, 2014, 08:39 »
If at all possible I wouldn't use the word stupid as it is degrading and personal.
Simple he was an idiot. I tried telling him how it worked and why his need for instant gratification was not going to be filled then he revealed what a true douchelord he would be as an employee.

 ???

Seems to be an lack of consistency between those posts.



It's possible you were truly trying to be helpful when you made your original reply to the new poster:

No they are not false advertising they are posting the minim requirement. Technology has nothing to do with it. Hr has to review the resumes then attempt to screen them. Those making the minimum cut are then sent to the hiring manager for his review. This person probably has an hour a week to handle this as he has more important duties. He then has to create a weighted matrix of the qualifications as to what he deems to be most important experience or education. He has to get this approved by hr to ensure he did not include discriminatory factors. Them he fills on the blanks and sees who meets his minimum requirements. Then he has to submit his proposed interview questions and grading scale to hr.
It's a million dollar investment so you have to get it right and ensure the company doesn't get sued in the process. At minimum I would have 10 spots to fill. I don't get another chance for 2 years and getting the wrong people disrupts other timelines.
Btw from what I have seen you wouldn't make my cut and I have an outstanding record for hiring the right people.

However, from the outside, your final (hard-a**?) comment doesn't come across as the positive note that you said you like to end on...and the rest of the thread quickly deteriorated from there, so...just didn't seem like a 'win' for NukeWorker.   :(

The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #105 on: Mar 07, 2014, 08:50 »
He wasn't one of my employees who I am trying to develope. He is just a snot nosed kid who thinks the world needs to change to suit him so nope don't care if I injure his tender feelings.

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #106 on: Mar 07, 2014, 08:58 »
He wasn't one of my employees who I am trying to develope. He is just a snot nosed kid who thinks the world needs to change to suit him so nope don't care if I injure his tender feelings.

Yeah, it looked like you didn't care.   :(

However, rule #4 seems to say that even snot-nosed kids get to come on here and ask questions without getting abused:

http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4700.0.html
4. Please learn to be respectful, tolerate and support each other.  NukeWorker.com's goal is to help others, not see how many people we can annoy. Do not initiate arguments or tension. This will only cause the triggering of other members and make this site less professional.


(Color me 'Triggered')   :(






modified for clarity

« Last Edit: Mar 07, 2014, 10:14 by UncaBuffalo »
The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #107 on: Mar 07, 2014, 09:05 »
I'm a cheapskate.

$36.50/year...  that's just $3.04/month that should be in a rich operators budget  [coffee]

Offline jams723

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #108 on: Mar 08, 2014, 10:21 »

Yours is an outlier. TMI has to piggy back. So does The Bess.

 the piggyback mode is for a small break LOCA where you maintain RCS level but deplete the BWST inventory. Then shift to piggyback mode to use the LPI pumps to take a suction on the RB Sump and send it to the suction of the HPI pumps.  In a B&W design a HPI pump is also used for normal makeup (makeup and purification system) and must be able to pump at NOP.

chuckdhuff

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #109 on: Mar 08, 2014, 10:23 »
$36.50/year...  that's just $3.04/month that should be in a rich operators budget  [coffee]

For just one penny a day??? I'll make sure to mention it to all the rich operators I know.  [sarcasm]

Offline Joe_Fission

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #110 on: Mar 08, 2014, 11:05 »
I'm pretty much brand new to the industry (engineering), I began training just over a week ago and haven't set foot in my station yet. However, it has been drilled into us already that mistakes that are made do to carelessness or laziness will be met with a chewing out, so to say. I appreciate BZ's commentary here even when it gets harsh. Screw ups at the station that are not caught can be safety and/or economic disasters. Supervisors need to make sure the workers under them understand this and need to be pretty critical of their work.

New grads or anyone looking to get into the industry need to realize that being willfully ignorant and arrogant is not something people are going to take much, if any, of (same anywhere, but much more so here). Duke87 started from that position and BZ called him on it. He continued from there and then cemented himself there in the rest of his posts. I would expect that reaction from members if I came on here talking like him, and I think it is reasonable.

Edit: Used an inappropriate word, changed it to meet forum rules. Sorry for the error.  :-[

Modified for language:   6. Sexual innuendo and profanity. Keep the site PG-13, kids visit this site, the NRC visits this site, the Secret Service visits this site, Managers visit this site, I visit the site, good Christian people visit the site, etc. If it's questionable, don't do it. Let's just say that if you're going  to post something that really needs the questionable language to achieve the desired humorous effect put it in the 'Bathroom Wall' in the donors only area, so those that choose not to go there will not be exposed to it. Got it? If you're in the middle of a thread and feel the need for an expletive, can we maybe star out some of the letters or something?




« Last Edit: Mar 13, 2014, 10:33 by Joe_Fission »

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #111 on: Mar 09, 2014, 09:03 »
I'm pretty much brand new to the industry (engineering), I began training just over a week ago and haven't set foot in my station yet. However, it has been drilled into us already that mistakes that are made do to carelessness or laziness will be met with a chewing out, so to say. I appreciate BZ's commentary here even when it gets harsh. F@#k ups at the station that are not caught can be safety and/or economic disasters. Supervisors need to make sure the workers under them understand this and need to be pretty critical of their work.

New grads or anyone looking to get into the industry need to realize that being willfully ignorant and arrogant is not something people are going to take much, if any, of (same anywhere, but much more so here). Duke87 started from that position and BZ called him on it. He continued from there and then cemented himself there in the rest of his posts. I would expect that reaction from members if I came on here talking like him, and I think it is reasonable.


1.  Welcome to the industry.

2.  Don't be too quick to judge people...esp. if they are new to an area or website (it takes a while to acclimate to new social norms)...and esp. if someone attacks them first (many of us react aggressively if attacked...and might come across as arrogant in doing so...)

3.  If you are going to judge people, please apply the same criteria across the board.  (ie...Did anyone else in this thread display arrogance?)

4.  Last, but definitely not least, if they are drilling stuff into you in training I'm assuming you have heard of 'procedural compliance'?  I will tell you that anyone who displays a complete disregard for rules in the outside world (like on this website) will also tend to have a hard time complying with procedures in the plant...so you might re-consider your role models.

Good luck!  :)
« Last Edit: Mar 09, 2014, 10:04 by UncaBuffalo »
The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

Offline xobxdoc

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #112 on: Mar 09, 2014, 11:06 »

1.  Welcome to the industry.

2.  Don't be too quick to judge people...esp. if they are new to an area or website (it takes a while to acclimate to new social norms)...and esp. if someone attacks them first (many of us react aggressively if attacked...and might come across as arrogant in doing so...)

3.  If you are going to judge people, please apply the same criteria across the board.  (ie...Did anyone else in this thread display arrogance?)

4.  Last, but definitely not least, if they are drilling stuff into you in training I'm assuming you have heard of 'procedural compliance'?  I will tell you that anyone who displays a complete disregard for rules in the outside world (like on this website) will also tend to have a hard time complying with procedures in the plant...so you might re-consider your role models.

Good luck!  :)
Good post. I agree with most of it. But equating someone that violates forum rules with violating plant procedures is a bit of a stretch. Also 99% of the post on this thread are off topic which is a forum rule which I am also guilty of.

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #113 on: Mar 09, 2014, 11:18 »
Also 99% of the post on this thread are off topic...

Touché!  ;)
« Last Edit: Mar 09, 2014, 11:21 by UncaBuffalo »
The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #114 on: Mar 09, 2014, 05:40 »
I have never really concerned myself with the feelings of a NUB nor will I ever worry about it. The honesty I have found in fossil is refreshing and should be the model for the nuclear industry.

Offline hamsamich

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #115 on: Mar 09, 2014, 06:19 »
Equating the way you treat people with their qualifications.  What a way to judge people!  Reminds me 100% of how it was in the Navy.  Ahoy Matey!  Wow did this thread degenerate or what.  [dink]

Offline RDTroja

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #116 on: Mar 09, 2014, 07:20 »
Equating the way you treat people with their qualifications.  What a way to judge people!  Reminds me 100% of how it was in the Navy.  Ahoy Matey!  Wow did this thread degenerate or what.  [dink]

To be fair, many people treat others based on how much they think the other person is like they are.




They are called Bigots.
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

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                                  -Ronald Reagan

I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

Offline UncaBuffalo

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #117 on: Mar 09, 2014, 08:19 »
To be fair...

I guess I'm having a slow moment...what does being fair have to do with bigotry?
The days that I keep my gratitude higher than my expectations, I have really good days. -Ray Wylie Hubbard

Offline RDTroja

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #118 on: Mar 09, 2014, 08:56 »
I guess I'm having a slow moment...what does being fair have to do with bigotry?

Only in the world of sarcasm... I was being 'fair' to the person that treats people based on whether or not they are qualified/playing in the big leagues/capable of searching/worthy of assistance.
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
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I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

Fermi2

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #119 on: Mar 10, 2014, 11:23 »
I have never been a bigot in any way shape or form.
Sorry boys I have helped develop guys into some fantastic jobs.
I have helped guys here and from other forums get jobs.
I just got a fantastic thank you letter from a guy who just obtained a teacher position and he feels me resume, interview, and how to handle yourself are the biggest reasons his search was finally successful as a guy in a movie stated I may be a mean cuss but I am the same mean cuss to everyone.

Fact is my shifts don't make mistakes
They don't get people injured
They have an excellent productivity rating
They solve problems
They get promoted
And I have waiting lists to get into my work group

Ain't it wonderful what holding people accountable does?

Offline xobxdoc

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #120 on: Mar 10, 2014, 01:26 »
When's the parade?

Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #121 on: Mar 10, 2014, 02:28 »
I have never been a bigot in any way shape or form.
Sorry boys I have helped develop guys into some fantastic jobs.
I have helped guys here and from other forums get jobs.
I just got a fantastic thank you letter from a guy who just obtained a teacher position and he feels me resume, interview, and how to handle yourself are the biggest reasons his search was finally successful as a guy in a movie stated I may be a mean cuss but I am the same mean cuss to everyone.

Fact is my shifts don't make mistakes
They don't get people injured
They have an excellent productivity rating
They solve problems
They get promoted
And I have waiting lists to get into my work group

Ain't it wonderful what holding people accountable does?

Being blunt and honest is a good thing... +K name calling, bullying, and being demeaning not so much.  -K

Making your subordinates tow the line is a very good thing... +K bludgeoning naive wannabe's not so much.  -K

On shift you may earn an A+ but on a forum that is intended to help coworkers, entry level personnel and the just plain curious about nuclear power B-, I think one would expect a senior manager to be the adult in the room.  ::)

« Last Edit: Mar 10, 2014, 06:57 by Marlin »

Offline RDTroja

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #122 on: Mar 10, 2014, 07:43 »
Being blunt and honest is a good thing... +K name calling, bullying, and being demeaning not so much.  -K

Making your subordinates tow the line is a very good thing... +K bludgeoning naive wannabe's not so much.  -K

On shift you may earn an A+ but on a forum that is intended to help coworkers, entry level personnel and the just plain curious about nuclear power B-, I think one would expect a senior manager to be the adult in the room.  ::)

You grade generously. And you don't know many senior managers very well, do you?  ;)
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

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"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
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I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

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Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #123 on: Mar 10, 2014, 08:54 »
You grade generously. And you don't know many senior managers very well, do you?  ;)

   I graded him based on his contribution to Nukeworker, he has helped many people and his knowledge is above average and valuable. His coaching skills that successful senior managers have not so much.

 [coffee]

   If he was a college sports head coach he would probably deserve an A+.  [devious]

Offline RDTroja

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #124 on: Mar 10, 2014, 10:07 »
  I graded him based on his contribution to Nukeworker, he has helped many people and his knowledge is above average and valuable. His coaching skills that successful senior managers have not so much.

 [coffee]

   If he was a college sports head coach he would probably deserve an A+.  [devious]

I got all of that. If I were to grade him on his contribution I would have to remove points for the many people that might have been contributors that were driven away by his attitude.

I personally would rather have the new people that want to learn and ask questions than a self-righteous jerk that make them think the nuclear industry is full of people like him. I have not often encountered people I would like to work with/for less. He has helped a few and driven away many. I have even had people ask me why he is such a jerk off line and cite people like him that made them give up on Nukeworker all together. Hell, he won't even give up a few dollars to support the site... maybe he doesn't make enough money?

I would say we are way off topic, but the original poster is not even a member any more so I guess there is no real topic any more.
« Last Edit: Mar 10, 2014, 10:11 by RDTroja »
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

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Xenon_Free

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #125 on: Mar 14, 2014, 07:26 »
I, for one, am glad we got rid of the guy asking questions - I am so tired of people asking questions.  On a forum.  In a thread with "entry level" in the subject line.  I will NOT let this industry be taken over by curious people.  Thanks to all who helped in this endeavor.  Wish I could have been here for the kill shot.   ::)

Good job,
XF

Offline Joe_Fission

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #126 on: Mar 14, 2014, 10:16 »
UncaBuffalo, thank you for the kind words and for the advice!

Offline sc_nuke

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #127 on: Apr 06, 2014, 10:20 »
Guys,

In order to keep additional threads on nukeworker I decided to post this here and get some advice.  Like the person who made the original post I have a B.S. in Physics and would like to get into Operations.  I would like to get into one of the following plants: Oconee, Catawba, McGuire, Votgle, V.C. Summer.  I have experience conducting PWR Refueling and Refueling Equipment Maintenance.  If there is any advice you guys have on what those plants look for in hiring operations personnel that can help me out I would greatly appreciate it.

Offline icebergamot

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #128 on: Apr 07, 2014, 03:35 »
Guys,

In order to keep additional threads on nukeworker I decided to post this here and get some advice.  Like the person who made the original post I have a B.S. in Physics and would like to get into Operations.  I would like to get into one of the following plants: Oconee, Catawba, McGuire, Votgle, V.C. Summer.  I have experience conducting PWR Refueling and Refueling Equipment Maintenance.  If there is any advice you guys have on what those plants look for in hiring operations personnel that can help me out I would greatly appreciate it.


I was just hired on as an AO for one of the mentioned plants. My credentials:

BS: NE, decent grades
RO at a "complex" research reactor

Can you elaborate on your PWR refuel experience? That would probably be your experience to harp on.

Offline sc_nuke

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #129 on: Apr 08, 2014, 03:01 »
My Refuel experience includes: Head Area Maintenance (HAM), Reactor Disassembly/Reassembly, Fuel Movement, Insert Shuffles, CRDM Refurb.  I also have experience with Long Handle tooling refurbishment and maintenance.  If you want to know more details I can PM them to you.

Offline icebergamot

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #130 on: Apr 08, 2014, 08:07 »
I'd think you'd have a good shot at AO but I'm not exactly an authority

Offline Higgs

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #131 on: Apr 08, 2014, 08:38 »
I'd think you'd have a good shot at AO but I'm not exactly an authority

I agree.

Justin
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Offline sc_nuke

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #132 on: Apr 08, 2014, 09:19 »
I've got open applications at Oconee and V.C. Summer, so I will see what happens and keep checking the job postings.

Offline icebergamot

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #133 on: Apr 15, 2014, 10:59 »
As far as I know, all Duke AO new hires start in two-three weeks.

EFD307

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #134 on: Nov 02, 2014, 01:06 »
I just graduated (may 2014) with a bachelors in physics, I have been doing research with a professor who has her PhD in nuclear physics since my freshman year, I studied abroad in Taipei for 2 months over the summer my junior year. I worked at a local natural gas plant during 3 outages over a 2 year span as an EMT, I am an eagle scout and volunteer firefighter/EMT. I presented 8 different research projects some talks and some posters I at various student symposiums.

 I have had 2 offers at nuclear power plants since graduating, one for an engineering position which didn't work out due to UA problems at that plant and I just received an offer a few days ago for an associate operator position for a different company's plant. Whether or not the previous security issue will give me problems with this plant is yet to be seen. A good friend of mine who graduated with me and also studied physics and did research with me just accepted an engineering position at a different plant. There are jobs out there, look at your resume and try to make yourself stand out, the things I mentioned about myself were all brought up during my interviews and no doubt helped me get noticed in the first place.

From what I've been told a lot of guys are retiring, there are jobs out there you just have to keep trying. And don't be too cocky when it comes to the entrance exams, I passed my first time but I defiantly prepared for them.

Offline Buinovsky

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #135 on: Dec 01, 2014, 11:20 »
Broadzilla,

You speak in the fashion as an egomaniac I had the unfortunate pleasure of meeting from SQN - xxxxxxxxx.  Assuming you are not this piece of detritus, it must be remarked you are as big into personal puffery.  You did nothing to help the new generation like nuclear power.  Most new engineers in our company leave due to pompous egos like your own.  Exalting the Navy is buffoonery at this point and time -- it isn't the same program.  I watch your Navy stalwarts crash and fail as much as new engineers.

You are living on a submarine in the commercial world.  You chase away talent - not recruit it.  If TVA had a sane hiring practice they would not be running a fleet of nukes with INPO having private parking spots. I am aware SQN achieved a 1 rating; however, they are not without NRC finding.  Flooding come to mind.  Where were you?  Blustering in Work Control patting yourself on the back?

Before you impugn me like the young man inquiring, I have held two SROs, been a division manager, shift manager, Assistant Ops manager, hired and fired, and now oversee building and test reactors in China.  

You are what is wrong with nuclear power.  You belittle to raise your station.  

Modified for Forum Rule #7
« Last Edit: Dec 02, 2014, 12:41 by HydroDave63 »

Offline Rennhack

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #136 on: Dec 02, 2014, 08:18 »
Broadzilla,
Before you impugn me like the young man inquiring
You are what is wrong with nuclear power.  You belittle to raise your station. 

Broadzilla has been banned for over a year, so he won't be responding to you.  As bad as he was, your post is a personal attack and is just as bad as anything he ever said.

Offline GLW

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #137 on: Dec 02, 2014, 09:19 »
the irony of peas in a pod is that the pod never seems big enough for just one more pea,...

not here:

         

not there:

         

not anywhere:

« Last Edit: Dec 02, 2014, 09:23 by GLW »

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline Buinovsky

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #138 on: Dec 03, 2014, 11:39 »
Challenging an individual who has outwardly belittled new talent seeking a job in the nuclear industry does not merit the silly botanical illustrations or remarks purporting equivalence of my statements to Broadzilla's bashing of the original poster.  I met his disdain with equal amount of pique Broadzilla fleshed upon the seeker of an inroad to nuclear power.  Bullies, like Broadzilla are a detriment to recruiting new, fresh minds, to this challenged industry.  In retrospect, I could have refrained from terms like detritus, yet, spilling my CV was a way to circumvent BZ's way of obfuscating an argument by citing his CV and apparent expertise in the nuclear industry.  The most able workforce I have yet to encounter lives in nuclear power.  The most challenged workforce I have yet to encounter works in nuclear power.  Empower to make change not ask co-workers to pillage peers on the grounds of out-of-date checklists.

Offline _NukeOps_

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #139 on: Dec 04, 2014, 12:11 »
FWIW.......

I just completed an 18 month Non Licensed Operator program at my plant.  14 began and 12 finished.  5 guys were new hires who had, at minimum, a BS degree in engineering or engineering technology.  Everyone else, myself included came by way of union bid rights.  Everyone except me had two years of experience in the entry level Nuclear Technician position.  In years past this was called helper or laborer.  I had 10 years with the company at the time and was a Senior Chemistry Technician. 

As part of the program we were required to pass a non published GFES exam.

I said all of that to say this:

My company sees entry into the NLO program as the beginning of a 5 year path to a Reactor Operator License.  Therefore, anyone attempting to hire into this position from the street should not be shy about expressing a desire to obtain a license.  Successful candidates from the street will most likely have an engineering degree.  This is due to the emphasis that INPO places on said degrees.  All that the NRC requires for NLO or RO, for that matter, is a high school diploma. 


Offline GLW

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #140 on: Dec 04, 2014, 03:15 »
Challenging an individual........

Literally 14 seconds of research would have demonstrated it has been greater than 250 days since your target engaged or disparaged anybody,...

your target is yesterday's news,...

you are many days late and many more dollars short on the B'zilla topic,...

....The most challenged workforce I have yet to encounter works in nuclear power....

too often challenged to yak first and research later,....

it's called a God complex,...

unfortunately, there are those control room gods who (whom?) have no sense of self deprecation or humor, either before or after the fact,...

.... In retrospect, I could have refrained from terms like detritus, yet, spilling my CV was a way to circumvent BZ's way of obfuscating an argument by citing his CV and apparent expertise in the nuclear industry. ....

it's the "I'm right at all costs" mentality,...

peas in a pod, I stand by my assessment,...
« Last Edit: Dec 04, 2014, 03:22 by GLW »

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline nspunx4

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #141 on: Dec 05, 2014, 10:55 »
Unfortunately some of us found BZ to be one of the most knowledgeable and most willing to share that knowledge and in my opinion even with his so called "bad attitude" at times I feel this forum is not better without his participation. For what it's worth.

I do understand this is a privately owned site and Renhack has every right to ban anyone he wants. I only bring this up now because he did and it is purely my personal opinion. It also in no way diminishes my appreciation for this site and it's owner for making it available.

Offline Marlin

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #142 on: Dec 06, 2014, 12:16 »
Unfortunately some of us found BZ to be one of the most knowledgeable and most willing to share that knowledge and in my opinion even with his so called "bad attitude" at times I feel this forum is not better without his participation. For what it's worth.

I do understand this is a privately owned site and Renhack Rennhack has every right to ban anyone he wants. I only bring this up now because he did and it is purely my personal opinion. It also in no way diminishes my appreciation for this site and it's owner for making it available.

You are not far wrong but personal bias and continual belittling of new posters and nuclear neophytes does not match the purposes of the site. BZ could have been an excellent mentor and source of information and was frequently, but he was also the Balrog that only the the more experienced posters were prepared for.

 [rulez]

https://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4700.0.html

4. Please learn to be respectful, tolerate and support each other.  NukeWorker.com's goal is to help others, not see how many people we can annoy. Do not initiate arguments or tension. This will only cause the triggering of other members and make this site less professional.

Continued violation of these rules will get you deleted/banned. I have a one strike and you're out policy in regard to anything obscene or totally offensive. In most cases you will be warned (put on 'probation') and given a chance to play by the rules. Again, use a little common sense and you'll be just fine.


 [coffee]

BZ was a repeat offender.
« Last Edit: Dec 06, 2014, 05:37 by Marlin »

Offline GLW

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #143 on: Dec 06, 2014, 04:58 »
...... but he was also the Balrog that only the the more experienced posters were prepared for....



CLUB MEMBER SINCE 1982

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline HydroDave63

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #144 on: Dec 06, 2014, 06:06 »
but he was also the Balrog that only the the more experienced posters were prepared for.

Maybe more of an inner Uruk Hai....


Offline GLW

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #145 on: Dec 06, 2014, 06:38 »
Maybe more of an inner Uruk Hai....



and then there is BZ'sGenOb01 which tends to repeat & repeat & repeat,....

BZ's general observation on Internet forums/threads etal, By the 5th post in any thread it starts drifting off topic. By 12 to 15 it has nothing to do with the original topic and if it surives to 30 or so it magically gets back on topic. This applies almost everywhere.

Mike

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

ski2313

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Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #146 on: Dec 07, 2014, 08:14 »
Unfortunately some of us found BZ to be one of the most knowledgeable and most willing to share that knowledge and in my opinion even with his so called "bad attitude" at times I feel this forum is not better without his participation. For what it's worth.



Agree x10.

Offline dch0806

Re: Physics Degree & Entry level Operator
« Reply #147 on: Mar 20, 2015, 04:15 »
For what it's worth, I'm new to the nuclear industry and thought I would share my experience in case it might help someone who reads this thread and is contemplating the nuclear industry/operator position.

Personally, I went through a community college program that is sponsored by a major utility in our area. Our course work consisted of everything from entry level physics and chemistry, up to reactor theory and kinetics and engineering level thermodynamics/fluid mechanics. Over the course of our two year program we had four "nuclear" classes. Two of which focused on theory and more of the primary systems, the other two were more mechanical concepts and secondary side. In those four classes, most of our handouts and study guides were from the utility and are used in their training at the local plant. Between the first and second year, in order to get your degree you must complete a summer internship. The idea is to do your internship with the utility, although some choose not to take that route (I strongly discourage this choice). I chose to do my internship with the utility and it was awesome. I worked on shift for three months, following all rounds and pretty much trying to see whatever I could and absorb as much information as possible. The course work in the program is not easy, and to call the internship an "eye-opening experience" would be a huge understatement.

As of now, I am scheduled to graduate in May with an associates in nuclear technology, have passed the POSSC and have an interview for an AO position (at the plant I interned in) next week.

A few observations I have had:
Although BZ was considered harsh, a lot of what he said is true in my experience. These companies owe you nothing. Operator positions are highly sought after jobs that require continuous training and carry a great deal of responsibility, and they invest a lot of assets into the hiring to process to ensure they get quality candidates. I have heard there are anywhere from 1200-1500 applicants per operator position posted, and they try to pull from one-third Navy/one-third technical(me)/one-third four year, not including internal applicants. I personally racked my nerves waiting on phone calls and emails after I applied for the internship, and the AO position, because I want it so bad and understand how competitive it is. When they called, they had an answer from me within seconds about whatever they were offering, which was an emphatic yes. After talking with multiple people from contractors to maintenance to everyone I can basically in the industry, I understand that I have been very privileged with my opportunity and will say that operator positions are great jobs that pay well (very well in my opinion) and have a low turnover rate. Again, this makes the market for landing a job VERY competitive, so check your ego at the job board.

As far as the culture, it is not filled with a bunch of jerks by any means. Everyone on my shift during my internship from unqualified AO's up to SRO's and beyond were very helpful, genuinely cared for my safety and are a major reason I have been successful in my program so far. BUT: This is a very serious job, it is not an easy job and everyone in the operations department has busted their tail and put in a lot of work to get where they are. Some have applied for 5 years to get there so, yes, you do have to prove yourself. When you're on shift you are one big team that relies heavily on communication and teamwork and you spend a lot of time with each other, so a "me" attitude will not get you anywhere. As an intern, I wasn't called "noob" or "snowflake" (that may change if I get hired as an AO but in that case they can call me whatever they want because I'll be lucky to be there), but I think what BZ was trying to get across is everyone works hard in operations and they want to make sure the guy beside them is as equally committed and serious.

I hope that my experiences can answer some questions and help anyone who is trying to make the nuclear industry a career.

 


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