Help | Contact Us
NukeWorker.com
NukeWorker Menu How hot is fuel

Author Topic: How hot is fuel  (Read 6331 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

atomicarcheologist

  • Guest
How hot is fuel
« on: May 17, 2017, 09:05 »
How long will spent fuel continue to have enough thermal heat to ignite a match by contact?

Offline GLW

Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2017, 09:09 »
How long will spent fuel continue to have enough thermal heat to ignite a match by contact?

depends,...

who is holding the match?!?!?!


 :P :P ROFL ROFL ROFL :P :P

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline RDTroja

  • Site Heretic
  • Gold Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3964
  • Total likes: 176
  • Karma: 4553
  • Gender: Male
  • I knew I got into IT for a reason!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2017, 09:10 »
Damn. You beat me to it.

Do the matches work underwater?
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
                                  -Ronald Reagan

I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

atomicarcheologist

  • Guest
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2017, 09:17 »
Damn. You beat me to it.

Do the matches work underwater?
Underwater is out of the equation. Theoretical reach rods are in.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2017, 09:17 by Atomic Archeologist »

Offline Marlin

  • Forum Staff
  • *
  • Posts: 13562
  • Total likes: 542
  • Karma: 5133
  • Gender: Male
  • Stop Global Whining!!!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2017, 09:18 »
   The temperature needed to ignite a match is 446 degrees Fahrenheit but the time to drop below that is dependent on fuel design and power history so unless there are a few assumptions tough to say. But since the bundle will not be taken out of the water for dry storage until it is well below that I suspect I am taking the bait so reel me in.

Offline Marlin

  • Forum Staff
  • *
  • Posts: 13562
  • Total likes: 542
  • Karma: 5133
  • Gender: Male
  • Stop Global Whining!!!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2017, 09:20 »
   The temperature needed to ignite a match is 446 degrees Fahrenheit but the time to drop below that is dependent on fuel design and power history so unless there are a few assumptions tough to say. But since the bundle will not be taken out of the water for dry storage until it is well below that I suspect I am taking the bait so reel me in.


Wow, three answers while I was typing much better than average response. Nice post  +K   [stir]

atomicarcheologist

  • Guest
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2017, 09:40 »
   The temperature needed to ignite a match is 446 degrees Fahrenheit but the time to drop below that is dependent on fuel design and power history so unless there are a few assumptions tough to say. But since the bundle will not be taken out of the water for dry storage until it is well below that I suspect I am taking the bait so reel me in.

Not caring whether you need to take the fuel out of the water or unbutton the cask, US commercial fuel is applicable.

Offline RDTroja

  • Site Heretic
  • Gold Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3964
  • Total likes: 176
  • Karma: 4553
  • Gender: Male
  • I knew I got into IT for a reason!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2017, 01:06 »
Underwater is out of the equation. Theoretical reach rods are in.
If it is not underwater I think it will take a long time to cool down... and it likely won't resemble a fuel bundle anymore.
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
                                  -Ronald Reagan

I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

Offline ipregen

Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2017, 01:23 »
That's almost like asking how long it takes to bake tollhouse cookies in the pressurizer doghouse.

Offline Marlin

  • Forum Staff
  • *
  • Posts: 13562
  • Total likes: 542
  • Karma: 5133
  • Gender: Male
  • Stop Global Whining!!!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2017, 01:40 »
If it is not underwater I think it will take a long time to cool down... and it likely won't resemble a fuel bundle anymore.

    I think he is proposing a puzzle that we use to do in the Navy. Find an answer to a question that required you to set your own parameters/assumptions. Such as what dose rate would it take to lift an average size man one foot. We started with the fact that an erg is the amount of energy it would take to lift an average sized mosquito one centimeter and continued to make assumptions that could be vaguely supported within reason.
   With all of the variables in decay heat there is no one answer but I would assume you would look at the residual power in megawatts and temperature generated by that equivalent tracking that to the point that the surface of the bundle would drop below 446 degrees Fahrenheit of an average bundle. State assumptions and justify.

"That's just my opinion, I could be wrong" D.M.

Offline Rennhack

Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2017, 05:34 »
That's almost like asking how long it takes to bake tollhouse cookies in the pressurizer doghouse.

3 hours.

atomicarcheologist

  • Guest
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2017, 04:42 »
    I think he is proposing a puzzle that we use to do in the Navy. Find an answer to a question that required you to set your own parameters/assumptions. Such as what dose rate would it take to lift an average size man one foot. We started with the fact that an erg is the amount of energy it would take to lift an average sized mosquito one centimeter and continued to make assumptions that could be vaguely supported within reason.
   With all of the variables in decay heat there is no one answer but I would assume you would look at the residual power in megawatts and temperature generated by that equivalent tracking that to the point that the surface of the bundle would drop below 446 degrees Fahrenheit of an average bundle. State assumptions and justify.

"That's just my opinion, I could be wrong" D.M.
That is correct.

Offline RDTroja

  • Site Heretic
  • Gold Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3964
  • Total likes: 176
  • Karma: 4553
  • Gender: Male
  • I knew I got into IT for a reason!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2017, 08:33 »
    I think he is proposing a puzzle that we use to do in the Navy. Find an answer to a question that required you to set your own parameters/assumptions. Such as what dose rate would it take to lift an average size man one foot. We started with the fact that an erg is the amount of energy it would take to lift an average sized mosquito one centimeter and continued to make assumptions that could be vaguely supported within reason.
   With all of the variables in decay heat there is no one answer but I would assume you would look at the residual power in megawatts and temperature generated by that equivalent tracking that to the point that the surface of the bundle would drop below 446 degrees Fahrenheit of an average bundle. State assumptions and justify.

"That's just my opinion, I could be wrong" D.M.
Yes, I was aware of that... I was just playing the game. I used to play games a little like that when I was teaching RP Initial training classes.
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
                                  -Ronald Reagan

I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

Offline Marlin

  • Forum Staff
  • *
  • Posts: 13562
  • Total likes: 542
  • Karma: 5133
  • Gender: Male
  • Stop Global Whining!!!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2017, 09:26 »
Yes, I was aware of that... I was just playing the game. I used to play games a little like that when I was teaching RP Initial training classes.

I should have know that anyone who could smell radiation would know that.  ;)


   That is not a demeaning statement, Roger and I were walking down a hallway in an auxiliary building (decades ago) when he said he could smell radiation. I was a little incredulous at first but there was a scent unique to the containment at power we could smell and as it turned out there was a small amount of airborne due to an odd line up by OPS.


 [salute]

Offline RDTroja

  • Site Heretic
  • Gold Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3964
  • Total likes: 176
  • Karma: 4553
  • Gender: Male
  • I knew I got into IT for a reason!
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #14 on: May 18, 2017, 11:06 »
I will never live that particular choice of phrasing down, will I?
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
                                  -Ronald Reagan

I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

atomicarcheologist

  • Guest
Re: How hot is fuel
« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2017, 10:01 »
   The temperature needed to ignite a match is 446 degrees Fahrenheit but the time to drop below that is dependent on fuel design and power history so unless there are a few assumptions tough to say. But since the bundle will not be taken out of the water for dry storage until it is well below that I suspect I am taking the bait so reel me in.

So the time frame at the average commercial reactor for it's spent fuel to cool below the 446 F is 7-20 years? Can anybody dial that in a bit more precise?

 


NukeWorker ™ is a registered trademark of NukeWorker.com ™, LLC © 1996-2021 All rights reserved.
All material on this Web Site, including text, photographs, graphics, code and/or software, are protected by international copyright/trademark laws and treaties. Unauthorized use is not permitted. You may not modify, copy, reproduce, republish, upload, post, transmit or distribute, in any manner, the material on this web site or any portion of it. Doing so will result in severe civil and criminal penalties, and will be prosecuted to the maximum extent possible under the law.
Privacy Statement | Terms of Use | Code of Conduct | Spam Policy | Advertising Info | Contact Us | Forum Rules | Password Problem?