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allroy

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What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« on: Feb 20, 2005, 08:16 »
I am a Naval Officer and have been in submarines for 10 yrs.  Qualified Engineer, QAO for 7 years, Current Sub's Material Manager, etc...what am I qualified for in the civilian world?

Offline RDTroja

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #1 on: Feb 21, 2005, 08:36 »
What do you want to do? You did not mention a degreee, but if you have one (especially engineering) you are qualified to work your way up to Plant Manager from either an ops position (Shift Technical Advisor comes to mind if you have enough background to get your SRO license) or Engineering. Officers automatically qualify as supervision, often brought in at Manager level - again the degree would be the key.

If you are an Annapolis graduate, there is gold in them thar hills. Just knock your ring on the table during the interview... that is like the secret handshake for the fast track at a lot of plants.  ;)

Seriously, the opportunities are plentiful for someone like you. You could easily head up a QA department. Purchasing also comes to mind. I usually recommend checking the Jobs section of this site (see the tabs at the top of any page) but I am not sure how many jobs here are high enough for you to shoot for.

Good luck and let us know where you land. And remember who sent ya... always nice to have friends in high places.
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I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #2 on: Feb 21, 2005, 10:47 »
If you are qualified as Engineer, you should be looking at jobs at or around the Plant Manager level.
"To be content with little is hard; to be content with much, impossible." - Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach

allroy

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #3 on: Feb 22, 2005, 11:12 »
I am not quite sure what I want to do since I am not really sure what is out there... :)  My degree is in Control Systems Engineering....but I am also qualified Engineer...are there any liscenses I need?

So the Annapolis thing really helps??? ;)

Is it best to go through some head hunter or is it better to just look at the jobs on the site?

Thanks for all the help!!

Offline RDTroja

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #4 on: Feb 23, 2005, 10:50 »
I am not sure what credit is given for navy experience or if you have to have civilian work experience to qualify, but getting a PE license couldn't hurt.

A headhunter would be good if you are not picky where you want to work.

And, yeah, Annapolis grads tend to carry weight in the commercial nuclear industry.
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
                                  -Ronald Reagan

I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

Fermi2

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #5 on: Feb 25, 2005, 08:40 »
Since when does graduating from the Naval Academy help anyone in the commercial industry?

Good old MM1 (SS) Brubaker has had 4 academy grads working for him, none of which really went anywhere.

It's a myth that academy grads are hot items in the industry, and very few officers are hired in immediately as supervision. I'm currently working as a Shift Manager in my second plant, and I've done peer visits at approximately 25 plants, and in no way shape or form have I ever seen academny grads do any better so far as advancement.

An SRO License is far more important and valuable.

Mike

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #6 on: Feb 26, 2005, 12:03 »
I have personally seen several Academy grads in Management positions. Maybe I was just 'lucky'.
"I won't eat anything that has intelligent life, but I'd gladly eat a network executive or a politician."

                                  -Marty Feldman

"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to understand that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
                                  -Ronald Reagan

I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it.

                                  - Voltaire

Fermi2

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #7 on: Feb 26, 2005, 09:58 »
I'm not saying it doesn't happen. I'm saying they aren't given any preference. In fact many utilities shy away from Academy grads because they aren't the most inventive or creative thinkers.

NOW, if a guy comes out and he's an admiral or say a senior captain and the utility elects to hire him then yes he'll be hired directly into management. But a commander on down, no way, they don't have any real managerial experience and aren't any more qualified for management than a guy off the street.

Mike

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #8 on: Feb 26, 2005, 11:54 »
I think you need to go pee in the bottle.  If you think a Commander, who has the authority to launch a nuclear attack, has no managerial experience, you're smoking crack.

I do agree however, that they are probably the least creative people on the planet.  They are pretty much disciplined to think one way, and deviation from that is considered dangerous.  Unfortunately, this is a pretty accurate description of the management in the nuclear energy industry these days.  Look around you, tell me how many times you see posters, flyers, lesson plans etc. with the slogans that have become stock buzzwords.

Here are a few of those "original" thoughts that nuclear utilities are looking for:

STAR
Self-Check
Peer Check
Place Keeping
Take-Two
OPEX

And the biggest conspiracy to tell a lie since Watergate:  "There is no schedule pressure."  That ranks right up there with "There is no such thing as the Mafia, Senator" and "I believe that nicotine is not addictive."

If you are able to "capture" the above buzzwords... er... I mean "Human Performance Fundamentals", you are nuclear management material.  Actually, you are nuclear management material if you can work the word "capture" into the same sentence with any of the above during a meeting that lasts twice as long as it should have.  If the meeting itself is held in a place called the "OCC" and accomplishes exactly nothing, then you are on the fast track to being the Site Vice President.
"To be content with little is hard; to be content with much, impossible." - Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach

Fermi2

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #9 on: Feb 26, 2005, 03:30 »
I think you need to go pee in the bottle.  If you think a Commander, who has the authority to launch a nuclear attack, has no managerial experience, you're smoking crack.

I do agree however, that they are probably the least creative people on the planet.  They are pretty much disciplined to think one way, and deviation from that is considered dangerous.  Unfortunately, this is a pretty accurate description of the management in the nuclear energy industry these days.  Look around you, tell me how many times you see posters, flyers, lesson plans etc. with the slogans that have become stock buzzwords.

Here are a few of those "original" thoughts that nuclear utilities are looking for:

STAR
Self-Check
Peer Check
Place Keeping
Take-Two
OPEX

And the biggest conspiracy to tell a lie since Watergate:  "There is no schedule pressure."  That ranks right up there with "There is no such thing as the Mafia, Senator" and "I believe that nicotine is not addictive."

If you are able to "capture" the above buzzwords... er... I mean "Human Performance Fundamentals", you are nuclear management material.  Actually, you are nuclear management material if you can work the word "capture" into the same sentence with any of the above during a meeting that lasts twice as long as it should have.  If the meeting itself is held in a place called the "OCC" and accomplishes exactly nothing, then you are on the fast track to being the Site Vice President.


I should have excepted Submarine Commanders. But as a rule most Officers under Captain don't have trhe skill set most commercial nukes are looking for in Management. My guess is there are more managers by a LONG shot who grew up and obtained SRO Licenses than there are ex Academy grads or Naval Officers. In fact it's not a guess it's a fact.

By the way, another key word is Synergize!! LOL

Mike

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #10 on: Feb 26, 2005, 04:47 »
I still don't see many of those guys around.  I think that most of the ex-Navy officers are working at INPO if they are in nuclear power at all.  The rest are "consulting" for defense contractors.
Almost all the Navy nukes I know (the ones I know personally) who are actually in the commercial nuke industry, are former enlisted men.
There are a few companies who have actively sought out Navy oficers, though.  South Texas Project at one time heavily recruited nuke officers for management, and enlisted folks for ops, chemistry and HP.  It looked like they were trying to duplicate the Navy organization.  I don't know if it worked.
"To be content with little is hard; to be content with much, impossible." - Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach

Fermi2

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #11 on: Feb 26, 2005, 07:50 »
Actually the best Officer I ever worked for ended up at South Texas as their Ops Manager. His name was Dave Rencurrel and so far as I know he's still there. It ws weird seeing a picture of him with long hair.

Mike

Offline MLew44

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #12 on: Mar 28, 2005, 04:43 »
Allroy, you are well-qualified for a career in commercial nuclear power, especially in operations. There ARE plenty of ex-officers around in various levels of management. Some of the above threads spell out the details. I would offer one piece of advice: you want to get that job, and naturally you'll have to exploit your experience. But once you've hired on to a company, don't flaunt the fact that you were an officer, that you twice saved the world, that you commanded untold men into danger, etc etc. Nobody really wants to hear that stuff; I would be somewhat low key about it, do your job, earn your status in the civilian world just as you did in the Navy.

As well, the challenge will be big. You probably will elect to get into operations, at least to start --- and it's the right place to start if you want a career in management. But it won't be a breeze. In my experience, qualifying and getting an SRO license at a commercial nuke is MORE DIFFICULT than qualifying EOOW in a naval plant.

To reply to your questions: no licenses are necessary prior to hiring on. In my opinion, your Annapolis degree will perhaps help you later, and it can't hurt you unless you flaunt it! It's been quite a while since I was last job-hunting, so I don't have a good answer about the head hunter question. If you elect to start out in operations, be aware that most utilities hire groups of people periodically --- this is a matter of business sense. Often, the company may hire on people as "staff", where you'll do administrative work until the license class starts. Or, you can take a job as a non-licensed operator to start: that is a path that will take guts on your part and will require you to use your muscle as well as your brain for a while! Best of luck.

sir lawrence

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #13 on: Mar 28, 2005, 06:15 »
Send out the resumes and see who bites.  I find that some utilities like to have the ring tappers, (academy grads) on the payroll.  I have worked for several and have found some good and some not.  What makes someone a good manager I don't think is totally learned in school.

BillyJ

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #14 on: May 19, 2005, 09:32 »
If you are qualified as Engineer, you should be looking at jobs at or around the Plant Manager level.

Are you high??  Give me a break.  Maybe, if the interview goes real well, and the plant is in desperate need, then a shot at an instant SRO License candidate.   Or maybe, a systems engineer position, but looking for a Plant Manager position is not even in the galaxy of possibilities.  I dont know why this guy suggested that.  I hope he didn't get your hopes up too high. 

jamesd

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #15 on: May 20, 2005, 12:13 »

I should have excepted Submarine Commanders. But as a rule most Officers under Captain don't have trhe skill set most commercial nukes are looking for in Management. My guess is there are more managers by a LONG shot who grew up and obtained SRO Licenses than there are ex Academy grads or Naval Officers. In fact it's not a guess it's a fact.

By the way, another key word is Synergize!! LOL

Mike


The question that comes to mind is, "'Commander', the rank; or 'Commander', the assignment?"

Fermi2

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #16 on: May 20, 2005, 03:26 »
Hmmm. Good question.  I'd say anyone who has been a Department Head, like the Engineer, or the XO. Division Officers basically just do what the Chief says to do. So any officer who has been in charge of a diverse group of departments and has to integrate matters  to ensure success.

MIke

chuckhallett

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The NRC is hiring, check with them if interested
« Reply #17 on: Oct 03, 2005, 08:53 »
Your degree and experience would probably be very helpful in landing a job with the NRC, which is intending to hire many people in anticipation of the spite of new plant license submittals.  Control System Engineering would also be a hot button with them as the new designs are more digital controls focused and there is a shortage of qualified personell to review those designs.

You probably already know this, but in case you don't, all your service time will count towards federal retirement.  The ten years in the canoe club wouldn't be a total loss, and if you were to stay in the reserves, you would be working for an "understanding" employer.

It is generally difficult to get into the NRC directly, this is a once in a blue moon scenario.

If you want to talk to a fellow academy grad who has worked in the commercial industry, drop me a message and I'll give you a name to contact.  This gentelman had ten years in when he got out and subsequently retired from the reserves.

rlbinc

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #18 on: Oct 25, 2005, 05:39 »
I am shocked and appalled that none of my esteemed colleagues mentioned INPO. The Institute for Navy Pensioned Officers is located in Marietta, GA. They will be glad to have you, particularly if you are an Annapolis Ring Knocker. This way, you can share your knowledge of the Engineering Department Manual for Nuclear Ships with all commercial nuclear reactors

 ;D

M1Ark

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #19 on: Oct 29, 2005, 01:16 »
I am a Naval Officer and have been in submarines for 10 yrs.  Qualified Engineer, QAO for 7 years, Current Sub's Material Manager, etc...what am I qualified for in the civilian world?

Allroy,

The current SRO Instant Class for my utility had eleven in the class to start.

1 MMCM 20 years (Command Master Chief of some big base on the East Coast)
1 EMCS 20 years
2 Ex Academy nuke officers
1 nuke officer
5 nuke enlisted
1 College Grad

The Master Chief has withdrawn from the class.

The college grad and the 5 enlisted are doing quite well.  The officers are getting along ok.  The previous class was composed of all ex-navy officers and half of them failed out of the program.  The utility decided to mix it up for this class and a lot of leadership is coming from the enlisted ranks that is making the class a little better. I wouldn't say that the officers are leading the class but doing ok. The previous class also had a 15 year officer that was an engineer and already screened for XO and received an XO billet in Groton (he claims).  He currently has his license but not exactly blazing a trail.

I'm sure the Commander to Plant Manager program exist at some utilities but I havent seen it.  An SRO license is more demanding than EOOW quals on your boat. Also, just like anything... you must earn your keep in commercial nuclear power. 

There are lots of talk of building new plants and it takes ~2 years to complete an SRO instant class. I'm not sure where the industry is going to get all of these SRO's from.  Navy nuke officers? Maybe the tide is changing.

I also met an INPO employee who was recently hired by INPO straight from the NAVY.  His previous duty prior to getting out was as a Shift Engineer at prototype.  I'm not sure what that means.  He is complaining that he gets little respect from his own INPO peers since he wasn't previously SRO licensed at a commercial utility.  I'm not sure if it's real or perceived. He says he comes up with ideas during their meetings but feels he is silently second guessed because of his experience level.  He has said he should have went to a utility to get his SRO license first.

Offline MLew44

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #20 on: Oct 29, 2005, 05:41 »
Who would really want to be an INPO evaluator or NRC anyway??

Doesn't sound like much fun watching and evaluating other people do stuff. Ex-Navy officer? Go for the gusto and be an SRO.

JohnK87

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #21 on: Oct 29, 2005, 04:08 »
Your EOOW and navy time is sufficient to qualify as a Direct SRO.  I'd look for a job in Operations, Operations Training or Engineering with a path to the SRO in the first 3 years or so.  I started as an Operations Instructor in 1992, SRO in 1994, Ops Control Room Supervisor in 2002 and now starting as Shift Manager.

The 'ring-knocker' can be a real turnoff with the operators you are working with, mainly because many are prior enlisted.  Don't piss them off, you need their help.  SRO class is more challenging than Navy quals.

You also could look for jobs in QA, Engineering, or Maintenance but if you plan to be in senior management you NEED to get that SRO and spend time in Ops.  May as well do that while you're young.

Jams

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #22 on: Jan 26, 2006, 11:43 »
At Ark. Nuc. One we have had ex Navy Officers come in as Shift Tech. Advisors and most have done well.  If you want a foot in the door and are willing to work, start as a Non-licensed Operator (your resume will gaurantee an interview).  Low end pay 23.00 per hour depending on company and area.  Then you have the ability to look at the positions open in the company while making a decent living and expanding your experiance base.  Some individuals are impressed by "Acadamy Grad" most of us are impressed by intellegance, integrity and work ethics.  Do not come into any company expecting to be "give" anything.  You will get out of it what you put in it.

For what it is worth those are my two bits.

Mitch257

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #23 on: Nov 02, 2007, 09:02 »
(reaizing that I'm digging up an old thread, but one I think may still be of interest)
I would suggest that both you guys think about what job you want to do, and which plant/utility/company/organization you want to do it for.  Either would be qualified for a lot of different jobs at plants, INPO, NRC maybe even EPRI - the industry is gearing up and that will mean opportunities.  Besides ops and radcon, both worthy fields for sure, there is system/plant engineering, maintenance, maintenance management, licensing, other jobs I can't think of off the top of my head. 

But, my point is, the industry does hire Nuke officers, they do better in some organizations than others, but it's mostly up to the individual.  If you find a job that is a good match FOR YOU, and think about getting into a geographic location that you will like, you could find yourself in a good gig. ;)

I wouldn't dismiss NRC as a place to start, I have worked as a contract operator examiner (back when they did that!) and you get to see a lot of plants and meet a lot of people, and the industry does need a fair "referee" at least in some cases to prod management to spend the $ on safety when it does not have a direct positive impact on the bottom line, financially.

Kev3399

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Re: What exactly is a Nuke Officer Qualified for?
« Reply #24 on: Nov 03, 2007, 01:39 »
Don't hold back on your job search based on what some say on here. If you want to do Management, apply for those and see what happens. If you want to do Ops/SRO or Training, apply for that. You are more than "qualified" to get your foot in the door. You would be amazed at how many utilities are starving for someone to come in and take the load.(Reference the threads on the aging workforce)

I was an ETC and sought to get my SRO License. I applied with distant hopes because of my lack of degree. I had 3 to choose from when it came down to decision making time.

Bottom line, decide what you want to do and go for it. The only thing holding you back is yourself. Just like everything else in life.

Also, leave your pride at the door if you do decide to get a SRO license. They will eat you up and spit you out if it appears that your mind or attitude is still wearing collar devices. Become Joe "I want to learn" Smith, not LCDR Joe Smith. This is the advice I got from a good friend who has been in the industry awhile. Looking back now, I can't thank him enough for those few harsh words of advice before I started.

 


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