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Offline Nuke of the North

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #550 on: Dec 01, 2012, 09:04 »
Getting worse:

Quote
An investigation into possible sabotage by an employee is underway at Southern California Edison’s (NASDAQ: SCE) 2,200 MW San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station (SONGS) after engine coolant was found to have been poured in the oil reservoir of a backup generator last October, according to The Huffington Post.
 

"The comprehensive investigation has included rigorous tests, a review of station logs and employee interviews to determine the cause of the presence of the residual engine coolant," the article quoted SCE as saying. "Based on the unexpected discovery of the coolant in the diesel oil system and the ongoing investigation, security at the plant has been enhanced." The entire plant has been offline since early 2012 after significant degradation in steam-generation tubes was discovered in Units 2 and 3, leading to a small leak in Unit 3.
 
Rancorous negotiations between the union and management, combined with pressure from anti-nuclear groups and a frustrated general public, have led to a steep decline in morale at the plant, according to the article.  "While morale is as low as it has ever been and the environment is as chilled as it has ever been, no one I know could imagine doing such a thing,” an unnamed plant employee was quoted as saying. “First of all, the chances of getting caught are so high. But more importantly, what are you accomplishing? You're only endangering yourself and your coworkers and the surrounding public. I can't understand the logic behind it.
 
"On the other hand,” he said, “I'm also not completely surprised because the environment really is so harsh. People can do crazy things when they are under extreme stress."


http://www.power-eng.com/articles/2012/11/sabotage-suspected-in-san-onofre-nuclear-plant-investigation.html

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Offline HydroDave63

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #551 on: Jan 06, 2013, 06:21 »
To understand it you have to think like a "Kalifornian". Songs represents ~7.85% of their total in-state electricity production. They only produce 71% of what they consume. My math may be wrong, but I think that puts SONGS's output at about 5.5% of their total consumption. They probably plan to replace it with energy conservation and renewable sources. Whatever shortfalls they have they can purchase from the dirt burners and nukes of the southwest. As long as it is not being produced in their state, who cares where the electricity comes from.

http://energyalmanac.ca.gov/overview/energy_sources.html

Looks like your point was a very good one indeed! As the Huntington Beach generator-vs-synchronous condensor argument and litigation turns, looks like JPMorganChase just got "FERC'd"  :P

http://www.latimes.com/business/money/la-fi-mo-jpmorgan-power-station-huntington-beach-20130104,0,5914049.story

« Last Edit: Jan 06, 2013, 08:04 by HydroDave63 »

Paulers

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #552 on: Feb 28, 2013, 04:36 »
Good to see a lot of my fellow operators finding new jobs Before the RIF.  :) Go Forth and Prosper!

Offline Cecelia

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #553 on: Mar 02, 2013, 01:08 »
I am hoping that our industry appreciates the trials SONGS is facing and supports them 100%. I was there when then problems were found and saw the reaction and the efforts first hand.  This could have happened to any plant. Industry failure in design of major components is not something we have failed at using USA made components. Japan deserves the heat on this one. Not SONGS. Liberal CA is having a field day of fodder over it and we dont need to help them. So I ask everyone to get behind them in support. Great plant, people and they deserve our support.

Offline Already Gone

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #554 on: Mar 02, 2013, 10:36 »
Sorry Cecelia, but there won't be much sympathy for SONGS on this forum.  I loved working there, and really liked all the people I met there.  But my personal regard for the people doesn't give them a free pass on this one, just as it hasn't previously.
They are a poster child for the anti-nukes, and that isn't fair.  But you can't blame Japan for the latest problem entirely.  The person holding the license has to shoulder the blame for components they have installed, regardless of the source.
We'd probably give them some slack if there was some defect of which they were not aware.  We'd be right on their side if the defective steam generators were anything other than exactly what they knew they were getting.  If industry experience has proven the reliability of USA-made components, then why in hell did SONGS not buy them!?!?!  No.  They brought this on themselves.  It isn't the liberal media's fault that they bought the wrong design.  It isn't the nuclear industry's responsibility to defend them just because they are under attack.  You are wrong.  This could not have happened to "any" plant.  It might have happened to some other plant if they were run like San Onofre is run, but the reality is that it didn't happen to any other plant.  If it makes you feel better, Davis-Besse is back on the grid, but some people are in prison.  If it is any solace to you, Crystal River won't run again after cracking their containment.  Maybe they have some steam generators you can buy.
Yes, the anti-nukes have been grossly unfair to them.  And yes, the boilers came from a foreign manufacturer.  I feel bad that people are going to lose their jobs over this.  But, I can't accept their blind arrogant attitude that the world simply has to accept that they are relatively inept at running a nuke plant just because 1) they have been mistreated in the press for decades and 2) California needs their megawatts.  The industry isn't likely to love them after they have skewed the statistics on cost and availability in the wrong direction for so long.  And now, they have jeopardized even further the outlook for building new units.  Face it, they make the rest of us look bad, and showing support for them will be viewed as acceptance of their low standards.
After all the fuss, excuses don't keep the nuclides inside the pipe where they belong.  They need a better game plan than shrugging their shoulders and saying "we did the best we could, and you need us".
Any hope they have for redemption has to start with someone else taking over management of that site.  I can't imagine who might want to take on a broken plant with a history of public persecution in a state that has no means to offer financial incentives.  Rehabilitating SONGS is going to be difficult, expensive, and done under a microscope.   That means that there had better be beaucoup money in the picture or nobody is going to want to touch it.  So that leaves SCE to try to do it.  Nobody believes that they can except SCE themselves, and you see where their judgment has gotten them.  So don't blame us for doubting it now.
« Last Edit: Mar 03, 2013, 09:25 by Already Gone »
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Offline dea

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #555 on: Mar 03, 2013, 11:22 »
I'd just like to point out that you can't get a Steam Generator or any large component made in the USA because we have let our manufacturing base erode away.

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #556 on: Mar 04, 2013, 07:26 »
If I recall correctly, the NRC identified faulty modeling software, used by MHI, as the root cause of the issues with the steam generators. 

Here is a brief snapshot of what the NRC found at MHI http://pbadupws.nrc.gov/docs/ML1233/ML12333A144.pdf

Does this exclude SONGS from any responsibility?  Absolutely not.  As the license holder, they are ultimately responsible for what gets manufactured for them and what gets installed into their plant.

As to dea's post concerning our manufacturing base eroding away, that isn't a 100% correct statement.  The companies that previously manufactured these components in the US stopped manufacturing them as a business decision.  The demand for these components didn't exist for almost 30 years.  Maintaining an Appendix B QA program is expensive.  Simple supply and demand dictated that the manufacturers scale back or turn their services to a profitable endeavor instead of producing large, nuclear industry specific items like steam generators.


Offline Takar

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #557 on: Mar 05, 2013, 10:46 »
SONGS Union reduction-in-force to start in Mid-march, with layoffs in June 2013.


Offline GLW

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been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline Nuke of the North

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #560 on: May 22, 2013, 01:41 »
WTF?

Anyone recognize any of these clowns?

Quote
SAN DIEGO - A video titled “SONGS Trek” made inside the San Onofre nuclear power plant has been given to Team 10. The video is a Star Trek spoof featuring the show’s music, costumes and an Enterprise replica in the opening shot.

An inside source at the plant gave the video to Team 10 Investigator Mitch Blacher. Additional sources have now confirmed the video is legitimate, and was produced from inside the plant.

The spoof features top nuclear managers dressed as Star Trek characters. At one point, the manager who plays Captain Kirk mentions "safety hazards."

Blacher and Team 10 were working on a full-story about this video mid-Tuesday afternoon, including details on where inside the nuclear plant the spoof video was shot, why they made it, and the controversy it is now creating.

http://www.10news.com/news/investigations/team-10-obtains-songs-trek-a-star-trek-spoof-video-made-inside-san-onofre-nuclear-power-plant05212013

Waiting for it on YouTube...
« Last Edit: May 22, 2013, 01:58 by Nuke of the North »
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Offline xobxdoc

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #561 on: May 22, 2013, 07:18 »
That leak catchment device shows initiative!

Offline retired nuke

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #562 on: May 22, 2013, 07:58 »
WTF?

Anyone recognize any of these clowns?

http://www.10news.com/news/investigations/team-10-obtains-songs-trek-a-star-trek-spoof-video-made-inside-san-onofre-nuclear-power-plant05212013

Waiting for it on YouTube...

Much ado about nothing. Didn't compromise safety, or display an unsafe attitude that I saw. Done in the simulator (where you can have all the alarms flashing).
Done before the S/G crap started.

I have seen worse training videos from other plants, that actually are on youtube.
Remember who you love. Remember what is sacred. Remember what is true.
Remember that you will die, and that this day is a gift. Remember how you wish to live, may the blessing of the Lord be with you

Offline Nuke of the North

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #563 on: May 22, 2013, 11:12 »
Much ado about nothing. Didn't compromise safety, or display an unsafe attitude that I saw. Done in the simulator (where you can have all the alarms flashing).
Done before the S/G crap started.

I have seen worse training videos from other plants, that actually are on youtube.

All of that is irrelevant. We all know SONGS' battle now is mostly PR, not technical - and they are losing bad. Just like this other so-called "controversy" out for a few weeks now which we all can tell is also utterly bogus:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/02/san-onofre-leaky-pipe-fixed-tape-plastic-bag_n_3203289.html

http://www.10news.com/news/investigations/photograph-picture-given-to-team-10-shows-plastic-bags-tape-broomsticks-used-to-fix-leak-at-san-onofre-043013

Using the Osama/Demoncrat IRS/AP/Benghazzi excuses of "Much ado about nothing" "Nothing to see here" "Move on" won't help the cause either.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2013, 11:14 by Nuke of the North »
Es braust unser Panzer Im Sturmwind dahin!

Offline 61nomad

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #564 on: May 22, 2013, 03:48 »
I disagree about their problems being mostly PR. Isn't their main problem the fact that the tubes in their new SGs are banging together?

Isn't it always the managers that say "perception is reality"?  Well I guess the reality is that upper management was too busy playing Star Trek to worry about the quality of their new generators!

Offline GLW

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #565 on: May 22, 2013, 04:20 »
All of that is irrelevant. We all know SONGS' battle now is mostly PR, not technical - and they are losing bad.....

The battle is that the vocal, activist community does not want them,...

Those that do want them are neither, vocal, active, committed or populous enough to turn the tide,...

SONGS may not be the better energy option for that customer base,...

It'll play out as it does,...

The Vegas line is 5:1 against both units being on-line and putting power on the grid within the next three years,...[coffee]

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline Nuke of the North

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #566 on: May 22, 2013, 10:48 »
I disagree about their problems being mostly PR. Isn't their main problem the fact that the tubes in their new SGs are banging together?

The NRC had already given notice that they were ready to issue a "No Significant Hazards" ruling to SCE's answer to the CAL, giving permission for <70% trials. It was the whackos that sued (egged on by the press and virtually every City Council within a 50 mile radius) and got the The Atomic Licensing and Safety Board to issue the ruling last week stating that SCE's application was a DeFacto Operating License Amendment, putting the kibosh to the whole thing. After some equivocation, the NRC has stated the decision to grant a restart has now been postponed "indefinitely."

Now of course the argument can be made that these suits would have been filed no matter what, but the last thing SCE can afford right now is even more bad press. And parading around on Youtube in tacky Star Trek Uniforms certainly doesn't help their image either!
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Offline Rennhack

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« Last Edit: May 23, 2013, 09:33 by Rennhack »

Offline Nuke of the North

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #568 on: May 24, 2013, 05:18 »
Now the Brits have picked it up!

Quote
Set phasers to DUMB: Safety video filmed inside nuclear plant features employees in Star Trek spoof

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2330093/Uncovered-safety-video-filmed-inside-nuclear-plant-features-employees-Star-Trek-spoof.html#ixzz2UFOE0uXU
 
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Offline Rennhack

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Offline Nuke of the North

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #570 on: May 25, 2013, 02:23 »
BTW, anyone notice that the two engine nacels on the "USS SONGS" in the video are supposed to look like the two domes? Obviously someone had way too much time on their hands that day.

...and apparently so do I... ;)
Es braust unser Panzer Im Sturmwind dahin!

Offline HydroDave63

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #571 on: May 25, 2013, 03:04 »
Have other plants managed to get a License Amendment done in 6 months or less, from a flat-footed start?

Offline jams723

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #572 on: May 25, 2013, 06:50 »
Have other plants managed to get a License Amendment done in 6 months or less, from a flat-footed start?

It is possible to get an extingent request through but this would not qualify (IMO, but it has aspects that could meet the requirement).   NRC standard timeline is one year for a LAR.

Offline retired nuke

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #573 on: May 28, 2013, 11:05 »
Remember who you love. Remember what is sacred. Remember what is true.
Remember that you will die, and that this day is a gift. Remember how you wish to live, may the blessing of the Lord be with you

Offline Nuke of the North

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Re: San Onofre (SONGS)
« Reply #574 on: May 28, 2013, 09:45 »
Another nail...
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/05/28/sen-boxer-wants-justice-department-probe-on-troubled-california-nuclear-plant/

Although what credibility the DOJ has about now... I don't know.

Just blame it all on the (Star Trek) Video...
Es braust unser Panzer Im Sturmwind dahin!

 


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