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Offline Kernwerker

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seal table ?
« on: Sep 11, 2006, 01:08 »
Hi folks

I have a work colleague, here in our  plant in Southern Germany who would like to know the correct definition of a "seal table"
To be honest, me to   ;)
This term is most likely referrable to the job activities of a refuel technician 
« Last Edit: Sep 12, 2006, 01:35 by Kernwerker »
I work at a place with almost 2400 MW's of pure power! At the same time governed from Berlin with 100000 MW,s of bs!

A fair fight? Thats just one where theres a 50/50 chance youll LOSE. Would you b

alphadude

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #1 on: Sep 11, 2006, 08:27 »
Incore instrumentation pentration seals?

Offline Nuclear NASCAR

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #2 on: Sep 11, 2006, 09:22 »
Incore instrumentation pentration seals?

That's what it is at our plant.  I&C technicians handle work in this area at our location.
"There is much pleasure to be gained from useless knowledge."

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Offline Kernwerker

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #3 on: Sep 11, 2006, 09:28 »
Incore instrumentation pentration seals?

Have no Idea. He just told he saw a job description here on the site about a "refuel technician with seal table service experience.
I work at a place with almost 2400 MW's of pure power! At the same time governed from Berlin with 100000 MW,s of bs!

A fair fight? Thats just one where theres a 50/50 chance youll LOSE. Would you b

alphadude

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #4 on: Sep 11, 2006, 11:52 »
well depending of the design of the plant incore seal work for HPs will involve working with materials that were subjected to incore irradiation. If the seals leaked you will have lots of contamination, with particles. If not you may just be pulling the incore which can be megga rad. parking the incores involves pulling the incores our prior to refuel to a certain location. (dose control) I have worked incore tables where the seal leaked and it looked like a wedding cake with all the boron encrusted, and I have worked incores while at Big Rock that was a walk in the park. Also worked at flux mapping on one old unit where the incore was inserted- copper detector- then timed and then pulled to take a dose rate- high dose rate = hot core section.  the drives can be contaminated with particles and stuff if the tubes leaked etc yadda and so on.

Offline Kernwerker

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #5 on: Sep 12, 2006, 04:45 »
well depending of the design of the plant incore seal work for HPs will involve working with materials that were subjected to incore irradiation. If the seals leaked you will have lots of contamination, with particles. If not you may just be pulling the incore which can be megga rad. parking the incores involves pulling the incores our prior to refuel to a certain location. (dose control) I have worked incore tables where the seal leaked and it looked like a wedding cake with all the boron encrusted, and I have worked incores while at Big Rock that was a walk in the park. Also worked at flux mapping on one old unit where the incore was inserted- copper detector- then timed and then pulled to take a dose rate- high dose rate = hot core section.  the drives can be contaminated with particles and stuff if the tubes leaked etc yadda and so on.

My work colleague and I are a bit puzzled what you actually mean  ::) Although I would say that I have relatively fair knowledge of US or English nuke lingo I still cant comprehend what you actually mean by "seal" . Do you mean with incores (vermutlich Kerneinbauten) components like core structure (Kerngerüst obere und untere) and control  rod drive shafts (Steuerstabantriebstangen)? We are stilll a bit confused what  you mean with "seal".
Nuclear Nascar said something about incore instrumentation (Kerninstrumentierung)  pentration seals? We still have no clue.

I work at a place with almost 2400 MW's of pure power! At the same time governed from Berlin with 100000 MW,s of bs!

A fair fight? Thats just one where theres a 50/50 chance youll LOSE. Would you b

Offline PWHoppe

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #6 on: Sep 12, 2006, 06:16 »
My work colleague and I are a bit puzzled what you actually mean  ::) Although I would say that I have relatively fair knowledge of US or English nuke lingo I still cant comprehend what you actually mean by "seal" . Do you mean with incores (vermutlich Kerneinbauten) components like core structure (Kerngerüst obere und untere) and control  rod drive shafts (Steuerstabantriebstangen)? We are stilll a bit confused what  you mean with "seal".
Nuclear Nascar said something about incore instrumentation (Kerninstrumentierung)  pentration seals? We still have no clue.

Marco,

The in-cores have to do with the neutron flux mapping system of the core. The seal table area is where the electrical connectons and the TIP's (Transversing Incore Probe) are withdrawn to either changeout or to perform maintenance. Shortly after shutdown they are exrtremely "hot" radiologically speaking, until some decay takes place. They remain hot due to activation but do decay some after a bit. They remain a contamination problem however. The work is typically done by instrument & control system personnel (I&C) and always assisted by HP people.

Hope this helps... Sorry if it doesn't, but I am the dumbest man on the planet :o
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alphadude

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #7 on: Sep 12, 2006, 08:20 »
yes a pressure boundary seal-like pump seal, or pressure retention packing or fitting. in the old units the seal table look just like that- a table with couplings that were sealed to reactor temp and pressure. the couplings were removed. the seals opened and the incore instrumentation pulled or whatever. some units had fixed seals and had incore pits where high pressure flanges were located, others had a drive and selector table that the incore instrument could be withdrawn and reinserted to another quadrant of the core for flux mapping etc. the oldest units had the table with fixed incore instruments.

Offline Kernwerker

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #8 on: Sep 12, 2006, 09:17 »
Marco,

The in-cores have to do with the neutron flux mapping system of the core. The seal table area is where the electrical connectons and the TIP's (Transversing Incore Probe) are withdrawn to either changeout or to perform maintenance. Shortly after shutdown they are exrtremely "hot" radiologically speaking, until some decay takes place. They remain hot due to activation but do decay some after a bit. They remain a contamination problem however. The work is typically done by instrument & control system personnel (I&C) and always assisted by HP people.

Hope this helps... Sorry if it doesn't, but I am the dumbest man on the planet :o

Thanks alot Hoppe even though I am not Marco, he is the other German guy working at the nuclear powerstation in Neckarwestheim Germany.  ;D Thanks to you guys and your statement about the TIP's (Kugelmesssystem "JKQ") we finally have a clue ;)
« Last Edit: Sep 12, 2006, 11:00 by Kernwerker »
I work at a place with almost 2400 MW's of pure power! At the same time governed from Berlin with 100000 MW,s of bs!

A fair fight? Thats just one where theres a 50/50 chance youll LOSE. Would you b

Offline Kernwerker

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #9 on: Sep 12, 2006, 09:40 »
yes a pressure boundary seal-like pump seal, or pressure retention packing or fitting. in the old units the seal table look just like that- a table with couplings that were sealed to reactor temp and pressure. the couplings were removed. the seals opened and the incore instrumentation pulled or whatever. some units had fixed seals and had incore pits where high pressure flanges were located, others had a drive and selector table that the incore instrument could be withdrawn and reinserted to another quadrant of the core for flux mapping etc. the oldest units had the table with fixed incore instruments.

Now I Know what you guys mean. Well thanks alot for your patience. 8) I was just looking at pics we made during our last outage. Because we had to some repair work on one of our instrumentation units (If I may call it that way)
I work at a place with almost 2400 MW's of pure power! At the same time governed from Berlin with 100000 MW,s of bs!

A fair fight? Thats just one where theres a 50/50 chance youll LOSE. Would you b

Offline Marlin

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #10 on: Sep 12, 2006, 12:48 »
Kernworker, I like your signature line. Its not any different here.  :)

(Yes Mike I know I'm off topic, but I mean well :))

Offline PWHoppe

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #11 on: Sep 13, 2006, 06:29 »
Thanks alot Hoppe even though I am not Marco, he is the other German guy working at the nuclear powerstation in Neckarwestheim Germany.  ;D

Sorry, :D  Just goes to prove that I really AM the dumbest man on the planet :P
If a chicken and a half can lay an egg and a half in a day and a half, how many days will it take a grasshopper with a rubber foot to kick a hole in a tin can?

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #12 on: Sep 13, 2006, 10:17 »
'n alla dis cornfusion shows eye ain't da onliest person whut kneads translation now 'n den.   ;)
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Offline Kernwerker

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #13 on: Sep 15, 2006, 12:59 »
well depending of the design of the plant incore seal work for HPs will involve working with materials that were subjected to incore irradiation. If the seals leaked you will have lots of contamination, with particles. If not you may just be pulling the incore which can be megga rad. parking the incores involves pulling the incores our prior to refuel to a certain location. (dose control) I have worked incore tables where the seal leaked and it looked like a wedding cake with all the boron encrusted, and I have worked incores while at Big Rock that was a walk in the park. Also worked at flux mapping on one old unit where the incore was inserted- copper detector- then timed and then pulled to take a dose rate- high dose rate = hot core section.  the drives can be contaminated with particles and stuff if the tubes leaked etc yadda and so on.

I just have one more question to this subject. Where do you pull out the encores? My work colleague heard that you pull the instrumentation unit from the bottom of the vessel? I am just a bit confused because with your statement about boron encrustment, I was imagining a vessel head full of boron prior taking the head off. Well you guessed it right we pull the instrumentation unit from the top underwater when the reactor cavity is flooded for refueling and the encore instrumentation is on a defined spot in the fuel pool
I work at a place with almost 2400 MW's of pure power! At the same time governed from Berlin with 100000 MW,s of bs!

A fair fight? Thats just one where theres a 50/50 chance youll LOSE. Would you b

Offline Marlin

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #14 on: Sep 15, 2006, 01:52 »
I just have one more question to this subject. Where do you pull out the encores? My work colleague heard that you pull the instrumentation unit from the bottom of the vessel? I am just a bit confused because with your statement about boron encrustment, I was imagining a vessel head full of boron prior taking the head off. Well you guessed it right we pull the instrumentation unit from the top underwater when the reactor cavity is flooded for refueling and the encore instrumentation is on a defined spot in the fuel pool

Incores come out of the top (CE) or the bottom (Westinghouse) depending on design and in some (B&W) a separate incore tank is used for storage that is separate from the fuel pool. The boron is a crust left by leakage, just as calcium builds up on a shower head or faucet but only in PWRs.

Offline Kernwerker

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Re: seal table ?
« Reply #15 on: Sep 18, 2006, 05:33 »
Incores come out of the top (CE) or the bottom (Westinghouse) depending on design and in some (B&W) a separate incore tank is used for storage that is separate from the fuel pool. The boron is a crust left by leakage, just as calcium builds up on a shower head or faucet but only in PWRs.

So it depends on the manufacturer! Nice one I didnt realize that thanks for the info. We also have occasional boron encrustments in our  PWR unit. Nothing wild though.
I work at a place with almost 2400 MW's of pure power! At the same time governed from Berlin with 100000 MW,s of bs!

A fair fight? Thats just one where theres a 50/50 chance youll LOSE. Would you b

 


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