Rent a tech Union debate

[alphadude]

I will give you a good example of a union that fits the needs of people that work only part time, have to travel to difficult locations, each location is different and requires a wide range of skills, SAG and IATSE  movie workers- pay is high, retirement is fantastic, entry level electrician is $30.00 an hour and so on.. unions are what you make of them..

Oh and dont forget baseball and foot ball- the players union

HP technician is a defined skill/craft/trade. Some of us forget that the line of definintion is blurred because of non-union issues and we tend to wander into rad eng, ALARA, etc which in reality is outside of the craft but associated with it.  RCT as defined and used by DOE is an ideal description of the HP Tech craft.

Collective bargaining organizations for a well defined craft is an advantage for that craft- not an advantage for individuals that may or may not work below standards, wish to work out side of the craft if requested, those that have other means of retirement income, seek management advantage, like to use personal connections to get more than their fellow craft, use their advanced skills or connections to belittle other in the craft, seek to move to management, wish to advance a political idea to "get rid of unions", and so on...

If I were a company owner concerned about the most profit I could get.. I would go non-union, its that simple.  I can keep wages lower, not offer as much in benefits, pay people different rates that do the same work- devious you say -NO ITS BUSINESS! 

If I was a company board member in it for the long haul- well beyond my life time and had many employees... I would go union- products tend to be better quality, training is easily accomplished, I can predict costs well into the future because I know the rates paid to workers are standardized, management has to only deal with one individual in general (the union) about work conditions..

I tend to think that HP techs are more like the movie workers union- limited amount of people, unique skills and so on.. this is an IDEAL situation to get a whole lots more pay-face it- no HPS and 20% of the electric power in the US has some problems-big time! But as long as individuals say no to the unions- pay will stay about the same..


Oh and in reality pay has only gone up about 2.3% per year in 27 years.. I was making $18.00 an hour with RAD in 1979... well below the cost of living increases. (assuming $29/hr)

The 6%/year rate for 8 years dont sound right maybe if you went from jr decon to srhp. Thats a 48% increase in pay in 8 years. wow!

[Eric_Bartlett]

Sorry JJ, I know I said I wouldn't take sides and I'm trying not too.  But i have to address a couple of things you've posted my friend...

...they want most of the money for themselves..

Yes the companies want the money for themselves, that's why they are in business - Techs want the money for themselves, that's why they work, and last but not least The UNIONS want the money for themselves, that's how they stay alive.  When it comes down to it - all parties concerned want the money.  Now taking all that into account - the workers getting their piece, the companies getting theirs then throw in the unions - yes the unions may be able to get the techs higher pay rates and big benefits - look what this has done to the airline industry, the car industry, and others - Americas unions have out priced Americas workers thus our jobs go overseas.  I say this not as a recruiter for one of the companies but as a worker...long before I even knew what this industry was all about I was a humble non-union construction worker, I laid pipe, poured concrete, did masonry work, roofed and did general carpentry - some of the time working next to union employees, those times I didn't work next to a union employee were the times that the union contract companies were forced to come in to high on their bids due to the Union increase in monies needed.  So instead of working next to them, I normally had to drive thru them to get into the site as they picketed for their union, even though their union was the one that caused them to be priced out of the running - go figure.   As I've stated before, I can work with both Union and non union contracts, don't matter to me - just be careful what you wish for ...it is my humble opinion that the "golden age" of unions is over, but that's not to say that representation is out of the question.  I know this will get people irked, but please realize I'm not advocating against any type of organization or unionizing - I'm advocating that you all weigh your options and do what is going to best for you and your family, whether its unions or not.  Form your own opinions; make your own decisions, because ultimately it is you and yours that will be affected.  The utilities will still be here. The companies will still be here.  The unions will still be here. 

...The IBEW wants everyone to be represented, deconners, DOE, HP's, Dosimetry,Marssims, D & D,ect...JJ

One last note that I did post previously - You say the IBEW wants to represent everyone...that was not the case last go around - they wanted dues from everyone but classified Decon techs as unskilled labor thus not entitled to representation...that came from their own handbook circa March, 1990.  Hopefully that has changed and it's not another scam to fatten their coffers like before. Once again don't get me wrong, I have personally staffed IBEW jobs, have found them to be some of the best (and likewise some of the worst) that I have ever staffed - A job is only what the individual, their co-workers and management make of it.   Anyways, I'll probably be put in the corner for putting my 2 unsolicited cents in.  As always, good luck JJ on your struggle, and good luck to those that oppose.  I look forward to observing this ever changing industry as all this unfolds.

Peace out,
Eric

[alphadude]

I tend to agree with Eric, however wouldn't staffing be transfered to the local and not handled by a company such as Bartlett if techs were organized? If that is the case, there would be a distinct disadvantage for rent-a-tech companies to advocate unions.

[fueldryer]

- look what this has done to the airline industry, the car industry, and others - Americas unions have out priced Americas workers thus our jobs go overseas.

Very well said Eric,pretty much sums it up in a nut shell.Karma to ya.
Good luck to everyone in this struggle.

[alphadude]

the examples presented are typical ones that everybody uses. Why not select unions that have done well? I just did SAG and IATSE, & the players unions. As far as work going overseas- well for $0.18 an hour (China) hell I'd sell out too. So how would you out source HP techs to china- use remote reading instruments? 

Here is a plan.. for management.. Increase the amount of people being trained for HPs. Start training programs in house, take in entry level, go out to tech schools and support those. In 5 years- cost of contractor techs would drop about 1/4 due to the influx of more trained workers trying to fill only so many positions.. people would take less money in an effort to support a degrading life style. Getting trainees would be easy since pay grades are at an all time high.. this would serve as an enticement and semi-skilled workers are easy to get due to recent economic issues associated with the White House Agenda.

In about 7 years the costs would drops even lower..reflecting lower pay rates, thus ensuring a ready supply of technicians that would be willing to accept lower wage.. profits would increase and shareholders would be happy.  The minor wage paid to technicians is passed to the rate payer- thus profits are ensured.

[biloxoi blues]

I also do agree with Eric, that the companies want the money just like the unions want their money.  If everyone wants their freedom and one less thing to go through wouldnt it be better financially if we dont have either the company or union.  We already have to go through the recruiters, then the cordinator, and then finally the plant itself.    Also there was a response about the "Good ole boy" in the union.  Well if you dont think there is a "Good ole boy" in the companies we work for then ya been in the "cavity hole" too long.

[Brett LaVigne]

- look what this has done to the airline industry, the car industry, and others - Americas unions have out priced Americas workers thus our jobs go overseas.

Very well said Eric,pretty much sums it up in a nut shell.Karma to ya.
Good luck to everyone in this struggle.

I will third that!  I live in an area that was destroyed by plant closures and layoffs, beautiful Flint, MI.  You may have also heard of Delphi, also here.  They were actually in bankruptcy and to stay alive were trying to get workers to take a pay cut to stay competetive (remember that janitors in the auto industry make house SR. HP wages) Instead of taking a couple of less dollars/hour (ie. $22 - $23 instead of $27 - $30) and still having a job when the dust settled they threatened to strike.  Meanwhile, small companies are popping up all over that pay a fair wage and benefits (ie. $18 - $20/hour) for the making the same parts that Delphi does.  Now, nobody has a job.  That is union mentality at it's finest.

Gee, I wonder why a decent new car costs $30K plus!?

By the way...My father was a commitee man (union stewart) for the last 10 years of his tenure with GM.  We have discussed this issue many times over the past few years.  He agrees that the golden years of the union are over, they served the purpose of getting abused labor forces fair treatment years ago and now we have a guy who is supposed to be sweeping the floor at the auto plant for $30 bucks/hour but he is not right now because he is busy greiving the fact that his boss doesn't want him to watch TV in the locker room for 10 hours/day on overtime (real story).

I have probably worn out my welcome on this issue with most, I will just watch now.

Have a great spring all...

[biloxoi blues]

Yes I do agree that some unions have outpriced themselves out of work (ford is the next one) thats is one thing we dont have to worry about with our companies.

[Eric_Bartlett]

I tend to agree with Eric, however wouldn't staffing be transfered to the local and not handled by a company such as Bartlett if techs were organized? If that is the case, there would be a distinct disadvantage for rent-a-tech companies to advocate unions.

All depends - way i think it would work is that the contract company would have to hit the local up for the people, kinda like the big construction outfits hit the local(s) up for their peeps...what i think'll throw the monkey wrench in the works is that there are a myriad of house unions out there that the road tech union would have to capitulate too if they wanna do buisness on that site...but then again, i'm no expert on this. Truthfully wouldn't want to be, have enough headaches as it is.

[alphadude]

All examples cited are the results of poor management NOT unions. Ford, airlines, steel etc their management didnt see the market trends or upgrade their systems to compete in the international markets. Blaming the unions is a nice excuse but other auto worker in other countries get paid as much or more than their american counter part-they just have a better designed product. Those better products are the results of engineering-a management responsiblility.  Unions didnt price themselves out of a job-their management did...good propaganda but not true.

True enuff on your comment Eric. Good debate.. but as we can see a lot of people are clouded by what the steel workers did or what the airlines did and so on. Its an apples to oranges comparison- yes both are fruit... 

[Shawnee Man]

You always hear the comments about pay in the decade of the 70's and 80's for workers. How does this compare with management pay, such as CEOs?

[alphadude]

The pay is not in the 70s and 80s for workers-unless you throw in overtime. Base pay should only be counted. As for CE0s (nuke power) one of our ex prez retired at $1000 a day for the rest of his life-which was lower than his base pay. Poor guy can barely afford pay out to the two ex wives.

[Marlin]

In the eighty's I was paid $700 to $800 travel each way for travel from Illinois to the New England plants that I normally worked. With the outages so short this is a very large drop in compensation. I haven't traveled in over ten years but I have heard $200 one way only that is a several thousand dollar drop each year right there. In relative pay I made as much or more per hour than the house techs I worked with, that is no longer the case.

Sorry, I will return to my neutral corner as promised.

[klsas]

Alphadude, don't blame bad management for all of the current industrial problems in various industries. It was bad management to give the workers some of the things they got. Some examples of union greed; Inability for Ford, GM and others to cut costs by closing or consolidating plants, if the union didn't agree, the plant couldn't be closed or they had to give work / income gaurantee for extended periods of time after they were laid off. This is the same as if I were to look at Exelon and say they had to pay me from the last layoff in Nov until I went to work in the spring. Another example is that most industrial unions started doing grandfather clauses in their contracts in the late 80's to protect the older workers. An example of this would be that most contracts had a fair pay structure initially and suppose there was a 3% wage increase accross the board per year in a contract. Say the company had to cut costs. Instead of agreeing to a 1.5% raise per year, the senior members would keep their 3% and newer workers might get 1% over the life of the contract. This did occur in my case as a paper worker many moons ago as well as when my wife was a steelworker.

All I'm saying is don't blame management for all of the problems. Sure it makes the concept of a union look better if someone else takes the blame. Whether I would join or not join a union is not relative. When I can't go when and where I want or I'm not satisfied with what the staffing company is offering, I'll stay home and find something else to occupy my time.

Keith

[alphadude]

Point being the examples given were not driven to destruction by the Unions.. both unions and management share the responsibility but ultimately the owners must take most of the burden of short sighted economics. All american automotive companies suffered from the imperial family syndrome Chrysler, Ford etc, and thought those big gas hogs that broke in about 40,000 miles would keep selling..how is that the unions fault?  Steel didnt change to new technology and see the need for the special metals-Japan did!  Unions I would say hold 30% of the issues but ultimately-its the owners that must supply the vision to substain production.  As for your example-who agreed to those contracts- management.

Again what do automotive unions have to do with a HP tech union? not a lot.  Doctors do fairly well with the AMA which is a thinly desguised union. 

And now I will change to anti-union!

[RAD-GHOST]

Bat man, the numbers don't lie!  Wage & Per Diem increases of 6% are just about on the money!  Of course the benefit reduction of greater than 6% needs to be tossed into the formula.  Statistics, you got to love them, the ability of proving a point from any perspective, right, wrong, or otherwise!     

TEMPS:  Yes we are, but lucky for us, temps with a unique set of skills and qualifications, govern by federally recognized standards.  I must also mention that we are probably one of the smallest groups of manpower, in any US market, with this type of unique criteria. The commercial industry has recognized the increasing shortage of qualified technicians for well over a decade.  They have even drafted concerns on the subject.  The NRC has also voiced their concerns on the issues of numbers and quality.  Just a bunch of politicians sitting around crying that the sky is falling!  Collecting their checks, rubbing their necks and hoping that the problem will solve itself before the finger pointing starts!  The façade of being a dime a dozen has long gone by the road side, unless you're buying the bull!   

When the companies require our services, they don't have option B, C, or D!  They need qualified technicians, in certain numbers, for a certain duration and on a certain date....PERIOD!  I believe you and a couple of others have mentioned concerns over your opportunities, due to substandard performers.  Guess what, our trade is so low in qualified manpower, that the company your working for will also hire those individual at the same rate as you, maybe even higher!  There really isn't any mystery on who can and who can't in the industry, but the nature of the game is how many and at what profit margin!  Test my theory, next time you're assigned with one of them, call the home office and complain!  You'll be working with them again within the year, and with the same company!

Travel Expenses, capped or not:  That subject does frustrate me!  I have yet to understand the technician's acceptance of traveling on their own time and their own dime!  So much per mile, is solely for vehicle use expenses.  What about wages, food, hotels and other expenses?  I know you don't use it all, sleep in the car, take showers in flying-J's and Mc D's breakfast is only $4.00!  If your traveling five states for an assignment, guess what, that facility probably doesn't have the local talent they require.  Somehow, somebody decided that it is our responsibility to absorb the lost wages, for the days of travel!  Imagine that, you're actually doing them a favor and taking an economic lose to do it!  Do the math on that one, figure out how much your loss is for the year!  You can add all the justification to the equation you want to, (car gets 100 MPG, I sleep in the back seat, a bag of twink's and 6 pack of Pepsi is two days, of three squares, on the road). A day to travel in and another one to get home is two days of lost wages!  Five assignments a year and you just lost two weeks pay!  Like you said, "Travel Expenses are not Income"!  I feel fairly safe in saying that the contract company managers are probably doing things different!

Here's a Good Question:

"Did the doctor, lawyer, engineer, marketing executive, CAD operator have to pay for their college education"? 

The actual answer is:

Initially I believe the majority of them did, I said majority, not all!  After that, I believe many of them paid nothing for advanced training and education!  After all, once they received their sheep skin they're good as gold!  I would venture to say, their employers, probably pushed and paid for all of their advancement opportunities, salaries and travel expenses included!  Most companies want the horse power of higher educated employees, actually most companies HR departments are required to screen for an employees potential.   

That's also quite a population of careers you picked.  I haven't researched the numbers, but I would consider it a fair guess, that the number of qualified technicians in the industry today, is a mere percentage of each of those disciplines.  There are probably more doctors in Florida than HP technicians in the world!  I believe further research would prove that they are all members of some form of professional organization, with some form of representation. Be it a board of peers, or a lobbyist in Washington.  You know what I mean, someone looking out for their best interest!  I know we have the contract companies doing that!       

Benefits:  There are a number of ways to deal with the issue, even as temporary staff.  I've seen situations where an employee organization obtains funds from the employer, on behalf of the employee, for each hour worked.  The employee benefits are maintained based on an accumulated number of work hours per year!  1250 hours, per year, rings a bell!     

Vacation, Holiday pay, Sick pay:

I assumed you had been in the business for a while, the vacation pay still exists for some companies, you simply have to work 50 weeks out of the year, I believe you even mentioned one of those companies in a prior posting!  Holiday pay has recently vanished at some sites, not all sites, some sites!  Sick pay has been gone for quite some time, unless you are in the world of DOE.  Then you call it PTO! 

How about that DOE stuff?  Strangely enough they have this little federal directive that specifies the employee benefits!  The commercial world is going to hate this, it guarantees all the benefits we're discussing, some optional at the employees discretion!  The employer has to supply the benefits, or turn the funds over to the employee!  You read right, give the money back to the employee!  At most DOE facilities, this equated to about $2.00 to $2.50 per work hour if you turn down the company health insurance, even that company you mentioned before was held to this standard!  Some sites also pay your PTO and Holiday pay hourly!

In the commercial world, private contracts, they don't have to do that and their not going to do that!  Let's do a little business management 102!  When submitting a proposal, or bid, it is acceptable and justifiable to calculate staff expenses, such as company health benefits, UCI and taxes.  Obviously any expense driven by a state or federal requirement is considered reasonable and acceptable by the customer.  If you don't take the companies health benefits, where do you think that money is going?  Enough said on that subject.   

Temporary contractors have different needs?  Food, clothing, shelter, mortgage, utility bills, car payment and insurance!  Somebody help me out here, what am I missing?

"R.Ghost, you sound like you are bitter about your career"

Not actually "Bitter", but "Better"! I love the science, industry and people!  I still maintain a specific, continuous education agenda in the trade, three certifications and $2,500.00 out of pocket last year.  This year it's going to be French and German lessons, (which I strongly recommend to all commercial technicians).  Of course, from a contractor perspective, I may have a few additional opportunities than are not afforded to you, but that's the benefit of all that unnecessary training and certifications. 

In today's Industry; Adequate is Antiquated!

Learn Your Worth and Realize the Worth of Your Peers!


Sorry for being so long winded, RG!

[RAD-GHOST]

Hey EB, life would be better! 

How about a list of technicians, their qualifications, current training, certifications, physicals, availability, security information and requests for assignment, all at the touch of a button.  Think about that, your phone would never ring, recruiters wouldn't have to call and the company cost saving of eliminating that pesky recruiter department!

Hummm....Probably not a good politicaly correct selling point, it could possibly put you out of a job!

Not to worry, I'd hire you!

Ain't heard from you in a while!  Heard your the top dog in the recruiting department, since Brian left. 

Luck at you, RG!

[biloxoi blues]

Why would a company bid on a contract that puts a cap on the travel if they care about the techs that are making the money for them?

[SloGlo]

You always hear the comments about pay in the decade of the 70's and 80's for workers. How does this compare with management pay, such as CEOs?

i didn't google this so don't slam me, but i recently herd that in the 70s, ceo pay was ~20 times (union) labor  today it is 2000 times.

[SloGlo]

Dont some companies already have to some degree that type of program in place  without me paying union dues for it 

with all the reading on previous posts @ this thread and others, it would definitely appear that most, if not all, of the technician rental companies do not have a program in place a training  program.  da good news is that you don't hafta pay for it.

[SloGlo]

Training...It would be great to get better training and I have touched on that in a previous post but here is a question for you.  Did the doctor, lawyer, engineer, marketing executive, CAD operator have to pay for their college education?

Medical...Again, we are temporary staff and in most cases work only part of the year.

In fact I will put the last 3 together.

Vacation, Holiday pay, sick pay...WE WORK FOR A TEMP. AGENCY.

re: training.. outside of the cad operator, these other professions have written contracts in place which govern their compesation or are business owners.  neither of which is applicable to contract techs.

re: the rest of the listed here.. temp agency is an employer.  lotsa employers are in effect temp agencies.  chicago
rebridge and iron comes to mind.  so does stone&webster.  wotinell duz that hafta due with compensation?[/b]

[SloGlo]

Gee, I wonder why a decent new car costs $30K plus!?

'n why is toyota beating da crap outa u.s. domestic producers, when toyota is using union labor to build cars sold in da u.s. of a.?
it's freaking managment. 
domestic auto producers agreed to the contracts.  so did the unions.  but it's da unions fault? 

when yer driving down da road, do yew listen to the radio?  that announcer you hear is a union person.  most radio/tv gigs are 13 weeks in duration.  maybe there's something to that union thing, huh?

[RDTroja]

Like some others I have purposely avoided weighing in on the flailing of this horse. There are good arguements on both sides of the issue and the advocates have done well in presenting questions and answers for and against. I doubt seriously that anyone has been swayed to the point of being pushed off of their opinion.

I am not going to get into the 'are unions good' debate. The answer is yes and no. They are responsible for a lot of the things workers can now take for granted including tolerable working conditions. They are also responsible for a lot of abuse.

The debate for us needs to focus on 'what do we have,' 'what do we want' and 'what will it cost us?' Focusing on 'what do we have compared to the house techs' is totally irrelevant. The tasks and skills are the same, but the conditions are polar opposites. If you want stability, slightly higher hourly rates, benefits, and the same day-to-day working life, then by all means become a house tech. There are lots of jobs out there. Along with those conditions you will also get some people that you can't stand working with and can't get away from, a LOT of corporate BS, back-stabbing and politics, rotating shifts and people making a lot of decisions for you. It works for some people and not for others. If you want the freedom to chose when and where you work (with some limitations), like the idea of getting to leave about the same time you get fed up with the BS, don't enjoy the politics, and don't mind having your summers off, then maybe the life of a contract tech is good for you.

Can a union change some things for us and raise our wages? Probably so. What will be the cost? We do not know, but I can almost guarantee that the first thing to go will be some of the freedom. Is the money more important than the freedom? We all have to decide that for ourselves... hmmm... decide for ourselves. That would be one of the things that would definitely change. Some of the choices would go away. A couple of people have said that we would get to decide what goes into the negotiations (don't be fooled into thinking we can dictate terms of a contract... look up the word negotiate if you need help on that.) The problem here is that first you will have to sign the card committing yourself before you get any say at all. So, as the old saying goes, "Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances." Would it be worth it? Again, you decide. I have a hard time making decisions where I don't have all the information, and all the information won't be there until the cards are signed and our representatives complete the negotiations. And at the risk of sounding like a pessimist, there are only a handful of people in this industry that I want speaking for me. And somehow I don't think they would be the ones getting elected as representatives.

I happen to like my freedom more than I would like a couple of dollars an hour. That is why I am not working for a utility (among the other conditions listed above.) Others will have different priorities. I also move back and forth between technician jobs that would be in the union and ALARA or Rad Engineer jobs that would not. I like it that way, but unions have a hard time with that. I occasionally get the opportunity to do things that a union would probably not let me do. I like the variety.

I am not anti-union. I worked at Clinton a couple of years back and signed a card to do so. I signed a 'Local 1500' card in 1989. I just think that the trade off would be a bad one for me. As I have heard here many times before, 'I might be wrong.' But I get the feeling I am not.

[biloxoi blues]

Im starting to believe that the commercial road techs are getting treated like second rate techs(JJ might be right).  Working with the DOE techs they have a choice of direct deposit.  They actually get paid more for having to wear a respirator.  Could you imagine if we applied that to commercial? Well I think IM going to fail a couple of pee tests so I can get hired by DOE.  Hey is there anyway I can get my 2 dollars back per hour for unused health benefits, it would be nice to have a choice.  Im just so glad we work all those hours so the management and office people can get their vacation and sick days.   They deserve it and we dont.

[jjordan]

Eric,
It's always good to here your perspective! Do you take as much heat at work as I do? I'll bet you do! Don't listen to RadGhost! You've always been top dog for me. I think you are about 2/3rds correct. The companies want the money, and the techs want the money. You are correct on both counts. What everyone seems to miss here, yes the union wants some money. But the union is all of the workers! It's a non profit organization. Yes they have some high paid officers, but they are elected from the rank and file. Gee, maybe I could even become one. Naw, too many people here think I'm a pain. They make a good wage but it pales in comparison to the utility CEO's. Eric , I hate it for you, because your kind of caught in the middle, but it's not really a bad thing. there are over 700,000 members in the IBEW, quite an impressive number. I don't think that paying some people a good salary to manage that many people is a bad thing, they deserve a fair wage too. The membership can control this too. Do you think they take a big raise automatically without approval? Blaming the unions for the demise of the airlines, and auto industry is also a little bit of a stretch.I just went to VEGAS, and the airport was still busy as hell. Some of the players in trouble, were missmanaged, the survivors weren't. Check the troubled ones pension funds, some are insolvent. Do you think the union did that? They fought to get a pension for their members. It was stolen and or missmanaged by some unscroupulos businessmen. Naturally they blame someone else, I would if I were them too. (11 and the price of oil might have had a little bit to do with their struggles also. Automotive industry was also missmanaged, and still is. Ford is in financial disgrace right now today! Last week I went to their website to price a new car. A 2007 Shelby GT 500. Hot car lists in the mid $40,000's. Everyone would love to have one at this price. They are only making 10,000. You can only get them from certain dealers Ford has choosen. I had the local one call me to tell me they had a convertible, that they would let me have for well over $70,000. Thank You very much. the dealer is pocketing every dime over what he paid to inventory this car and Ford doesn't get a dime of the extra from this contrived shortage.. Why doesn't Ford make 500,000 or 750,000 or as many as will sell, and save their own ass. This is all the unions fault too, I suppose. I worked construction too, same as Eric, first non union for slightly better than minimum wage and no benies. I got my card in 75, and my wages near tripled and had awsome benies. Now rule number one is: The Company always has to make money. If they don't, wipe you __s with your union card, it aint worth a thing. Rule number two: You want big money, you need to do big work. The unions and the companies need to be both fair and resonable when negotiating. The union needs to be self policing also. If thay have substandard members, they need to help bring them up to speed. Eric I think you're the best, save me a slot, I'm probably gonna need it!
JJ