NukeWorker Forum

Career Path => Navy Nuke => Navy:Getting In => Topic started by: dcfowler on Sep 26, 2011, 11:59

Title: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: dcfowler on Sep 26, 2011, 11:59: Greetings members of nukeworker.com! First off I'd like to say that I am very impressed by what I have read thus far trolling the forum. Like many others, researching my own predicament regarding entry into the Navy Nuke program has brought me here and I too have some questions. Let me start with a basic outline leading up to me finding this website.

I must apologize if I come off as whining or my "saga" is offensive to anyone. I have the utmost respect for the men and women that have sacrificed, continue to sacrifice, or are going to sacrifice their freedom to defend my own freedom and that of our fellow countryfolk. I hope to count myself amongst the ranks!

Late July/early August I went to the local Navy recruiter's office to seek out some options. Needless to say the following days had me taking the ASVABs, going to MEPS, etcetera. I was told I was an excellent candidate for the Nuke program and thus I was and still am very excited. Upon completion of MEPS (and the necessary security packet) I was enlightened with the fact (at 21 years old) that I had dual citizenship (I was born in the United States; my Mother was born here as well; but good ol' Pops was born in England, migrated to Canada at 1, then to the United States and remained a resident alien green card holder until he became a full citizen within the last ten years while still retaining his English citizenship as well). So I was advised that while a citizenship waiver was already in the works (other waivers were needed for tattoos but not for anything else) it could take up to a "few hours" to hear about it going through. Let me digress momentarily. I was told by the recruiters that my ASVAB line scores qualified me as an "alpha-nuke" and that I would not need to take the Nuke exam. Well, I ended up taking the exam as I was told passing it would expedite the waiver being approved. Several hours later and closing time for MEPS I was hit with this line from several people "... still no word on the waiver but what we can do is get you to sign for intelligence (my step-Dad was in Navy intelligence and I had asked him to go to the recruiters office with me as I figured having a second perspective, especially one with prior experience with the Navy, to cogitate what the recruiters had to say and decode :P for me what that really meant was a good idea and this of course implied i was interested in intelligence) which you won't leave for RTC until January and that will leave us plenty of time to get the waiver processed and get an Appendix B for Nuke." This was after my recruiter had tried the line repeatedly. He made it a point to tell people from then on that "I was a smart cookie" (smarter than the average bear eh Boo-Boo?). Not that I had anything against joining the Navy for intelligence, I am very appreciative of both opportunities they offered me, but to me if the difference between me getting into a rating I was (am) extremely excited about and something I still found intriguing but perhaps not as much, was waiting a few months I said I have nothing but time and I know we can work together on this and I'll sign without hesitation the contract for Nuke and leave the next day or whenever the Navy requests my service. Finding out that I had been cleared for intelligence but not for the Nuke program baffled me. I am under the impression that the intelligence specialist rating requires a top secret clearance while the Nuke ratings require a secret clearance. I inquired to my recruiters regarding this but apparently they either knew or pretended to know as little as I did about the regulations for ratings work. Well after leaving MEPs, neither of the recruiters had dealt with a dual citizen before so they really didn't know what to do with me. I still call them from time to time and ask about the status of the waiver but I get the feeling they really just wanted me to do the footwork to renounce my English citizenship. That is no issue at all (except for the ~$500+ bill! ha ha) I even tried to (only half-jokingly) renounce citizenship on the spot ;)
Like I said I've been staying in touch with the recruiters letting them know I'm still very interested and doing what I can to scrape up the necessary capital to complete the task at hand. Making good progress there so today I gave a ring to the Consulate-General in Atlanta.

They advised me that they go through this fairly regularly with dual citizens trying to renounce to meet security clearance requirements for the military and said I could send in my English passport and receive a declaration stating such had been done which would satisfy the requirement. As I explained to them I have never obtained nor attempted to obtain an English passport. They said that's fine simply send a letter requesting I be run through their passport system and I'll receive a declaration stating I neither have nor have had an English passport. The phone call completed and me overwhelmed with joy I called one of the recruiters. He said he wasn't familiar with that at all and that the other recruiter he works with was at MEPS right now and will call me immediately. That was earlier this morning. No worries, like I said I've got time. So to summarize this doctoral thesis, judging by what I've seen browsing the forum, there are a diverse group of present nukes, ex-nukes, and recruiters on board so I'm hoping someone has perhaps dealt with something similar to my situation? I don't have a problem renouncing citizenship or anything like that but if the letter from the consulate will satisfy the requirements that would be much quicker than sending out a form packet to England and also its FREE +K ! So any input would be most appreciated. I've run a search for dual citizenship information most of which is likely outdated. If anyone could shine a light on the subject of how I could be cleared for top secret clearance but not secret I'd be very interested.

Thank you for your time and patience in reading this unnecessarily long and drawn out rather simple-at-heart question (college habits die hard! ha ha), as well as for your efforts in responding, and for your time in (and out!) of the service.

Anonymous :-X
Close but no Sea-gar (yet).
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: retired nuke on Sep 26, 2011, 01:44: I have no answers for you. But after reading your post, I hope you get in.

my bet is on ELT somewhere in your Navy future.... :-X
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: dcfowler on Sep 27, 2011, 09:12: Quote from: HouseDad on Sep 26, 2011, 01:44
I have no answers for you. But after reading your post, I hope you get in.

my bet is on ELT somewhere in your Navy future.... :-X

Sir, thank you very much for reading my post and for your response. As previously stated, I'm very excited about this opportunity and will continue to wait patiently until someone on this site has some knowledge pertaining to my situation that they are willing to share or until my recruiters return my phone call from yesterday (hopefully with good news! +K). Thank you again for reading and taking the time to respond.
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: drayer54 on Sep 27, 2011, 12:59: Quote from: dcfowler on Sep 27, 2011, 09:12
Sir, thank you very much for reading my post and for your response. As previously stated, I'm very excited about this opportunity and will continue to wait patiently until someone on this site has some knowledge pertaining to my situation that they are willing to share or until my recruiters return my phone call from yesterday (hopefully with good news! +K). Thank you again for reading and taking the time to respond.
Get on facebook and look up "Bull Nuke" and ask him. I would take his word over anything posted in an anonymous :D online forum.

Your recruiting district should have a nuclear specific recruiter who specifically deals with clearances and getting you in.

Good luck to you. When you get accepted, I would recommend a Montecristo White or Rocky Patel Edge.
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: dcfowler on Sep 27, 2011, 01:52: Quote from: Drayer on Sep 27, 2011, 12:59
Get on facebook and look up "Bull Nuke" and ask him. I would take his word over anything posted in an anonymous :D online forum.

Your recruiting district should have a nuclear specific recruiter who specifically deals with clearances and getting you in.

Good luck to you. When you get accepted, I would recommend a Montecristo White or Rocky Patel Edge.

Thank you very much sir for your input. I sent a message via facebook as advised and look forward to a response. In hindsight, I understand your point about posting on an anonymous forum (by the looks of it I failed the anonymous portion of this exam :( ha ha). I look forward to someday partaking in a fine cigar but for the time being all "extra" capital is being stashed away should I need to pay the renunciation fees, hence For the time being, Marlboro Reds will have to fill the celebratory role I believe is referred to as a "victory smoke". Thank you again sir +K .
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: drayer54 on Sep 27, 2011, 01:57: Quote from: dcfowler on Sep 27, 2011, 01:52
I look forward to someday partaking in a fine cigar but for the time being all "extra" capital is being stashed away should I need to pay the renunciation fees, hence For the time being, Marlboro Reds will have to fill the celebratory role I believe is referred to as a "victory smoke". Thank you again sir +K .
Sounds more like a victory punishment than a celebration.

Good luck
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: MacGyver on Sep 27, 2011, 02:07: Quote from: dcfowler on Sep 27, 2011, 01:52
Thank you very much sir for your input. I sent a message via facebook as advised and look forward to a response. In hindsight, I understand your point about posting on an anonymous forum (by the looks of it I failed the anonymous portion of this exam :( ha ha). I look forward to someday partaking in a fine cigar but for the time being all "extra" capital is being stashed away should I need to pay the renunciation fees, hence For the time being, Marlboro Reds will have to fill the celebratory role I believe is referred to as a "victory smoke". Thank you again sir +K .

You can fix that by going to your original post and "mod'i'fy'ing" it. You press modify. You then remove your name. You then click on save. And, presto ... good as new.

Mac

Modified to add that you can change your screen name easy too. Go to your profile. Go then to Account Related Settings and at the top you can change your name. I believe you will then have to type in your password before you save it. You're welcome in advance.
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: drayer54 on Sep 27, 2011, 02:20: Quote from: MacGyver on Sep 27, 2011, 02:07
You can fix that by going to your original post and "mod'i'fy'ing" it. You press modify. You then remove your name. You then click on save. And, presto ... good as new.

Mac
I actually meant it as a joke because this forum isn't all that anonymous. Moderators can view your IP address and I'm sure with the appropriate motivation, we could find you.
I wouldn't worry about it. I haven't hid my identity from anyone because I have nothing to hide.
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: MacGyver on Sep 27, 2011, 02:25: Quote from: Drayer on Sep 27, 2011, 02:20
I actually meant it as a joke because this forum isn't all that anonymous. Moderators can view your IP address and I'm sure with the appropriate motivation, we could find you.
I wouldn't worry about it. I haven't hid my identity from anyone because I have nothing to hide.

What'ch'you talk'in 'bout Willis?!?!

(http://www.katzy.dsl.pipex.com/Smileys/Whistle.gif)
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: dcfowler on Sep 27, 2011, 02:27: Quote from: Drayer on Sep 27, 2011, 01:57
Sounds more like a victory punishment than a celebration.

Good luck

Touché sir! Well I must admit, I am equally as ill versed on fine cigars. How about a fine Montechristo White (Owl) ha ha or hack hack rather. I will take it upon myself to see that "Enjoy a fine cigar" finds it's way onto my bucket list.
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: retired nuke on Sep 27, 2011, 03:08: Quote from: Triumph-ant_BSA on Sep 27, 2011, 02:27
Touché sir! Well I must admit, I am equally as ill versed on fine cigars. How about a fine Montechristo White (Owl) ha ha or hack hack rather. I will take it upon myself to see that "Enjoy a fine cigar" finds it's way onto my bucket list.

http://www.cigarsinternational.com/prodDisp.asp?item=CS-WMA&cat=3 (http://www.cigarsinternational.com/prodDisp.asp?item=CS-WMA&cat=3)
http://www.cigarsinternational.com/prodDisp.asp?item=CS-EEA&cat=3 (http://www.cigarsinternational.com/prodDisp.asp?item=CS-EEA&cat=3)
http://www.cigarsinternational.com/prodDisp.asp?item=CS-RFA&cat=3 (http://www.cigarsinternational.com/prodDisp.asp?item=CS-RFA&cat=3)
http://www.wildturkeybourbon.com/ (http://www.wildturkeybourbon.com/)

Ahh, the perils of fitness for duty.... all that is left is cigars and whiskey.... 8)
Title: Re: Close but no Sea-gar?
Post by: dcfowler on Sep 28, 2011, 08:26: Quote from: adrenaline on Sep 27, 2011, 06:40
Hey there triumph, I've been going through the same thing actually

My mom was born in the UK and I went through the physical at MEPS and when I got done I came out and found that my
recruiter said I had to wait to sign and get into the DEP. Some things I've learned through research is that just because you
are a dual citizen through your parent's it does not mean you cannot get a security clearance; especially if you have not
acted on that citizenship (gotten a passport, voted in that country, etc.) However, I'm pretty sure that on the guidelines for
recruiters it says that for a recruit to get into the nuclear program, they cannot be a dual citizen. I'm not sure about other
programs, but maybe that isn't a requirement for intel? Not exactly sure though. I emailed my local british embassy and
got this reply ...

Dear Mr Someone

I refer to your appointment request to the British Consulate-General Somewhere.

To clarify, this is a process handled centrally at the British Embassy in Washington DC by myself.

Please send:

· Completed RN (all three pgs)

· Your British passport

· Copy of your US Passport

· Fee is taken in USD$ 498.65 (see attached payment form)

Post to

HOME OFFICE APPLICATION
CONSULAR SECTION
British Embassy
19 Observatory Circle NW
Washington DC 20008

Regards
Laurie Forsyth
202-588-6615

Laurie (Prickett) Forsyth
Pro Consul
British Embassy-Washington
FTN: 8430-6615
Fax: 202-588-7850

So I sent all the stuff required, including the 500 dollars to give up my BS "citizenship" and then got this letter ...

(http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/811/theuksucks.jpg)

So now I have to play the waiting game for up to 6 months before I can even get into the delayed entry program

It sucks cause if the navy told me, "Hey, you can go to basic tomorrow if you want, you ready?" I would do it, but
I guess I have to just wait it out for the 6 months from the letter and also from the time I get into the DEP until my
ship date.

Awesome.

Hey Adrenaline,
Thanks very much for the reply and excellent information. I talked with Laurie yesterday morning and she told me that the initial letter (I'm assuming the same one you posted a copy of) stating that all forms and payment had been received and forwarded to England for approval would be sufficient and that the letter could be faxed to the necessary place to approve security clearance/military entry. She said that this is quite common and assured me that what she had stated was correct. I sent an email to my recruiter asking him to confirm this but I have yet to receive a reply. From your post it seems that this initial letter is not sufficient and I'm also looking at 6 months before I can even be placed into the DEP. Thanks for the links you posted. I had already been to both of those and looked into the SF86 but it looks very similar to the security clearance forms I filled out at MEPS which is ironically how I found out about my dual citizenship -K. I never had a passport or any other document stating I was a citizen of England so it was quite a shock to me.

I'm hoping to get my RN form sent out this week. Rent isn't due for a few more weeks so I should be good as far as the fees go 8). Then I reckon it's more waiting for me. If you don't mind me asking how long ago did you send out your RN forms?
In the meantime, I was considering talking to the recruiters about signing for the IS rating, asking how long I'd be in the DEP for, and (most importantly!) if the option would still be open to *annex b for Nuke. Should I get a chance to speak with them I also plan on asking if I could join the reserves to expedite this journey by completing RTC and ,upon receiving my renunciation approval from England, make a transition to active duty as a Nuke. Might anyone have any input on either of these ideas?
Thanks again Adrenaline!

*Modified from appendix. I believe the new contract which replaces the initial is referred to as annex b not appendix. Corrections are welcome and encouraged!