Is it mandatory that I declare my time at college?

[lwrozans]

I spent less than a year at college due to some poor decision making. I would rather start from scratch than have to take claim to my grades and poor judgment.
I am currently filling out my final leg of paperwork prior to signing and was wondering if any of you know if I can slip under the radar by not making any claims of ever attending college.

[Neutron_Herder]

You don't want to begin your time in the Navy by not being entirely truthful...  Plus, you're not going to be the only one in the program that went to college and didn't finish.  The percentage of nukes with the same situation is much higher than you would think!

You'll hear this time and time again, but one of the foundations of the program is integrity, and you definitely don't want to start off under false pretenses.  Tell the truth now, and continue to!

[lwrozans]

Noted
I've been through 3 recruiters, so I've been fed contradicting information for the past 6 months
I appreciate the help

[Gamecock]

Noted
I've been through 3 recruiters, so I've been fed contradicting information for the past 6 months
I appreciate the help

Noted?

That is quite disrespectful.

If you want to be less then 100% honest, then we do not need you in the navy nuclear program.  The fact that you have to ask if its okay to lie tells me volumes about your integrity and what you'll do when you think no one is looking.  Perhaps you should consider another line of work, one where the lives of other people don't depend on you doing the right thing.

BTW... those recruiters that are telling you to be less then 100% honest should be fired.  I wish I could find out who they were

[lwrozans]

I am by no means trying to be disrespectful
It is not my integrity that should be questioned, but the guidance which I have been given by people you claim as your own
I have been advised to do things, I am bringing those things to light with all of you here
I am not telling you that I murdered several people, smoked crack on a regular basis, raped babies, and am considering leaving those things out of my paperwork
I am grateful for this forum and would like to remain part of it, not have it scrutinize every possible chance of misinterpretation

[Neutron_Herder]

I'll take you at your word that you're not trying to be disrespectful.  That being said, the word "noted" should be permanently removed from your vocabulary...  In the Navy when someone tells you something and you respond with "noted" it means that you don't give a crap about what they just said.  It's a really quick way to alienate people that can help you, so don't do it.

You're doing the right thing by asking questions here.  However, if they give you guidance to be less than truthful it's still YOU that's being less than truthful.  Keep that in mind...  Whatever you do is on you, and you take full responsibility for your actions.  This again will be a recurring theme throughout your time in the Navy.  It doesn't really matter who told you to do what, you're the one that did it.  Yes, the people that told you that are messed up too, but that's not an excuse for you to not be completely open and honest.

The college thing really isn't a big deal, don't let it become one.  Answer the questions that they ask honestly.  Any other way is a bad way to start off as a Nuke.

[lwrozans]

Thank you

[DDMurray]

I spent less than a year at college due to some poor decision making. I would rather start from scratch than have to take claim to my grades and poor judgment.
I am currently filling out my final leg of paperwork prior to signing and was wondering if any of you know if I can slip under the radar by not making any claims of ever attending college.

Are you saying:
a.  You went to college based on a poor decision?  -OR-
b.  You went to college for a year based on a poor decision? -OR-
c.  a & b

Ask yourself this:  You're doing PMS (preventative maintenance) and realize you don't know how to perform a step.  You could easily just document it as complete to save embarassment (i.e. it would slip under the radar).  Do you take the easy way out and not point out your poor level of knowledge or do you notify your boss that you don't know how to do something you're supposed to be able to do?

One of the reasons I joined the navy after 2 years of sub-par performance at college was to change my ways.  Do yourself a favor and commit to telling the truth.  You'll feel better in the long run.

Oh, and if the security clearance investigators found out you provided false information on your paperwork, they'll kick you out of the navy and depending on how pissed the investigator gets you could possibly put yourself in a position where you could never get a security clearance (at least for awhile).

[greenbean]

Sorry to hear you got some mis-information. I appreciate your inquiry here and I'll share my two cents having just gone through this application process.

As you go through the application process and into MEPS there will be lots of questions. Answer the question truthfully (ask for clarification if you honestly don't know what they are asking for.) When I did my security clearance I realized I had mis-understood a question and made it very clear to the interviewer exactly what my situation was. It was not a problem, he made some notes, and we went from there.

It is your life and your responsiblity to answer truthfully. Just before you sign most of these application/health forms you will read some statment to the effect of: "Have you represented yourself honestly and truthfully to the best of your ability." Only you can answer that question and your signature is binding.  

Always ask for a second opinion if you don't feel you are getting the whole story from one person.

Owning a mistake and showing improvement speaks well of a person's character and developed maturity.

Good Luck with the rest of your application.

[HydroDave63]

I am not telling you that I murdered several people, smoked crack on a regular basis, raped babies, and am considering leaving those things out of my paperwork
I am grateful for this forum and would like to remain part of it, not have it scrutinize every possible chance of misinterpretation

10 yard penalty for drama.

Some of the respondents here are active duty Nuclear sailors and officers. It is YOU who owes the apology.

100 quatloos against.

[NukeLDO]

Sailors, otherwise known as sea lawyers, take great delight in scrutinizing evrything and coming up with all possible interpretations...be it Night Orders, RPMs, instructions, and other people's writing.  Get used to it.

[withroaj]

Sailors, otherwise known as sea lawyers, take great delight in scrutinizing evrything and coming up with all possible interpretations...be it Night Orders, RPMs, instructions, and other people's writing.  Get used to it.

Aww, come on, sir!  Daily just means within 24 hours prior to use.  Besides, the periodicity changed to monthly/situational, so we didn't really miss any requirements.  Besides, there's no way to tell if 24 hours has really elapsed since the last guy did it.  Just because we...

Ok.  You win this round, sir.  We'll be ready next time... 

[Fermi2]

No it's not dishonest. IIRC the requirements are to have at least a C Average in HS Level Algebra. That's all you need to come forth with. When I enlisted all I did was submit my HS Transcripts. I'd completed 3 years of honors college Chemistry but that was none of the Navy's business as it wasn't pertinent to the admission requirements of the job. If you're trying to withhold it from an Officer program you will not succeed but if you simply plan on enlisting do as you like.

Mike

[lwrozans]

Ok
I am aware that many of you found my words poorly chosen
I apologize for this
It was never my intention to sound condescending, disrespectful, or like a prick in general
I would however like to make story time
I went to college
I had 'C's in my biology and chemistry class, which I received credit for (this is only a small fraction of my dilemma)
I was then dismissed from the school for (and I am reading verbatim from my letter of dismissal):
"...the purchase, possession and distribution of illegal drugs (marijuana) and serving as an active accomplice to thefts committed by guests you brought to campus..."
The police and/or any other body of authority was never brought into play and I was dismissed upon a basis which was completely decided by the school
This is what I am concerned about
As you can see, my situation is nowhere near pretty
I have taken responsibility for my actions and am not going to place the blame upon anyone else, though it would greatly benefit me and would actually adhere to this situation since I did not steal anything
I know that the military has policies against people with "serious character flaws"
I would like your honest opinions of this dilemma

[thenukeman]

I was an Executive officer of a Army Nuclear Biological Training Company.  I tell you what is not pretty,  I had a guy who was going to be the Honor Grad of his platoon and about 3 days before graduation it is found out that he did not disclose a cocaine possession.  To bad so sad he is discharged.  They did not even pay him and gave him a one way ticket on Greyhound.  I was told if he fully disclosed he would have graduated.

I tell you what is not pretty I had a student , a little older than most, a good student.  It was christmas time,  most privates went home for christmas.  There was about 30 left who could not for some reasons go home. I found out this private was from TN like me. I told him Iwould take him home for christmas because his hometown was about 10 miles off interstate 24.  I take him home and pick him up.   I get back to my unit and about a week later I find out this guy did not disclose a assault and battery. Too Bad so sad take the Greyhound home. This guy I really felt for because he rode with me and was a homeboy.  Nothing I could do.  

ALWAYS FULLY DISCLOSE!!!  I know from experience.  You will be totally screwed if you do not.  I probably discharged over 100 students in my 18 months as  Executive Officer, From Lying on enlistment papers about drugs, felonies, to just could not hack it, for failure of the school, Homo, AWOL, etc.

[JustinHEMI05]

Prove you've corrected your "character flaw" and disclose. The security investigation will find it anyway. I am sure you can get into the Navy without telling, but odds are, you won't get buy the clearance investigators. And if you slip by the first time, you won't at your 5 year. THEN try explaining why you didn't tell up front. Trust me, I had a subordinate who was in a very similar predicament.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Justin

[lwrozans]

I've been under the impression that you are not given an opporotunity to prove you are a changed person (to prove you've overcome your "character flaw")
Is there some way to appeal this to a body of superiors?

[JustinHEMI05]

Again, I am not so sure that would stop you from getting in the navy. In fact, I would bet money that it won't.

[lwrozans]

Thank you
I greatly appreciate all of the input I have been recieving from you guys

[Glowing_Since_09]

And if you slip by the first time, you won't at your 5 year. THEN try explaining why you didn't tell up front. Trust me, I had a subordinate who was in a very similar predicament.

Justin

Just out of curiosity, what was the situation and what was found that took 5 years?

[thenukeman]

It probably would not hurt to write a letter stating what happened, and that you are a changed person and believe the navy would give you a chance to prove it. Basically stating you have manned up, admitted your mistake and would like to move forward with your life in a positive way by joining the navy.

Also if you go for a higher security clearance or quit and go DOE, a nondisclosure can hurt you. I know of a guy in DOE who got caught 20 years later and lost his job.  Did not admit smoking a joint 20 years ago.  To bad so sad.   Also a Officer was kicked out because he lied about his schooling.

[Neutron_Herder]

Well, I must say that your apprehension makes more sense now.  Thanks for sharing the information that we need to help you out!

I agree with what's already been said.  Just tell them what happened, because it will more than likely get found sooner or later.  The security clearance review is no joke, and if you stay in for a while and get an even higher clearance they dig deeper.

The drug involvement is a big deal with the Navy (and the military in general), and for good reason.  We don't want people working on equipment under the influence of drugs or alcohol.  You can even be removed from the program for getting a certain prescriptions!  Own up to it...  You'll have to do a lot of explaining, they're going to want to know every detail.  The longer ago the event was, the better.  This will prove that you've straightened yourself out.  You will still need to have a waiver to get in if you admit to drug use.  There's a lot of people with those waivers is the Navy too, so not a huge deal.

As far as why you were dismissed for school, I don't think the Navy is going to have a huge issue with it.  You weren't convicted of anything, and if I remember correctly that's all that the enlistment paperwork cares about.  Not saying that they'll definitely not care, but there's no legal record of those things happening. 

Going back to earlier about the recruiters.  Don't let them convince you to lie!  I can see in this situation why they might try to do just that.  Remember that you're the one signing all of the documentation, and read the little words that are around that signature line.  They can legally punish you for knowingly providing false information!  If you think for an instant that some shady recruiter is later going to admit that he pressured you to lie you're way off!

I hope things work out for you.  Some final words of advice if this all does work out and you get into this program...  People make some silly choices when they're young (and older, trust me).  Learn from the stupid stuff you've done, and remember the Navy will have no tolerance for any of that stuff that got you kicked out of school before either.  Biggest takeaway from all of it... change the way you're thinking, and if necessary the people you're hanging out with.  They would be no help to you while you're in the Navy, just a bad influence.  This is an opportunity to better yourself, take advantage of it!

[JustinHEMI05]

Just out of curiosity, what was the situation and what was found that took 5 years?

Sorry, it is not my place to talk about the details. That person is still in and I know there are people here that know them. It is a private matter.

Justin

[Glowing_Since_09]

Yikes. I'm glad i was fortunate to never talked to police officers, and i'm fresh out of High School. Back ground check for me can virtually find nothing, and one of my parents already have a security clearance cause he works for the FAA.

[HydroDave63]

and one of my parents already have a security clearance cause he works for the FAA.

that will have zero to do with you getting a clearance or not. Thanks for playing.