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Offline UncaBuffalo

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Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« on: Feb 01, 2008, 07:54 »
I've seen this phrase in a couple of Bartlett communications recently...can someone tell me what it means?  Thanks.
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Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #1 on: Feb 01, 2008, 08:17 »
My interpertation of this is tha Bartlett is creating the illusion that the progression from deconner to ALARA Engineer is somehow natural, and not a product of the old-boy practice of rewarding the loyal employee by promoting him or her to a higher paying job.  (We all know how it works:  "Just work this one more outage for me as a ..... and I'll get you in as a ..... at ........")  Actually, it was always more like keeping them loyal by promising them a move up.

Hey, deconning is a hard job.  Sometimes, to get someone to stick with it, you have to give them a reason.  You have to promise some upward mobility.  This does not mean that there is any such thing as a "pipeline".  What it means is that nuke plants need deconners, deconners see RP's making more money and sweating less, and the implied promise is always that if you work hard as a deconner you will be an RP.

This is the same as saying that if you do a really good job at picking up those towels and jockstraps, you will someday be the person who fills the Gatorade.  Do a good job at that, and we might put you in at Wide Receiver a few times.  Eventually, you will be Head Coach.  But, if you ever want to lift the Lombardi Trophy over your head on the cover of SI, you gotta wash those socks and jocks for one more season.

I will reiterate for the zillionth time that many of the best technicians I have ever been provileged to work with got into the game as deconners.  But, in my opinion this is the result of their own individual desire to better their station in life along with the ability to learn the job.  They saw a better job than the one they had; they learned it.  This does not mean that you need to be a deconner to be an RP.  The fact is that most of the ex-deconner RP's that you find in the business were wasting their time as deconners in the first place, and should have started off as Junior RP's.

I also note the interjection of the word "safety", which has significance to me.  As many have noticed, there are a number of former RP's who have made the career switch to EH&S positions (myself included) and bettered their incomes, working conditions, and professional development.  Naturally, this has caused a lot of techs to consider making such a move themselves.

Enter the NEW BARTLETT!!!!  Now comes Big Blue to offer a "total package" to the utilities of combination RP and EH&S services.  I wish them luck and welcome them to the exciting world of industrial safety.  It should be considered, however, that we who left the employ of Bartlett for greener pastures didn't just become wealthy on the spot as the result of switching from a purple hat to a green one, but that the name of the company stencilled on the front of the hat may have made all the difference.

I have to be up front and remind all that I am working for a competitor to Bartlett.  Like Bartlett, I recognize that a good RP can be a good EHS specialist.  In fact, I intend to hire as many of them as I possibly can.

Why am I on this like a hobo on a hot dog?  Well, perhaps it is because I think it is terribly BAD FORM to show up at a site where your competitor has the contract and start holding meetings with their employees.  Recruiting them in-person, over the phone, by email, by advertisement, or just networking are all acceptable ways to attract employees away from the competition.  But, renting a room right outside the gate to give a wholesale sales pitch is just a little unsophisticated.  I hope they realize before it is too late that the competitor they are targeting this time is not tiny Numanco from Tulsa.  This one is as big as a whale, and can hurt them bad if they decide to strike back.  The meetings at the casino by Prairie Island are a low-class move, and Bartlett would HATE it if somebody did that at one of their sites.  It would not take a vivid imagination to picture a Bartlett Site Coordinator taking names at the door of such a meeting if Rock Nelson or I were having one outside the gate at Limerick.

You want to attract employees?  Try treating them like people and paying them what they are worth.
« Last Edit: Feb 01, 2008, 11:15 by BeerCourt »
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Marvin

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #2 on: Feb 02, 2008, 07:36 »
Beercourt, you said a mouthful in one very lucid, well informed post.  It's good to see stuff like this.  Reminds me that we live in a great place where we can speak our minds without the fear of big brother smacking us around.  Well said.

duke99301

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #3 on: Feb 02, 2008, 08:31 »
If you can work hard you can move up is what I see! And there are those who have why dash someones dreams?

Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #4 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:25 »
Who's dashing dreams?  There is no correlation at all between being an RP and being a deconner.  If you have the stuff to be an RP, why should you let them make you push a mop for two years first?  On the other hand, if you happen to be an excellent deconner, why should you wait until you are not doing that anymore before you get good money?  The reward for being good at your job should be good pay and benefits for doing it - NOT the promise that you will someday get a different job as long as you don't make us mad.

All this BS about "career development" means that they will help you pass the NEU/NUF exam when you need to, and they'll dangle a carrot in front of you just as they have always done.  Now, go be a good little deconner, and maybe we will let you doserate your own trash bags (and count half your time as junior time so that you will be a Senior RPT sooner without any training at all).
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Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #5 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:44 »
Dosimetry 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Respiratory protection 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Counting room 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Control point 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Laundry monitoring  12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Decontamination 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
General Employee Trng 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
HP Tech training  50% x 2 yrs = 12 mos


http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html
« Last Edit: Feb 02, 2008, 10:45 by Rennhack »

Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #6 on: Feb 02, 2008, 01:25 »
They have - of course -used loopholes in the past, such as the Junior/Deconner designation, where your time counts 50% instead of 25% because you were a JR RP "half" of the time.
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Offline Marlin

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #7 on: Feb 02, 2008, 02:40 »
Dosimetry 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Respiratory protection 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Counting room 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
Control point 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Laundry monitoring  12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
Decontamination 12.5%  x 2 yrs = 3 mos
General Employee Trng 25% x 2 yrs = 6 mos
HP Tech training  50% x 2 yrs = 12 mos


http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html
They have - of course -used loopholes in the past, such as the Junior/Deconner designation, where your time counts 50% instead of 25% because you were a JR RP "half" of the time.

Creative resumes, nepotism, the good old boy network, and interpretation of requirements have circumvented these "guide lines" as long as I can remember. The license holder or Radiation Protection program define a tech. This definition is part of the contract for tech support and can change from one outage to the next depending on facility needs.

Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #8 on: Feb 02, 2008, 03:00 »
Creative resumes, nepotism, the good old boy network, and interpretation of requirements have circumvented these "guide lines" as long as I can remember. The license holder or Radiation Protection program define a tech. This definition is part of the contract for tech support and can change from one outage to the next depending on facility needs.

The NRC reviews resumes during audits.  The site can accept anyone at "Sr HP" pay, and call them a Sr HP. - That dosen't mean they are one.

When I was at Ft Calhoun as an 18.1 (everyone remember I was a deconner for 6 years, and a Jr RP for a short time).  The NRC accepted my time, and agree'd that I was a Sr Tech, but there were one or two others at the site that didn't pass muster.

I am quoting the guidelines that Jerry Hyatt of Bartlett published Sept 1988 in the RPM journal, and has been accepted as the indusatries guidance since.
http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html

I'll be honest with you, I thougth it was 2 for 1 up to 3 months.

By the way, I googled "ANSI 3.1", and guess what came up #1??
http://www.google.com/search?q=ansi+3%2e1
« Last Edit: Feb 02, 2008, 03:03 by Rennhack »

Offline G-reg

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #9 on: Feb 02, 2008, 04:20 »
By the way, I googled "ANSI 3.1", and guess what came up #1??
http://www.google.com/search?q=ansi+3%2e1

Next thing you know, the NRC is going to be calling you:
"Hey, Mike, we got this problem we can't figure out, and we were hoping you could help us out..."

 :) :) :)
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Offline Marlin

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #10 on: Feb 02, 2008, 04:30 »
The NRC reviews resumes during audits.  The site can accept anyone at "Sr HP" pay, and call them a Sr HP. - That dosen't mean they are one.

When I was at Ft Calhoun as an 18.1 (everyone remember I was a deconner for 6 years, and a Jr RP for a short time).  The NRC accepted my time, and agree'd that I was a Sr Tech, but there were one or two others at the site that didn't pass muster.

I am quoting the guidelines that Jerry Hyatt of Bartlett published Sept 1988 in the RPM journal, and has been accepted as the indusatries guidance since.
http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,4395.0.html

I'll be honest with you, I thougth it was 2 for 1 up to 3 months.

By the way, I googled "ANSI 3.1", and guess what came up #1??
http://www.google.com/search?q=ansi+3%2e1

Ok? What's your point, I don't see any points of contention or are you just restating it in a different way?

Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #11 on: Feb 02, 2008, 08:55 »
Ok? What's your point, I don't see any points of contention or are you just restating it in a different way?

Troy said that you would get 1 yr HP credit for 2 years of decon, and it is just not so.  I don't care who's nephew you are.  How could he possibly have 7 more karma than me, when he gives out that kind of advice?  ;)

Offline SloGlo

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #12 on: Feb 02, 2008, 09:43 »
3.1 requirements suck since they threw out the 3 years experience at an operating commercial nuclear power plant.  imho.
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Offline Shawnee Man

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #13 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:00 »
How could he possibly have 7 more karma than me, when he gives out that kind of advice? 

Probably the same reason that Marlin has 8 more than you.

Offline Rennhack

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #14 on: Feb 02, 2008, 10:47 »
3.1 requirements suck since they threw out the 3 years experience at an operating commercial nuclear power plant.  imho.

It NEVER EVER said that.

Quote
ANSI/ANS 3.1-1978 (Section 4.5.2), as follows: Technicians shall have three years of working experience in their specialty of which one year should be related technical training. They should possess a high degree of manual dexterity and ability and should be capable of learning and applying basic skills.

Quote
ANSI/ANS 3.1-1987 includes qualification criteria specifically for "Radiation Protection " (Section 4.5.3.2), which are itemized as follows:

Education: High School Diploma
Experience: Minimum experience for this position:

  • Radiation Protection which shall include: 2 years
  • Nuclear Power Plant 1 years
  • On site 3 months

I never really understood the 'onsite 3 months' thing...

Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #15 on: Feb 02, 2008, 11:03 »
Probably the same reason that Marlin has 8 more than you.

What are you smoking?  Marlin has 816, I have 1260.

Offline Already Gone

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Re: "Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline"
« Reply #16 on: Feb 03, 2008, 01:19 »
Troy said that you would get 1 yr HP credit for 2 years of decon, and it is just not so.  I don't care who's nephew you are.  How could he possibly have 7 more karma than me, when he gives out that kind of advice?  ;)

I didn't actually say that.  I was referring to the practice that has arisen in the past 6 or 7 years of giving deconners Junior RP time (which is not limited) because they use dose rate meters when they pick up the bags of laundry and trash.  Since their job only entails "junior" work part of the time, they get half the credit that they would if they were actually Junior RP's.  But, since Junior time has no limit, a junior/deconner could get 1 year of junior time in two years.
However, not all plants allow deconners to dose-rate their bags and have no such designation as a junior/deconner.
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Offline Brett LaVigne

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #17 on: Feb 03, 2008, 01:41 »
What are you smoking?  Marlin has 816, I have 1260.

Man...you guys care way too much about what others think of you. Popularity does not necessarily = acurate. Anyway, it isn't about who has the most Karma total points, it is about who has the most Karma points in relation to their total posts...isn't it?

...110+%!!!!! Guess I am living proof that this Karma thing doesn't really matter ;)
« Last Edit: Feb 03, 2008, 01:43 by Bat Man »
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RAD-GHOST

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #18 on: Feb 03, 2008, 06:08 »
BC,

That is simply business as usual for the New and Improved Holding Company!  I was rather surprised to see Mr. Hiatt on the marquee, but from a realist perspective they couldn't send anyone else!  You have to remember the large majority of meetings between the Staff and Management are a paid venue, which translates to a Captive Audience!  How else could they keep techs in their seats when some of those Industry Icons take the stage, especially once they open their mouths!

Pipeline or Pipe Dream?

Actually they are becoming the Pipeline for Pipe Dreams.  Not that I would be privileged to any inside information, but next thing you know they will be implementing a computer program to conveniently arrange there staffing venue, which just might includes a logistics feature, so don't be surprised when your buddy's offered a job somewhere and you aren't!  You've been to that site 6X, sorry their staffed!  Seems like a pretty easy thing to create, pop a name up on the computer, check the site staff numbers and only offer what THEY want, not what YOU want!  I'm sure it will also include all those neat and sweet evaluations, hopefully you'll make the "A" list!  Imagine how an employer could manipulate employee’s opportunities if they incorporated their previous payroll records, "What they make vs. What they'll take"!  I know, that would be utterly ridiculous, who would think of such a thing? 

I know, Probably just another conspiracy theory!

RG   :-\

Offline let-it-ride

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #19 on: Feb 03, 2008, 08:15 »
One can be "promoted" anytime, for any reason!!

I once worked at Surry when on Friday a Sr. Deconner was made a Jr. HP.
After ONE week, he was made a Sr. HP.
The House people liked him and he was one of the 'good guys' at the site.

Next we can talk about all the girl friends that got Jr. and Sr. HP jobs when they could not spell HP.

Of course there are a few women that I would put my career on the line for anytime!!  BUT, they are few and far between.

SO, while we can TALK about being professional and the talk about Pipe Dreams, it always goes back to the age old and never ending 'I rub your back and you rub my....'

We can also say how unfair things are and how it SHOULD be, but I don't know of anyone that would pass up a chance to advance and give it up knowing they got it because of being friends with Bubba, etc.

What is the answer??   



RAD-GHOST

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #20 on: Feb 04, 2008, 05:08 »
Hummm, I'm starting to see a pattern.  Looks like a lot of the thread responders are currently employed by someone else!   :'(

Can They/We Possibly Survive?   :o

RG!    8)

Offline Already Gone

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #21 on: Feb 04, 2008, 06:53 »
That is a wise and astute observation.

However, I bear no malice toward Bartlett.  I still recommend them as an employer to anyone seeking RP work.

I just realize that Bartlett never did a single thing just to benefit me, and I do not believe that they are starting now.  That's fair because I/we don't go to work for them just to keep them in business - we do it for the paycheck.  Now, if/when the company and the employees start thinking like a family, things will change.

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Offline Eric_Bartlett

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #22 on: Feb 08, 2008, 05:38 »
I've seen this phrase in a couple of Bartlett communications recently...can someone tell me what it means?  Thanks.

Sorry it took me so long to reply, but I've been busy making all of Rad-Ghost's nightmares and conspiracy theories come true! 

All kidding aside below you will find what it means...

The Human Capital Crisis: What We are Doing
Addressing the Industry Shortage of Qualified Personnel with Pipeline Development
The opinions & views expressed by me are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of the company.

Offline biloxoi blues

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #23 on: Feb 08, 2008, 07:08 »
The best recruiting tool that I know of is taking care of the people who work for you already.   If the company is good the word gets out, if the company is bad the word gets out faster.  From a simple mind.

Offline Eric_Bartlett

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #24 on: Feb 08, 2008, 07:50 »
The best recruiting tool that I know of is taking care of the people who work for you already.   If the company is good the word gets out, if the company is bad the word gets out faster.  From a simple mind.

Simple, true and accurate.  Thats why I've stated again and again, if you have a problem let me know and i will do everything in my power to rectify the situation - i may not always be successful, but i will always try - after all with out all of you, we dont exist.

The opinions & views expressed by me are mine and mine alone and may not reflect those of the company.

shovelheadred

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #25 on: Feb 08, 2008, 09:41 »
,,,What a waste of your typing time...Eric...Every tech that has been in this business long enough to get a per diem check, knows, how Bartlett has manipulated the technicians,,and this is one reason a majority of the technicians went to DOE when they did,,with the exception of the Drug test failure people..when I started in DOE, DOD, EPA..Bartlett had no interest in them..we didn't work for you...we worked for Sigma Science,,Thermo-Nutech,,and later Duratek,,,I myself worked for you one time..and I thank AL Eidson for that, not Bartlett... of all of these listed benefits you are offering how many techs are actually benefitting from them..and the Duke thing..the Core,,Duratek or GTS or HPTS started this, you inherited it, it was in place...I never was a deconner, I came out of the canoe club a 3.1..was a house tech,,then hit the road..did ALARA..whatever,,,but when I made the change to Master-Lee, and later Areva, I knew I would not be back to the RP world..the main reason..Money, the reason we all are called roadtechs...RP's don't realize the money that's made out there...and the bid for an MCO would blow their minds...yea, I work for Troy and he is right, this organization we are associated with, is a family,,taking care of each other...the benefits you listed..we have all that, so what, and when something goes wrong at a site, we have backup,,experienced degreed, CSP type personell with years of safety experience (not only in Nuclear, but Dupont, refinery's, gas turbines )  that can answer the questions, give experienced advice, not just fill out the paperwork .I have worked sites with your EH&S people, they are RP's with a rewritten resume, not one of them had the OSHA 30 Hour  ( or an idea what it was) much less the OHST.are you trying to sell us?..or yourself...this is just my opinion..you have yours, I have mine..and yours is not always right because your name is Bartlett

alphadude

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #26 on: Feb 08, 2008, 09:51 »
Eric its is unfortunate that past practice does haunt Bartlett, and that may just be the issue-past practice.  I never worked for Bartlett, but have in the past had some issues with them as far as "super techs", promotion of relatives of super techs and Bartlett personnel put in position of management without ever having one day of management training.  However in the past few years things seem to have changed-old staff motivated out, changes in how people are treated, the employment of staff that can really manage and supervise without uttering the statement "you will never work in this industry again!" and so on... i actually consider employment with Bartlett now and will do so again in the future.  As a manager I have to deal with all clients in a legal, ethical manner and I am sure that Big Blue does to and I would have not problems contracting with them.

(even though i was on the list from 1979 to 1982 thanks to JE) note i never worked for them and i made the list - one of the inexperienced staff spilled her guts on the phone to one of my co workers)


alphadude

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #27 on: Feb 08, 2008, 10:08 »
dang red how do you really feel.. well put

Offline Eric_Bartlett

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #28 on: Feb 09, 2008, 08:44 »
Wow, tough crowd, but then again its what I expected.  Can't please all the people all the time...
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Offline Camella Black

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #29 on: Feb 09, 2008, 10:31 »
Eric, don't sweat it. I really don't understand why anyone has a problem with the "pipeline".

You see its structure in our world everyday in various forms. From rising in the ranks of the military to going from journeyman -apprentice-craftsman and in the medical field : resident-intern-doctor.

As long as you have the time in, knowledge and can pass the tests I have no problem with you going from deconner to senior or if you walked in off the street as someones girlfriend, son, brother etc; of course I may be bias on this as EVERY member of my family except my father did the same thing and to be honest I KNOW my husband and brothers made great techs.

In regards to those that say that some get special treatment, grow up and get real this has been going on in your life since birth and those of us that have siblings realize this. I was judged by my sisters failures and therefore a tight rope was often attached to me and yet my brother who was 3 years younger had a free ride; and as a parent I can tell you that I often had to apologize to my children as I did treat them different because they were different.

Know I'd like to know more about the scholarships and programs could you start a thread on all that Bartlett is doing?
« Last Edit: Feb 09, 2008, 10:33 by Camella Black »

Offline Already Gone

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #30 on: Feb 09, 2008, 10:56 »
Eric,
You are, as you say, the surviving member of a dying race.  The contract houses of the past have all fallen by the wayside, leaving Bartlett as the "last man standing".  As such, you must bear the weight of all that they have done.

No, Bartlett checks have never bounced.

No, Bartlett Site Coordinators have never taken off with the proceeds of cashing the techs' paychecks.

No, Bartlett has never flouted IRS regulations, or DOL regulations regarding the relationship of employer to employee. That is, you have never tried to pass off your employees as "independent contractors" to avoid paying your share of the FICA tax.  You have never tried to reclassify hourly employees as salaried in order to defer or refuse the payment of overtime.

But, Bartlett - like all the others - has dangled that carrot in front of deconners, fire watches, FME monitors, ...etc. that someday they will be Senior Health Physics / Rad. Protection Techs.  You have all done it, you are doing it still, it stinks.

Eric, you have never tried to work next to some of these people.  As I always say, some of them are the very best, but frankly most of them should not be techs.  You try carrying 4 to six other people because they have no fundamental understanding of Radiation Protection - but enough time to be ANSI 3.1.  You'll feel as I do.  You continue to staff jobs with 40 to 50 techs, when 15 of them are doing all the heavy lifting at the same rate of pay as the other 25.

Poaching employees from your competitors is a time-honored practice.  Nothing wrong with trying to attract them.  Where do you think most of my people used to work?  But, the fact that NMC was okay with it is totally irrelevant.  Those people are not NMC employees.  Why should they care?  Did Day-Zimmerman Atlantic give the nod too?  Didn't think so?

Putting a prom dress on a pig doesn't make her your dream date.  It is still a pig.  Parking your butt outside the gate is still a classless act.  And if you want to continue to believe that Bartlett has never discriminated against a tech for working for a competitor, I have three words for you, "DOUBLE SECRET PROBATION"  Yeah, it came from Animal House, but ask any RP tech what it means, and the first word out of their mouths is "Bartlett".

True, a lot of this is baggage from the past that you would love to leave behind you, and maybe you are really trying.  It's not like you really need to.  You could just keep things the way that they are, and still be the industry leader.  So, maybe there is a little hope to be found in the fact that you are talking differently from the way it was before.  If you say you really mean it, I have no reason to doubt your word.  But it is not your words that will be the proof, right?  Let's see what you do.  My opinion is that this is all just a new package for the same old crap.  Let's see you change my mind.

I have seen some of your EHS people in action.  No, you are NOT in the same business as I am.  Not yet.  Maybe some of them will become more proficient in speaking English and get better, but I'm not losing any sleep over having to compete with Bartlett in the Safety field.
« Last Edit: Feb 09, 2008, 01:30 by BeerCourt »
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Offline Already Gone

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #31 on: Feb 09, 2008, 11:28 »
This is just another Bartlett slogan that makes it appear that they are the group behind the industry movement to replace the aging workforce. It's been in place since 2000 at most nuclear plants. They are saying that they have alliances with an educational institution by making a phone call and then following it up with an email. It's all smoke and mirrors.

Bartlett only cares about how much money they make the investment group. Hello !! They use the technicians like a commodity. They've underbid all the other companies and put them out of business. Bartlett has had 29 years to raise the wage and benefits. Where's it at? Now all of a sudden Bartlett cares about it's employees. Throw out the flag.

Bartlett has manipulated the ANSI white paper they wrote in the late 80s to their financial benefit by creating an artificial shortage of technicians. RP Techs have left the outage rotation due to an inadequate wage. That opened the door for Bartlett to import cheap labor. Everyone knows that they pay these technicians from Mexico less than their American counterparts. The Mexican techs are coached not to reveal their paychecks to anyone. Bartlett cares more about getting work visas for foreign labor than it does on a so-called pipeline for Americans.

Bartlett only implemented the 401K in the early 90s because the technicians went on a recognitional strike. Nationwide the strike didn't have much effect but it did create the holy grail of pay for technicians at Diablo Canyon. How many of the 'old regulars' at Diablo still have the double secret probation letters that Bruce sent out? Nothing has changed. Now they just tell you an outage is staffed. When you call and talk to the RPM, you find out differently. We need legal representation.

How low of a wage are we going to continue to accept. They have only bumped the pay this spring to staff outages. It'll go back down this fall or they will cap the travel, lower the per diem, etc.. Nothing has changed.

I admit right out in the open that I am working for a Bartlett competitor.  Throw out the flag?  Here's mine.  Who are you representing here?  Your company, the "NPUA", or (most likely) both?

We can drag up everything that we believe that Bartlett has ever done wrong, but this thread is about the "pipeline".  It is about having to work along side of techs who make the same money as you without regard to the fact that their only qualification to be there is that they drew their breaths inside the fence of a nuke plant for 3 years or so.  It's about the fact that Bartlett is promising carreer development for technicians who are moving up the pipeline, but doing nothing about the total lack of development for the techs who are already at the top.  It is about the fact that this would all be unnecessary if Bartlett - and ALL the competitors who do or did exist - would have recognized the difference between a qualified technician and one who just had the time in.

Those of us who have left would never have left if the companies hadn't diluted our profession with whatever came flowing out of that pipeline.  Now, the pipeline is all they have left.
« Last Edit: Feb 09, 2008, 01:29 by BeerCourt »
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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #32 on: Feb 09, 2008, 11:32 »
Hello Everyone,  nice posts bdavidson and Beercourt nice to see we have people speak their minds and the truth.   Why would Bartlett recruit right outside and Atlantic contracted plant?  I'm sure the techs already have heard about Bartlett and I'm sure at least 90 percent has worked for Bartlett before.  I wonder what the percentage of traveling, non supervision , Bartlett techs think they are treated fairly?  Have they ever done a poll? How many Bartlett techs  think that since Bartlett has grown so big it has gotten better?  Does Bartlett really care who they staffed the plants with? They always say the most qualified, but the techs all make the same amount of money no matter what the quals are. Next time Bartlett sends a representative to a plant instead of him telling how big Bartlett is getting do to the techs hard work, it would be nice to ask the techs what would make them happy and actually follow through.  I really do think its great that Eric comes out and speaks in the forum, but instead of pleasing all the people, as he states, it would be nice if they could just please the majority of their employees in the traveling work force.
« Last Edit: Feb 09, 2008, 11:35 by Tech A »

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #33 on: Feb 09, 2008, 11:43 »
Mike, you are living proof that you can find a nugget in the rock pile every now and then.  But you have not worked as a meter-swinging tech in a commercial plant for a long time.  You haven't seen what is out there.

There was a time when people could get some training on the job.  Now, they just get time.  They get pushed through from decon to HP in the minimum time, with no training other than a "refresher" to help them pass the NEU.

Things are not the same as they were back in the day.  If you had stayed in the commercial nukes, you would have gotten disgusted about four or five promotions ago, because all of the people who were getting promoted with you didn't earn it like you did.

The navy doesn't prepare an RP for anything more than his first day in a civilian nuke.  You have to pick up the ball yourself after that - just like every other tech.

You are right; not every deconner went on to be an HP - only the ones who should have.  Note that the previous sentence is in the past tense.  They are ALL getting pushed through to cover the shortage of Senior Techs that occurs for about two weeks twice a year.  They are getting sent through way too fast.


Okay, what's going on here?  I replied to a post from Rennhack, and it's gone.  It was a good one too.  Where did it go?
« Last Edit: Feb 09, 2008, 11:48 by BeerCourt »
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Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #34 on: Feb 09, 2008, 01:50 »
Okay, what's going on here?  I replied to a post from Rennhack, and it's gone.  It was a good one too.  Where did it go?
I deleted it.  I fealt I was out of line.

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #35 on: Feb 09, 2008, 04:52 »
You were defending your roots.  What is out of line about that?

Lots of what I have been saying can easily be taken to mean that deconners are stupid, or don't deserve to be RP's.  I don't mean that at all, but I can see how you would take that meaning from what I say.  It's hard to make this point without sounding elitist.  The fact is that most of the RP's who are former deconners are good techs, some are outstanding, but some are not.  Usually, those weren't good deconners either - which doesn't deter their progression to RP even a little.

Anyway, I don't mean to trash anybody because they didn't come out of the Navy, or didn't go to college, or weren't house techs, or anything.  I know that I had to go backward and retro-train myself because I never had a chance to be a deconner or a Junior HP.  Looking back, I find it totally ridiculous that I was allowed to cover some of the jobs that I did only a couple of weeks off the boat.  Luckily, I had a few people looking out for me.  They taught me what I needed to know.

To me the difference between a good RP and a bad one is which one of two categories they can be placed in.  One, they learn as much as they can every chance they get - or two, they are "entitled" because of the time they have put in. 
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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #36 on: Feb 09, 2008, 05:15 »
they are "entitled" because of the time they have put in. 

oooooooooooh...  aye kin sea it now.  sir hp... no weight!  lawd sloglo!
« Last Edit: Feb 09, 2008, 05:16 by SloGlo »
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Offline let-it-ride

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #37 on: Feb 09, 2008, 05:45 »
Is going from Decon to HP an advancement??

Most of the deconners took the job because it was the best paying job they could get in the area that they lived in.  Then they got hooked in the line that they could make big bucks, plus per diem going from site to site. Most had no choice and did what they had to do to make ends meet for their family.

Many did go to being an HP. Most did a good job and deserved what went with the added responsibilities.

HOWEVER!!!!! 
There are many who take pride at being a deconner.  I have known that if X and X were at the site as a deconner, it made it easier being an HP. I can relate to many times that I went out of my way and defended anything a deconner did, because they were doing what they thought was right. They usually were right, too.

So even though I think that 51% of what Beercourt says is an Elistist Crock!! He still says what I believe to be 49% right on.
That is what makes this site, a valuable site world wide.  This has happened because Mike, allows us to express whatever praise or frustrations we have, knowing that at the end of the day, there is a topic that will make us think.  (not bad for an ex deconner)

Offline let-it-ride

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #38 on: Feb 09, 2008, 06:02 »
And Re Beercourt,

He is a valid person that makes us think. It doesn't matter if we agree with him or not, we should use his thoughts and opinions (rantings??) to our advantage.

Again, however, I think he has been out of the real experience and has been in his job of, no risk. He has his. All of the REAL Hp's are in a  pay day to pay, or outage season, and do not have the time to spend on this site as he seems to do. Ha, how much time does the self acclaimed Beercourt spend on this site on COMPANY time.

Seems as if he has unlimited time to write his thoughts  on this site while being paid to do his job.    Having your cake and eating it too??

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #39 on: Feb 09, 2008, 06:36 »


HOWEVER!!!!! 
There are many who take pride at being a deconner.  I have known that if X and X were at the site as a deconner, it made it easier being an HP. I can relate to many times that I went out of my way and defended anything a deconner did, because they were doing what they thought was right. They usually were right, too.


Exactly!  So, why can't they just get paid what they deserve for being good at that?  Why do we have to lose all the good deconners because they became HP's (had to become HP's to make better money)?

A good deconner is worth more than a mediocre HP any day, but the $$$ doesn't follow that logic.


BTW, I don't punch a clock anymore.  When I'm on a job, I get lunch and breaks like anyone else.  When I'm not on a job, I manage my time as I see fit - including the phone calls I get on weekends from employees - for 40 hours of straight time a week.  My boss doesn't make me account for my time, and he is wise not to.  So, I get to do all the posting I want to on Saturdays.
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Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #40 on: Feb 09, 2008, 06:39 »
  (not bad for an ex deconner)
The is no such thing as an ex marine, and there is no such thing as an ex deconner.

"Not bad for a deconner" is something I say often when describing myself.

Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #41 on: Feb 09, 2008, 06:46 »
BTW,

I was recently at Clinton for their spring outage.  My offer letter from Shaw said 'ALARA Coordinator', just like my past 2 jobs with Shaw.  When I got there, they tell me that I'm "Safety Engineer".  MY duties were not that of ALARA, but Industrial Safety.

I debated weather or not to stay.  In  the end, I did stay.  I reviewed my resume, and it has absoutly none of my IH experience on it. (Mind you, I've done it, just never admited to it).

Offline Dave Warren

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #42 on: Feb 09, 2008, 07:42 »
The is no such thing as an ex marine, and there is no such thing as an ex deconner.

"Not bad for a deconner" is something I say often when describing myself.

That would be correct.
I am a former Marine and Mike is a former deconner.

I think we are seeing a trend along these lines.
More companies are asking for "Super Tech" qualifications.
Kinda like this: Looking for experienced Rad Con / IH / EH&S / QA person.......Apply within.

Those of us fortunate enough to have all 4 will be getting plenty of search results from Monster.com. If you want to clean the cavity all your life, have at it.
As for me, I'll be in the rear with the gear. Sipping a cup of Starbuck's and in my office with a door.

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #43 on: Feb 10, 2008, 04:06 »
EB,

WOW, those chubby little fingers must be blistered after that one!   :'(

You have me on the edge of my seat, what exactly is your company doing at Aiken Technical College?   :-\

RG...... 8)
« Last Edit: Feb 10, 2008, 04:45 by RAD-GHOST »

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #44 on: Feb 10, 2008, 12:32 »
There are many who take pride at being a deconner.  I have known that if X and X were at the site as a deconner, it made it easier being an HP. I can relate to many times that I went out of my way and defended anything a deconner did, because they were doing what they thought was right. They usually were right, too.

I agree completely. I think it is a mistake to think every deconner wants to be an HP. I frankly am grateful for those decon professionals who make my life, and the life of every HP easier. I know several career decon folks who I would take in a heartbeat over some HP's (both Sr. and Jr.) to help me during an outage.

Exactly!  So, why can't they just get paid what they deserve for being good at that?  Why do we have to lose all the good deconners because they became HP's (had to become HP's to make better money)?

A good deconner is worth more than a mediocre HP any day, but the $$$ doesn't follow that logic.


My sentiments exactly ;D
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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #45 on: Feb 10, 2008, 02:58 »
So BC?? I happen to be one of those deconners.. I could chose to move over anytime, I have 23 years of doing this under alot of great supervision,, BC I could promise you I could pass any test you could throw at me..

Yes BC I'm a supervisor and only those that can go forward will, the rest need to work on their ethics and structure,, I chose to teach new people instead of leaving people behind..I could have been an RP along time ago but I seen what was happening,, I stayed with my roots,, and many have went on to be RP supervisors ect.

Happy doing what I'm doing,,

GL to all

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #46 on: Feb 10, 2008, 07:16 »
. Nationwide the strike didn't have much effect but it did create the holy grail of pay for technicians at Diablo Canyon.

Don't think that was why they do what they do at Diablo.  It is because they wanted to choose who was they hired.  Walk outs had nothing to do with picking good workers.
It is what it is!

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #47 on: Feb 10, 2008, 09:20 »
After 6 years on the DOE side, I returned to Commercial power outages and started catching up with former co-workers and seeing how things have changed for them. Personally i have gone from Deconner to Sr HP to ALARA, but not through any "Pipeline". I am grateful to those who were willing to give me the breaks I've needed to move upward.

some of the deconners i've worked with have moved up to HP, some are out of the RP field, some are HP Supervisors, some are Site  Coordinators, and some are still deconners. which is the way things work.

I recently worked the same outage with a married couple that i worked with as deconners many years ago. to my surprise, they are still deconners and happy to be so. i was glad to see these high quality professionals still making HP lives easier. and the high praise i heard from their supervisors was no surprise.

I agree that people like them who chose to stay in the decon field are worth their weight in gold.
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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #48 on: Feb 11, 2008, 12:16 »
Don't think that was why they do what they do at Diablo.  It is because they wanted to choose who was they hired.  Walk outs had nothing to do with picking good workers.

I believe that you are partially correct. But the word on the street here at Diablo is that after the walkout, Diablo management decided that they were tired of the BS (ie. Techs being unhappy with poor wages and feeling compelled to do things like walk out) and decided to take things into their own hands. Wish more would . The level of employee at this plant is almost across the board superior to any other outages I have ever worked. Everyone tows the line or at least makes their best effort. It is always better to create an environment where people "want" to work for you instead of "having" to work for you. This puts the utility in the position of hiring only the people that have recommendations behind them of Techs that have proven themselves. There are no language barriers here (nothing against the foreign techs, some are very capable and qualified), and there is not one 3.1 tech. on site that is questionable about them having the proper resume and experience to back up the fact that they are here as a Sr. Tech.

Strive to be the best, pay like you are the best, require the best from your employee's and then...you will become the best. That is how it works, Diablo proved the theory.

Now, the pipeline is a great idea, it provides current employee's with a path of upward mobility. A company should always seek employee's (whether they are new or from within') that are reaching for something when they are seeking to fill positions higher than entry level jobs. A defined "pipeline" creates this and the employee's that are happy where they are (which can be ok too) naturally stay out of the "pipeline". The company that does this should also do a couple more things to develop a successful "pipeline" strategy.

1) Make the path enticing and worth the effort with fair wages and benefits. No one will want to travel the pipeline path without this.

2) Require that the candidates for the pipeline path are worthy candidates, not just able to fog a mirror and be able to gain unescorted access.

The later of the two points above seems to be a growing problem. If you are a Sr. Tech. at most of the current outages, are able bodied and know how to perform your job, rest assured that you will be the first one to get all of the radiologically significant and physically demanding jobs that come up. You will also draw no more pay than the 450lb guy that can do nothing other than sit a control point or the lady from south of the boarder that has to work on the frisking crew because she can't speak more than a dozen phrases in English, or the other 20+ techs that are physically unable to pass the heat stress test that would allow them to work in the cavity (all are true examples that I have seen in the past year).

Questions for process pipeline improvement:

1) Why are there not enough physically and professionally qualified employees?

Aging work force, low pay driving many sharp people to find other things to do.

2) How do we change this trend?

Entice qualified and physically able people to rejoin the workforce by offering better wages and providing a path of upward mobility.

3) How does a company like Bartlett do this?

Apply pressure on the utilities through stronger account management. There are huge arguments to raise wages for contract employee's to attract more competent workers, some of which I have mentioned above. The people managing HP and Decon contracts for Bartlett should possess two skills. Knowledge of the industry and (maybe more importantly), be a kick ass sales person.

I am not convinced that Bartlett is the Big Evil company that is only out to screw us over. I think that they have some issues not unlike any decent sized organization with their business processes and small percentage of individual corporate employee's that do not have a handle on the vision of the company.

Bringing in foreign nationals and under-qualified techs to back fill is a reaction by the company (knee jerk and maybe necessary) to fill contractual agreements between Bartlett and their customers. I am not convinced that they are paying them less in a strategy to keep wages down. I do wonder about the secrecy that surrounds the pay of foreign techs, so I remain skeptical about it. Is Bartlett gaining financially from using foreign techs over American techs and just capitalizing on having to staff with them to fulfill contract agreements? Maybe, but I don't know that to be true. These problems can not be fixed over night but can be fixed through gradual changes in the way they do business. An effective pipeline strategy is part of that fix.

End of rambling...sorry for the length, I tend to get carried away sometimes.





« Last Edit: Feb 11, 2008, 02:22 by Batman »
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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #49 on: Feb 11, 2008, 05:02 »
Excuse my Ignorance, but what Pipeline?

I've read......Teaming, Partnering, Supporting, Developing, Assisting and a plethora of other politically polished impact words!  Where's the Meat and Potatoes?  What actually exist from the perspective of reality?  What's really being offered and where do people find it?  Just because I own a copy of Windows XP, doesn't mean I'm a Partner of Team Member of Microsoft, or does it?   :-\

Hummmm.........Reminds me of an old TV commercial, "The Name goes On, before the Quality goes In"! 
Did I say that right?    :-\

Batman,

I believe the utilities have finally hit a point where they are looking for what you suggest.  I'm seeing about 20 house positions available in the Real Pipeline!  I'm guessing about 100 more before the end of the year, time will tell?

Fog a mirror, that's optional now!

Have A Great Day....RG.... 8)       
« Last Edit: Feb 11, 2008, 05:10 by RAD-GHOST »

Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #50 on: Feb 11, 2008, 08:05 »
Excuse my Ignorance, but what Pipeline?

At the Exelon outages I was at recently, the Sr Deconners (the ones I thought should become HP's) and the Jr HP's... did not have copies of the NUF study guide.  As part of the 'pipeline', that should be standard issue, no?

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #51 on: Feb 11, 2008, 08:30 »
...This Pipeline is beginning to sound like a "pipe dream"...that sounds good on paper, but isn't being used  by the techs, or available to them  by "the pipe maker"..

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #52 on: Feb 11, 2008, 09:37 »
...This Pipeline is beginning to sound like a "pipe dream"...that sounds good on paper, but isn't being used by the techs, or available to them by "the pipe maker"..

Right on, my point exactally. It is a good idea and I have seen it work beautifully in a past life outside this industry. However, you can't roll something like this out before it has actually been designed. There should be a documented path of how someone gets from A to B to C. There should also be a company Champion of the program.

I am not going to beat up Bartlett too much on this because I think that they are on to something with trying to develop a program of career advancement for their employee's. We shouldn't spit on the idea because ultimately, it could benefit all of us. We should however, apply pressure in a professional mannor to encourage them to develop the program so it works for us. Blasting an idea without offering potential solutions does nothing but create bad or worse feelings. If Bartlett is REALLY making an attempt to be an employer of choice, we as employee's, should help facilitate it. If it is just lingo to make it SOUND like they are trying to do the right things, it will be validated by a lack of action on the companies part and encourage us employee's to continue to lose faith. Time and actions will tell.
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Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #53 on: Feb 11, 2008, 10:19 »
There should also be a company Champion of the program.

That was a well written, and professional responce.  Karma to you.

Jerry Hyatt is the Company Champion, in charge of this program.  He is the guy that has set up the connections with the colleges, and has gone around to many sites promoting it, and asking for feedback.
« Last Edit: Feb 11, 2008, 03:21 by Nuclear NASCAR »

Offline Brett LaVigne

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #54 on: Feb 11, 2008, 12:36 »
That was a well written, and professional responce.  Karma to you.

Jerry Hyatt is the Company Champion, in charge of this program.  He is the guy that has set up the connections with the coledges, and has gone around to many sites promoting it, and asking for feedback.

I appreciate that Mike. I just don't like to jump on the band wagon that Bartlett (or name your company) is evil because everyone says they are and because we don't really get the deal we might deserve. Having the experience of working outside of this industry and ironically having the responsibility of being the operations change agent and lead on the employee development program helps me understand that it is much easier said than done. There are tons of challenges associated with this kind of project and company culture shift. One of the biggest was selling the fact that the company is dedicated to positive change for the future and ridding ourselves of the mistakes of the past. I don't know what Bartlett is up to exactally but I am not going to immediately shoot them down for attempting something new.

I understand that my stance doesn't win me any karma from those who have been wronged or feel like they have been wronged by Bartlett in the past (fortunately, I am not in that group) but I don't look at these threads as a popularity contest either. I believe there is some truth to the many stories about games being played by some of the recruiters but it hasn't been my experience so, I write from MY experience.

I am one of the very lucky techs that was able to get in on the Diablo outages and like many, would love to see a few more plants offer this type of deal. I think that it is probably unlikely that we will see more than a hand full of plants want to take on the extra responsibilities so that leaves us with Big Blue as the major market share holder for commercial outages. Thats OK with me if they are wanting to partner with us in career development and more aggressively manage these utility accounts to ensure a more secure financial future for the group as a whole and provide a better product for our utility customers. It is a win/win.

If this is indeed just smoke and mirrors and they continue to accept the level of technician that they have been getting (and that may be the case, I don't know at this point), they won't survive and I won't want to be part of a company that promotes that culture. In the meantime, I want to encourage them to do the right things for us, our customers and themselves.

I am really not trying to sound like a company spokesperson, I just think that slinging mud is an ineffective approach. I think Bartlett has plenty of improvements to make. From simple things like expediting direct deposit to improving compensation packages through better contract agreements and management and did I mention expediting direct deposit?!!!  >:(
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Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #55 on: Feb 11, 2008, 02:27 »
If this is indeed just smoke and mirrors and they continue to accept the level of technician that they have been getting (and that may be the case, I don't know at this point), they won't survive and I won't want to be part of a company that promotes that culture. In the meantime, I want to encourage them to do the right things for us, our customers and themselves.

Brett, another excellent post.

I did say that Bartlett is working with colleges, and placing the graduates.

What I have not seen, and would like to see, is more training on site by the Bartlett rep for their technicians.  I would like to see every technician with a copy of a study guide.  And I would like weekly assignments for those technicians on chapters.  We could call it…”Continuing Training”…  The super techs can ace it without studying, and the rest can brush up on their knowledge.  – That’s what I would do.

Offline Already Gone

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #56 on: Feb 11, 2008, 04:51 »
That is the beauty of this site.
You guys are starting to talk sense.  That continuing training idea isn't such a stretch, is it?  Really, start handing out those study guides, along with practice modules.  Make some of the more seasoned techs OJT instructors and pay them a premium (not just on one site's OJT procedure, but one for all Bartlett) to train and sign off the newer techs.
This pipeline thing CAN work, as long as there is some meat behind it - but not if you just promote the next guy in line to fill a hole.

The reason I have been so skeptical?  Refer to the last line of Brett's las post.  If you want to change the big things, you have to start with the small things.  If they can't or won't get direct deposit after all these years, what makes us think they can or will put forth the money and effort to train techs beyond giving them the answers to the NUF?
Mr. Warren, Calling Dave Warren, If you are here Dave... how long after you get hired into a company does it take for DD to get started?
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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #57 on: Feb 11, 2008, 05:48 »
Troy,

No it's not!  Actually it would be quite easy with a group effort, but where to start and what to include?

Direct Deposit:  Two payroll checks with everybody I have worked for, including Bartlett on the DOE side.


vikingfan

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #58 on: Feb 11, 2008, 05:49 »
I'll answer that also. with my employer i had DD on my first pay period !! oh what does a hard copy check look like ? ...LOL

Offline Already Gone

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #59 on: Feb 11, 2008, 06:15 »
Troy,

No it's not!  Actually it would be quite easy with a group effort, but where to start and what to include?

Direct Deposit:  Two payroll checks with everybody I have worked for, including Bartlett on the DOE side.



How about INPO?  NANTeL has managed to come up with a training standard for lots of aspects of nuclear work that are adaptable or acceptable industry-wide.  A standardized curriculum could be established that would cover the basic and common qualifications of an RP tech.  Site specifics could be reduced to a single day for contract techs.

Even though computer-based training totally sucks the big one, the idea of non-site-specific training with a computerized database works in other areas, why not RP?  Need to staff a job with qualified people, and not just warm bodies?  You can cross-reference the database to ensure that you didn't send all the techs qualified on S/G coverage to a BWR, or that you have enough people signed off on CRD removal going there.  Eventually, you will have so many people documented to do both that the flexibility will amaze you.  Returnees?  Yeah, they will still be desirable, but not to the point that you can't get in the door if you aren't one.  Just flash your quals at them and they don't have to worry that you are not a returnee.  Everybody knows the real reason for favoring returnees is to ensure that you don't have to retrain everyone from scratch.

If such a database existed, there wouldn't be any more resume doctoring - resumes will become obsolete for outage staffing purposes.  Nobody would get moved from Jr. HP to 18.1 to 3.1 without ever having covered a job.  (Do NOT try to tell me that this doesn't happen now.  It has always happened)   Nobody right out of the Navy gets a free pass without having do demonstrate ability.

That's pretty much the how.  The who is simple - who profits from techs being qualified?  Answer: The techs, the companies they work for, and the customers they serve.  The customers put up the money for a higher-quality product.  The companies use the new revenue to finance the programs, and the techs participate or they don't get work.
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Offline Dave Warren

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #60 on: Feb 11, 2008, 08:33 »
That is the beauty of this site.
You guys are starting to talk sense.  That continuing training idea isn't such a stretch, is it?  Really, start handing out those study guides, along with practice modules.  Make some of the more seasoned techs OJT instructors and pay them a premium (not just on one site's OJT procedure, but one for all Bartlett) to train and sign off the newer techs.
This pipeline thing CAN work, as long as there is some meat behind it - but not if you just promote the next guy in line to fill a hole.

The reason I have been so skeptical?  Refer to the last line of Brett's las post.  If you want to change the big things, you have to start with the small things.  If they can't or won't get direct deposit after all these years, what makes us think they can or will put forth the money and effort to train techs beyond giving them the answers to the NUF?
Mr. Warren, Calling Dave Warren, If you are here Dave... how long after you get hired into a company does it take for DD to get started?

It is what I refer to as instant.
A certain company that employs BeerCourt and myself, is capable of doing something instantly. No questions asked.
The amount of time it takes you to to fill out the direct deposit form is about how long it takes them to process it.
Poetry in motion boys. It can be accomplished.

Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #61 on: Feb 11, 2008, 09:14 »
I don't remember how long it took my Bartlett direct deposit to hit, I would guess 2 pay cycles, 2 weeks.

I do remember that back in 2001 it took SEC more than 8 weeks.  Not only did they not get the direct deposit right, they didn't pay me at all.  They claimed it was getting deposited when it wasn't.  I ended up having to open up a NEW checking account, because they never got it right with my normal account. (When I say 'they' and 'sec', it's really just one inept waist of air that no longer workers there.)

I recently worked for Shaw, they pay every 2 weeks, hold back 1 week and direct deposit hits on the second pay cycle (very standard, they send one out as a test), so 5 weeks later, you have direct deposit.  -- I worked for them twice back to back, and I had to fill out the forms each time to get it set back up. It took 5 weeks both times, just in time to get laid off.

If I sound grouchy, it's because I started to do my taxes.

Offline Shawnee Man

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #62 on: Feb 11, 2008, 09:21 »
OJTs and OJTPEs. Just going thru with ones who are experienced takes a while. Peach Bottom does this every once in a while. The outages these days dont last long enough to have all these sessions, unless these are all being done on free time.


PS: Taxes, thats what accountants are for.

Offline Smart People

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #63 on: Feb 11, 2008, 11:47 »
Bartlett has a new rule that you have to have worked 1000 hrs with them since Jan 2006 to receive DD (unless you've already had it). I guess that is so they only do it for their regulars. I'm sure EB can explain it for us.
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Offline Rennhack

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #64 on: Feb 11, 2008, 11:53 »
Bartlett has a new rule that you have to have worked 1000 hrs with them since Jan 2006 to receive DD (unless you've already had it). I guess that is so they only do it for their regulars. I'm sure EB can explain it for us.

Try searching, EB HAS explained it already.

2 karma points to the first person that links to it.

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #65 on: Feb 12, 2008, 05:34 »
AS I've mentioned a couple of times, I work for the government now. They got my DD going in time for my first paycheck. If they can do it, I'd think anybody could.

RAD-GHOST

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #66 on: Feb 12, 2008, 06:07 »
Got to love this thread, anybody remember the Original Topic?    :o

RG.. :-\ :-\ :-\






« Last Edit: Feb 12, 2008, 06:09 by RAD-GHOST »

Offline Brett LaVigne

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #67 on: Feb 12, 2008, 07:27 »
Got to love this thread, anybody remember the Original Topic?    :o

RG.. :-\ :-\ :-\
Uhhhhhhhhhhh...Direct Deposit, I got mine, you got yours?...







« Last Edit: Feb 12, 2008, 07:28 by Brett LaVigne »
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Offline Already Gone

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #68 on: Feb 12, 2008, 10:30 »
Like all threads, this one has drifted.  I take the blame.  I was merely pointing out that Bartlett is claiming to be making monumental change in the career development of its employees - while they are seemingly unable to make a simple change in payroll that every other company in the whole US of A has made years ago.

It takes a few minutes to put a new employee on DD.  A rehire takes no time at all.  Why Bartlett thinks we should believe that it takes longer is a mystery to me.  It is just sooooo hard to trust somebody who tells you something that is contradicted by every other experience that you have in the world.  This is my advice to the gang at Bartlett:  If you are going to tell me that your eyes are blue, you should have blue eyes.  If you would stare at me with big brown peepers and tell me that yours were as blue as the autumn sky, then I would be a fool to believe anything you ever say.  Likewise, if you are going to try to feed us this line about how this or that is so difficult or impossible - when we KNOW otherwise - don't be surprised when everything you say is met with skepticism.

Especially to Eric, I want to say that I have always appreciated you coming here to give us your side of the story.  It often has cleared up many an urban myth or killed a nasty rumor.  But, you have a job of work ahead of you when you try to convince this crowd that anything the company does is going to be any different from what it has always done.
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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #69 on: Feb 13, 2008, 04:28 »
Hopefully ERIC or another BARTLETT Representative will bring the thread back on track.  I'm sure that Eric's posting was of interest to many of the members of this site.  I'm also sure that a lot of members have the same question that I do, "What are you Selling"?  Has Bartlett finally decided to invest in the industry?  Are they willing to provide funding and resources to improve the quality of their staff?  I'm also sure that many of their customers are asking the same question!

RG




Offline Meltdown

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #70 on: May 03, 2008, 09:54 »
I just stumbled across this thread - busy season and all that. It makes for interesting reading on both sides; thanks to all the contributors.

I've been observing what's coming through the pipeline for a few years now and have been growing more and more appalled at what passes for an RP tech. This field seemed at one time to be the last great meritocracy - if you had the knowledge it didn't matter whether you got it from the Navy, the University, or that copy of Gollnick you found in the breakroom. You mastered the knowledge, and if you applied yourself you got the opportunity to use it and progressed.

I spend a lot of time at a large southern utility. The pay is very low compared to the rest of the country, but they never have a problem staffing, because over the years they have shown that they will take any warm body and give them a meter. I recently attended training on a new Alpha procedure with a roomful of JR & Sr techs just coming in for an outage. We lost 25 minutes while the staff scientist tried to shepherd the room through three division problems. I'm not talking about air sample calculations or half lifes - I mean A divided by B = C. There was a calculator at each position, but fully a third of the room had that deer in the headlights look and had to be shown how to do it. I understand that a sizable number took the full 1.5 or 2 hours to complete a 25 question open book test with maybe 4 calculations.

I'm not trying to be elitist, and I'm no huge math wizard (thank God for Excel), but I don't think it's an unreasonable expectation that an RP be as familiar with a calculator as he/she is with an RO-2. Maybe a senior could even be able to explain the difference between a frisker and an ion chamber?

As Deep Throat once said to Woodward (or was it Bernstein?) "follow the money". There is no financial incentive for a company to spend money adding value to a product when the customer is perfectly satisfied with the product as it is. If you're happy with Miller Lite are you going to pay $8 for a 4-pack of Samuel Smith? If the contract company provides the utility with the required number of warm bodies who can strap on a meter like a crossing guard with a Sam Browne belt, it makes no difference to anyone at all if half of them are semi-literate and innumerate. The bonus for the customer is that these people aren't likely to slow things down by remembering bothersome procedures, or that 10CFR thing. They also send the rest of us the message that we could be replaced with a mop handle if necessary.

Here's a fun solution - maybe we could make the NUF random just like the whizz quiz. That would give those study guides a workout. Just think of all the inane breakroom conversations you wouldn't have to listen to. That alone gives the idea merit.

Y'all have a nice day, y' hear?
Meltdown

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Offline SloGlo

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #71 on: May 04, 2008, 08:19 »
as sum won whose bin inside 'n outside da pipeline, i kin tell ya it's way better on the outside. 
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dew the best ya kin, wit watt ya have, ware yinze are!

Offline let-it-ride

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #72 on: May 04, 2008, 10:26 »
I think the Utility Companies see an advantage in just having warm bodies sitting at control points. Then the work can get done without much interference from the HP's.
I was once told by a GE Manager that HP stands for "Holding up Progress".
If the HP's become care takers, and there are no accidents, etc. Groovy.

Offline Old HP

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Re: Radiation Safety Worker Pipeline
« Reply #73 on: May 04, 2008, 08:04 »
The definition for " HP Tech " in Webster's Dictionary is " biological speed bump"

 


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