Getting in Nuc

[devondigs]

Hi, I know there are plenty of topics like this, but regardless, each situation is different and I was wondering if I could get input.  I am basically a recent college dropout, 109 units, just shy of a psych major, 2.2 gpa in college.  I've got a 3.4 in high school, recent 99 asvab score, 90th percentile or so in almost all line scores except mechanics(which was a 65th or so percentile), 3 previous traffic violations(nothing worse) failed chem twice in college.  Also I have federal student loans of about 10,000 and personal credit debt of about 3,000.  What do you think is the likelihood of my getting in the nuclear program and how soon at this point do you think I could get in? Also, what kind of enlistment bonuses are there currently? 

[Styrofoam]

Everything you asked can be answered via search. If you searched already and didn't find anything, try different keywords. I answered these questions with searching on my own. You can too.

Edited for politeness.
Hard to believe, right?

[devondigs]

I did do searches on these subjects, but I just wanted opinions on these subjects as a whole.  From what I've gathered so far from what I have searched, it seems the navy is more selective right now than ever, and I was curious about how these negative factors might stack up.  Regardless, I will continue to utilize the search function.

[Styrofoam]

Ok, find out what you'll need waivers for.

Also, are you talking about enlisted or officer?

The guys here will tell you you need at least a 3.3 gpa to be competitive.

Oh yeah. Check out these too:
http://www.cnrc.navy.mil/EIncentives/N5311%20EB/EB/Released%20EB%20Messages/FY11/EB_LRP_GENADMIN_EFF21MAR2011.pdf
http://www.cnrc.navy.mil/publications/1130.8H.htm
Concentrate on Volume IV of the 2nd one for stuff about waivers.

[devondigs]

I'm talking about going in enlisted. I apparently need a waiver for my grades in college chem, why I didn't take advanced math in college, why I want to join the nuc program, and waivers for my traffic violations(there are 2 minor traffic violations).  At least I assume these are waivers as they are all essay submissions that need to be approved.  My recruiter hasn't been totally crystal clear about this.

[Styrofoam]

I'm talking about going in enlisted. I apparently need a waiver for my grades in college chem, why I didn't take advanced math in college, why I want to join the nuc program, and waivers for my traffic violations(there are 2 minor traffic violations).  At least I assume these are waivers as they are all essay submissions that need to be approved.  My recruiter hasn't been totally crystal clear about this.

That's weird. My college grades didn't matter, only the high school math ones.

[devondigs]

Yes, exactly.  And my recruiter can only tell me so much as he wasn't a nuc himself, I think he was a boatswains mate. He just says I need so and so waiver, and he's scheduled me for MEPS for this wednesday, and I have a feeling it'll all be moot if I have waivers that I still need to get approved.

[Styrofoam]

Yes, exactly.  And my recruiter can only tell me so much as he wasn't a nuc himself, I think he was a boatswains mate. He just says I need so and so waiver, and he's scheduled me for MEPS for this wednesday, and I have a feeling it'll all be moot if I have waivers that I still need to get approved.

Well, you could ask your recruiter for the phone number of your local nuke recruiter.

Yeah, you'll have to go to MEPS a few times probably. I think most people do. I had to go twice and stay an extra day once. Had to go the second time because I needed a waiver approved. I recommend doing your own research on top of what your recruiter tells you because sometimes they aren't hip to what's going on in the nuke corner. Example: I scored a 94 on the asvab and nobody said nuke to me. I had to tell them I wanted to take the NAPT (look at my profile for the whole story).

Anyway, keep us posted on how it's going.

[devondigs]

Well, admittedly my recruiter has been decent. He's been pretty gung ho about me going nuc, but its just that he's got a limited experience.  And, I have been researching, quite thoroughly, which has led me to nukeworker in the first place.  After searching for  while I finally posted. Anyway, styrofoam, thanks for bearing with, from what it sounds like I may end up going to meps multiple times as well, its just that I feel like I've wasted a lot of time in college and I want to join the military as soon as possible. But, in the end I suppose that's my own fault.  If anyone has anything useful to post I'd love to hear it and thanks again.

[Cycoticpenguin]

ok. Im gonna start messing with these kids . Am I allowed to do that?

[Gamecock]

ok. Im gonna start messing with these kids . Am I allowed to do that?

NO!

[Higgs]

Hi, I know there are plenty of topics like this, but regardless, each situation is different and I was wondering if I could get input.  I am basically a recent college dropout, 109 units, just shy of a psych major, 2.2 GPA in college.  I've got a 3.4 in high school, recent 99 adverb score, 90th percentile or so in almost all line scores except mechanics(which was a 65th or so percentile), 3 previous traffic violations(nothing worse) failed chem twice in college.  Also I have federal student loans of about 10,000 and personal credit debt of about 3,000.  What do you think is the likelihood of my getting in the nuclear program and how soon at this point do you think I could get in? Also, what kind of enlistment bonuses are there currently?  

You should have absolutely no problems getting in as a nuke, your story is similar to thousands of others. Sounds like you have the aptitude and should do well. Good luck and keep us posted!

Oh, my one piece of caution is to ensure you maintain that debt current.

[Cycoticpenguin]

NO!

Sarcasm. Party of one. Sarcasm. Party of one....

[spekkio]

... it seems the navy is more selective right now than ever, and I was curious about how these negative factors might stack up.

Common misperception. The guys on this site are the guys operating Navy and commercial nuclear power plants; they are not the guys who would select you for entrance into the Navy. While some people here may have done a tour doing that once upon a time, recruiting goals and selectivity change with the phases of the moon.

Bottom line: Most people on this site have no idea what your chances would be. Anyone who does won't comment based on 4 lines of information. The only thing we can offer you is whether or not you are eligible for the program, which you can find out yourself via search and speaking to a recruiter.

PS: You only need waivers for things that would make you ineligible for the program. It is a request to waive a certain requirement. Minor traffic tickets aren't in that category; DUI's, vehicular manslaughter, suspended licenses, etc. are. If you're writing essays explaining why you were doing 40mph in a 30mph zone, you're wasting your time -- the Navy doesn't care. Bad grades are also in that category wrt nuke, but considering that college isn't required to enlist, it's strange that you'd require waivers for your performance in those classes. However, you should have some 'splainin to do, since you're applying for an academically rigorous program with sub-par recent academic performance.

If you have any questions about something or something sounds off, ask him to show you the instruction/requirement. You'll be doing that a lot as a nuke, so consider it your first step of training.

PPS: Your short description screams of someone who went to college, didn't have his head in the game, and is now looking toward the military for financial bail out. If that is the case, you are looking at a very miserable six years, if you can even make it through the program. Regardless if this is the case, you should finish college before you enlist. By the time you get out of the Navy, you will have forgotten most of what you learned and may have to start all over, costing you a lot more money in the long run.

[Cycoticpenguin]

Spekkio... your entire post is completely subjective opinion and is not true in most respsects. If hes going to finish collge first, why bother enlisting in the first place??? ... I just dont understand what you're trying to get at here.

Waivers are required for security clearance. Big navy wont care about your 10mph speeding ticket, but the rules are pretty cut and dry about filling out waivers. Telling the OP to pick and choose which waivers he does or does not do isnt the most integritous thing to do...

[spekkio]

1) There are a myriad of reasons why someone would want to enlist post-college (for starters, a 2.2 gpa makes him ineligible for most if not all Navy commissioning programs, so the only way for him to serve in the Navy would be to enlist). Maybe he's patriotic and the nuke program is what interests him; Pat Tillman gave up millions of dollars in the NFL to enlist in the Army for this very reason. Maybe he's looking at the higher pay of nearly instant E-4 and bonuses in the nuke program. If he doesn't go nuke, a degree can make him eligible for instant E-3 in other ratings and other bonuses. Nevertheless, the point is, at one year away from graduation, it's silly to drop all that and enlist when the Navy will still be there next year. You never know when that BA/BS will come in handy, and in today's job market, you practically need a BA to be a janitor. Pissing away $10k in loans + whatever else he spent on his education is not a wise move when he's less than 1 year away from graduation, no matter how you spin it. Perhaps in your world it's subjective reasoning to pay an exhorbitant amount of money for absolutely nothing, but not in mine.

2) My post was accurate. Speeding tickets don't affect one's security clearance, unless there's the special case of someone building up a bunch of unpaid ones or you were speeding so badly that it led to a suspended license. In fact, the SF-86 tells you to exclude reporting any minor traffic violations with fines of less than $300 in the police record section. So the Navy doesn't care about his 3 traffic tickets, and neither do the security clearance guys.

3) I'm not saying that the OP should pick and choose waivers; what I'm saying is that he's getting some bad information if he's being told he needs a waiver for a few minor traffic violations and bad grades in something that isn't required for entry.

[Cycoticpenguin]

Do more research. Nuke requires more waivers then non critical rates.

These are all the traffic violations nukes need a waiver for. You claim none of us know what we are talking about, and here you are spitting nonsense.



Bicycle ordinance violation.
Blocking or retarding traffic.
Contempt of court for minor traffic offenses.
Crossing yellow line; driving left of center-line.
Disobeying traffic lights, signs, or signals.
Driving on shoulder.
Driving uninsured vehicle.
Driving with blocked vision/tinted window.
Driving with expired plates or without plates.
Driving with suspended or revoked license.
Driving without license.
Driving without registration or with improper registration.
Driving wrong way on one-way street.
Failure to appear for traffic violations.
Failure to comply with officer’s directives.
Failure to have vehicle under control.
Failure to signal.
Failure to stop or yield to pedestrian.
Failure to submit report following accident.
Failure to yield right-of-way.
Faulty equipment, such as defective exhaust, horn, lights, muffler, signal device, or wipers.
Following too closely.
Hitchhiking.
Improper backing; backing into intersection or highway; backing over crosswalk.
Improper blowing of horn.
Improper passing, such as passing on right, in no-passing zone, or passing parked school bus.
Improper turn.
Invalid or unofficial inspection sticker; failure to display inspection sticker.
Jaywalking.
Leaving key in ignition.
Leaving scene of accident (when not considered hit and run).
License plate improperly displayed or not displayed.
Operating overloaded vehicle.
Racing, dragging, or contest for speed.
Reckless, careless or imprudent driving (considered a traffic offense when the fine is less than
$300 and there is no confinement). Court costs are not part of a fine.
Reserved for future use.
Seatbelt/child restraint violation.
Skateboard/roller skate violations.
Speeding
Spilling load on highway.
Spinning wheels; improper start, zigzagging; or weaving in traffic.
Violation of noise control ordinance.

Offenses of similar nature and traffic offenses

[spekkio]

I agree that that is a list of minor traffic violation categories that the DoD uses; however, what you posted says nothing about waiver requirements for enlistment, nuke or not, other than the fact that you think they're required for a single instance. All documentation I've seen allows the applicant up to 5 traffic offenses before requiring a waiver. This is universal for all branches of services and all sub-communities. I am sorry to report that nuke applicants are not, in fact, held to a higher driving standard than other rates.

Aside from that, what you're saying makes no sense. You are arguing that just one minor traffic violation makes someone morally ineligible for the Navy nuke program unless they get a waiver approved by the NRD CO.

Source: Enlistment Instruction

(1) Applicants who admit to having been arrested for, charged with, or convicted of any offense whatsoever, regardless of the final disposition, may not enlist in the Nuclear Field Program without a eligibility waiver.  The only exceptions to this rule are applicants who admit to, have been charged with, or have been convicted of five or less minor traffic offenses over the past two years may enlist without a character eligibility waiver...

So again, what I said two posts ago was 100% accurate. The "..." leads to a list of other minor criminal offenses that don't need a waiver for one instance.

PS: It's also interesting to note that that instruction does not require an applicant to submit any college records to enlist in the Nuclear Navy, but it does say that an applicant who displays a dislike for academics will not be accepted.

[devondigs]

Well, I know my recruiter made it sound like he needed college transcripts, hah, I might have been better off not turning them in. 

[Cycoticpenguin]

same document states :
(2) When an applicant admits to, has been charged with, or arrested for
(regardless of the ultimate disposition of the charge or arrest), or has been convicted of
any offense other than those listed above, or of more than one of the listed
misdemeanors, or of more than one occurrence of any of the listed misdemeanors,
submit a NF Type 1 eligibility waiver....."

Disparity on the paper work?

[spekkio]

Nope, poor reading comprehension on your part. Key words and tricky phrases..."OTHER THAN THOSE LISTED ABOVE" (which is your out for 5 traffic violations).

[Cycoticpenguin]

Nope, poor reading comprehension on your part. Key words and tricky phrases..."OTHER THAN THOSE LISTED ABOVE" (which is your out for 5 traffic violations).

Last post. We're not going to argue this any more. It doesnt specify the five traffic violations bit until MUCH later in the document.  Im not saying you're wrong, Im saying I misread the document because I interpreted traffic tickets as civil violations. 

[spekkio]

I'm not arguing; I'm just trying to post good gouge for the OP  . It's you who threw the BS flag at me for it. That'll teach you to side with a BM  . Although you probably shouldn't give negative karma for 'wrong' information until you make sure you're right.

[Cycoticpenguin]

I'm not arguing; I'm just trying to post good gouge for the OP  . It's you who threw the BS flag at me for it. That'll teach you to side with a BM  . Although you probably shouldn't give negative karma for 'wrong' information until you make sure you're right.

I smited you for implying he should cover up things that recruiters are asking for. Nothing he has will DQ him, and there's no reason to "cover it up" regardless of regulations. If its pointless as you say, it would work itself out anyway. 

BUT, yes I concede I was "misguided" in the gibber-jabber of the regulations.... interpretation... what a @#%^!

[Styrofoam]

Well, I know my recruiter made it sound like he needed college transcripts, hah, I might have been better off not turning them in. 

Since you're going enlisted and nuke, the college transcripts don't matter. If you read the second link I sent you, you would know they only care about high school math.

[devondigs]

I've seen that very same regulation post before, and, as you say regulation and interpretation are two very things.  Imagine how I feel as a potential recruit.  Anyway, I know I've still got waivers to be put in, but my recruiter is sending me to MEPS tomorrow.  From what I've read I gather I'll head out, and if I pass the physical I'll get to the counselor and he/she will tell me what jobs I can do, and if Nuc is available I presume they'll put me in DEP on the supposition that my waivers are accepted?

[devondigs]

Thankyou styrofoam, I had read that link.  I think however, the reason it matters is because I've gotten a less than passing score in chem twice, and if the nuc program or whoever the higherups are perceive an individual as having a dislike for math or chemistry, they'll dq on those grounds. 

[Styrofoam]

That's close, but the official document, which is also in the second link volume iv, says "enlistment in the nf program will be denied to any individual who actively expresses a strong dislike for mathematics and physics." I take that to mean something like telling them you don't like math. I failed many math courses in college and even needed a waiver for a high school math class and they didn't care about the collge ones.

[devondigs]

Did your recruiter have you fill out any handwritten statements for those grades in college? Because I am.

[Styrofoam]

Nope. The transcripts were just put in my file. That's it.

[devondigs]

Geez, now I just feel like I'm getting overly scrutinized within a cohort of super scrutinized candidates.

[Styrofoam]

Trust me. I'm the queen of freaking out so I can tell. You're freaking out. 

[Cycoticpenguin]

I graduated highschool with around a 2.3. I got in just fine, if that gives you any warm fuzzies. and YES I had to do a couple waivers for that :p

[730SMAG]

I graduated highschool with around a 2.3. I got in just fine, if that gives you any warm fuzzies. and YES I had to do a couple waivers for that :p

Waiver for psychological counseling for anger problems - check.
Waiver for fighting in school - check.
Waiver for failing calculus one - check.
Waiver for failing calculus two - check.
Waiver for being a naturalized US citizen - check.
Waiver for minor in possession - check.
Waiver for speeding ticket - check.


Waivers: You can get them for almost everything!

[Cycoticpenguin]

Waiver for psychological counseling for anger problems - check.
Waiver for fighting in school - check.
Waiver for failing calculus one - check.
Waiver for failing calculus two - check.
Waiver for being a naturalized US citizen - check.
Waiver for minor in possession - check.
Waiver for speeding ticket - check.


Waivers: You can get them for almost everything!

You're about 11 short of mine

[MacGyver]

You're about 11 short of mine

Let me throw you a line ... you look like you could use the help.



I had no idea it was a contest to see who had the most waivers and could still get into the Nuke Nav.  I think you and I have a different idea/view about what is and is not acceptable.

Truth in advertisement statement:
Silly me I didn't need any waivers.    

 

[Higgs]

Silly me I didn't need any waivers.    

 

Same here. 

[HydroDave63]

You're about 11 short of mine

Including the narcissism/every-single-thread-is-about-me waiver

[spekkio]

I smited you for implying he should cover up things that recruiters are asking for. Nothing he has will DQ him, and there's no reason to "cover it up" regardless of regulations. If its pointless as you say, it would work itself out anyway. 

I see the confusion. I wasn't implying that he should cover up anything; rather, I was saying that he's wasting his time writing essays to obtain waivers for traffic violations because it's not necessary -- no one who's of any importance to his entry into the nuclear pipeline is going to read them. If that is what his recruiter is telling him he needs to do, his recruiter is misinformed. It's easy to see how this may have happened given the gigantic book spanning multiple volumes that has a gajillion requirements. Again, I was NOT implying that he should blow off a requirement or hide his traffic violations.

The college performance is a gray area, and I'm not sure how that's handled on the enlisted end. On the one hand, he wasn't required to attend college to qualify for the program. On the other, he demonstrated poor performance in the few technical college courses he did take (eg, Chemistry), and demonstrated lackluster performance in a non-technical major that the nuclear Navy would probably consider "easier" (Navy's opinion, not mine).  This would raise a big red flag for me regarding someone's ability to complete the program, regardless of whether or not it's required for entry. Think of any reason why someone would be performing poorly in college, and they are probably paralleled to why someone would perform poorly in the nuclear power pipeline... "I just didn't like school..." "I couldn't handle the material..." "It took me 3 years to figure out that psychology wasn't interesting to me..." "I didn't put the appropriate effort into my classes..." "My teachers didn't speak English..." The only valid reason for poor performance would be if a person had to work a ton of hours to put himself through school. The Navy can fix that part.

[730SMAG]

I had no idea it was a contest to see who had the most waivers and could still get into the Nuke Nav.  I think you and I have a different idea/view about what is and is not acceptable.

Truth in advertisement statement:
Silly me I didn't need any waivers.    

 

It's less the "didn't need waivers" thing, so much as the fact that there are a variety of waivers that can be obtained, depending on the effort your recruiter is willing to go through.  I admit I was young and dumb at one point - now I'm just old and dumb - and did irresponsible things.  I cleaned up my act, got on the straight and narrow, and eventually left the Nuclear Navy with a honorable discharge, some fond memories, and my integrity intact. 

People can grow up.  I know that enlisting helped me do that.  Looking back now, I would have smacked my younger self upside the head so many times I'd be walking around with a permanent concussion.

[devondigs]

I know its been a while, but just as a follow up I was recently denied nuke according to my recruiter "for my past credit history and previous tickets".  According to my recruiter this could potentially forestall or prevent top secret clearance,  which would ultimately prevent me from moving further.  At this point I'll decide whether or not I'll pursue advanced electronics or some other career. Thanks everyone for the help!

[Higgs]

Very sorry to hear that my friend. Good luck to you!

[stefanc2011]

Sorry to hear that, but they really denied you for a $10,000 student loan and $3,000 personal loan?  Is your credit bad or have you never missed a payment etc? I got in, and i have a car loan of $14,000 and a student loan of $3500...this worries me now, though, with potential problems on the security clearance.

Edit - My fault, it was late when I read this and for some reason I replaced 'past credit history' with 'past debt history' or something...I dunno, it was late.  Anything and everything is causing me to freak out right now..I ship out next Sunday, so i'm a bit nervous.