Which to choose? MM EM ET (ELT?)/career options

[JoeSBK]

I'm going to be joining via GED and 15 college credits, I already have my GED and am currently choosing community college classes to get my 15 credits.

The recruiter said I won't have any issues joining, but I still don't know which MOS to apply for, do they let you choose between the three options or is it a case filling under manned gaps?

Also, I'd just like to point out I didn't drop out of highschool, when I was 14 my family moved to Thailand and school over there isn't an option if you can't afford to pay 90k a year, sadly, when I moved back to the U.S. I was "too old" to finish highschool, so I basically just taught myself the high-school curriculum.


On a side note, how is a nuclear career? I like the idea of intense learning/education, 77 college credits is great too, is it actually feasible if you want to do anything other than a nuclear career out of the navy? I plan on going to medical school when I'm out (pre-med?), so I'm really trying to get a grasp of what being navy nuke consists of.

Any suggestions for college courses would also be helpful, not sure if a specific course would help or not.


Thank you for reading, I appreciate replies.

Some details.

Currently 18.

starting college in January.

Should have credits by July.

According to my ASVAB scores I scored high enough not to need a NAPT.

No Girlfriend/wife/family in the area, relocation is not an issue.

[Fermi2]

Currently should learn to use the search function as these questions are already answered.

[HeavyD]

First point, it's called a rating, not an MOS.  That's Army speak.

Second, the only rate you can choose, and not have it changed on you, is MM.  On that note, ELT isn't a rate.  As an ELT you are rated as a MM.  ELT is a specialization that you learn through a class "C" School.  On a surface ship, your primary role is as an ELT.  On a sub, 1 of the 4 or 5 of you are the underway ELT, the rest are MMs, standing watch for M-Div.

Lastly, those 77 credits are "recommended" by the American Council of Education (ACE).  They in no way, shape, or form are guaranteed, unless the degree you are pursuing is in Nuclear Engineering Technology from a select few schools; Thomas Edison is one of these.

Not trying to beat you up more, but these are facts about our program.

[bigdog46]

One correction, ELT is an elite specialization, heavy on the elite.

[JoeSBK]

First point, it's called a rating, not an MOS.  That's Army speak.

Second, the only rate you can choose, and not have it changed on you, is MM.  On that note, ELT isn't a rate.  As an ELT you are rated as a MM.  ELT is a specialization that you learn through a class "C" School.  On a surface ship, your primary role is as an ELT.  On a sub, 1 of the 4 or 5 of you are the underway ELT, the rest are MMs, standing watch for M-Div.

Lastly, those 77 credits are "recommended" by the American Council of Education (ACE).  They in no way, shape, or form are guaranteed, unless the degree you are pursuing is in Nuclear Engineering Technology from a select few schools; Thomas Edison is one of these.

Not trying to beat you up more, but these are facts about our program.

Okay, thank you, and, you can use any bachelor's degree for premed granted you also include specific courses as well, so yes I will pursue Nuclear engineering Technology as a major.

Does anyone else recommend anything? and thanks Broad, I tried searching earlier but it didn't work out as well, I just used the 'advanced search' and I found what I wanted.

What about ELT? I've been seeing alot of negative (and sarcastic) responses about them.

and finally, are any jobs considered better than the other when it comes to a future career?


Thank you.

[HydroDave63]

What about ELT? I've been seeing alot of negative (and sarcastic) responses about them.

and finally, are any jobs considered better than the other when it comes to a future career?


Thank you.

If you can successfully decode this video:

you'll be a fine sub ELT

If not, probably a magazine-reading slug EM on another air-conditioned Load Center watch on a birdfarm....

[JoeSBK]

If you can successfully decode this video:

you'll be a fine sub ELT

If not, probably a magazine-reading slug EM on another air-conditioned Load Center watch on a birdfarm....

Oh lord, just from my own experiences, it's about Ladyboys and being careful around attractive women, "if you're lucky your god is a she."

Anyway off topic, no one suggests anything then? and what naval phrases should I know? I grew up around Army people so their slang/terms is mainly what I know.

[song of the south]

Most important Navy term - Aye Aye. Definition - I understand and will comply.

Also check this out:

http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,26145.0.html

[HeavyD]

What do you like?

MM - pumps, valves, lube oil systems, etc

EM - Motors, electrical generators, etc

ET - some circuitry based equipment, standing watch staring at the reactor control panel, etc

ELT - simple water chemistry and radiochemistry analysis, radiological controls with relatively low (compared to commercial work) contamination levels, along with the job that MMs do (mainly for our submarine brethren)

Go for what interests you.  However, like I already posted, the only rate you can get guaranteed before going to boot camp is MM.  That is if they haven't changed anything since I joined in December of 1991.

You can request EM or ET, but you wont know for sure until sometime in boot camp when the Nuke classifier sorts out who fills what quotas.  That will be your first experience with the most important phrase you will hear; "Needs of the Navy".

As for ELT, you submit a request while at prototype.  The staff goes through a sorting process, can't recall if we interviewed people or not ( my staff tour as an ELT was at Charleston, Nov 1996 to Feb 2000, so it's been awhile).  Then they tell the lucky few that get to be a part of the ultra cool kids club:)

Best of luck and thank you for volunteering to serve!

[JoeSBK]

Which one gets the most training/experience? that's basically what I'm aiming for, If possible the best case scenario for me is to finish 6 years with a B.S. (or credit equivalent)

Or atleast I heard you can achieve a B.S. while enlisted.


So what about courses in community college for credits? I think physics and calculus would be logical granted nukes use it, otherwise just for fun. 

[spekkio]

You won't come out of your first 6 year commitment with a B.S. It isn't possible unless you can function on 0-2 hours of sleep a day over a prolonged period of time. And then there's the whole thing of standing duty once every 3 or 4 days getting in the way of 'attending' classes either online or in person.

If you want a B.S., go to school. The Navy isn't an accredited university.

If you want the Navy to pay for school, you have a few options:

1) enlist and use the GI bill when you get out. Applies to all rates.
2) NROTC, you may be restricted in major though.
3) NUPOC, only for nukes.
4) USNA

Using tuition assistance/PACE courses isn't realistic in your first sea tour as an enlisted servicemember. And the highest I've ever seen a submarine nuke get in PACE courses is a C+, but only like 1 or 2 people who enrolled actually finished the course. That's because it's entirely self-study with no access to the internet to find a youtube video to explain something you don't understand. The XO was not happy.

So what about courses in community college for credits? I think physics and calculus would be logical granted nukes use it, otherwise just for fun.

None.

You don't do college level coursework as an enlisted nuke. You can get a bunch of random credits at a select few universities such as Exelcior, but your training will not give you credits toward any 'traditional' bacchelorate coursework like calculus or physics.

[HeavyD]

I think you're missing the big picture here about what you are obligating yourself for by enlisting in the US Navy.

Your first 24 months you'll be at training commands.  You wont be given an opportunity to attend off duty education, because your schooling is your job.  You wont be eligible for any kind of education assistance, because you are in training; you aren't permanently attached to the command.

If you only plan on doing a 6 and out tour, your entire remaining 4 years will be either on a ship or a sub.  The first year there, your primary focus will be on getting qualified senior-in-rate; meaning qualified all of the requisite watchstations and your final senior level watchstation.  Plus continuing training. And maintenance.  And cleaning the engineering spaces. And standing duty. And performing general military training.

And hopefully you start to get the picture.  Your posts almost sound like you think there is going to be some big spots of free time where you can go and take a couple of college classes here and there and finish a B.S. degree.  Not. Going. To. Happen.

If, and that's a big IF, you manage to end up on a carrier going into the yards for overhaul and refueling, you might get an opportunity to attend some classes on a somewhat routine basis. 

Enlisting in the military means you are volunteering to serve your country; you become the property of the US government and they aren't paying you to get a degree.  They are paying you to do what they tell you, when they tell you. 

This isn't meant as a rain on your parade response; these are realities of what being an enlisted member of the US Navy is about.  Being underway, working long hours, putting up with people you don't like and can't escape, because you all live within 75 feet of each other (at least on a carrier the berthing was that big), with your only private space being a rack literally the size of a coffin.

Engineering rates, both nuke and conventional, are the first ones on board for an underway and the last ones to leave when you pull back in.

The recruiter isn't lying to you about the potential college credits; some colleges will give you some credits.  Excelsior and Thomas Edison State College have degree programs tailored for Navy nukes.  However, these are Engineering Technology degrees, not Engineering Degrees.  There is a definitive difference between the two and you can't substitute a Eng Tech degree in a lot of instances.

Do some research on your own, away from this site.  Google "Navy College" and "navy+ degree" and see what you come up with.

6 and out makes you eligible for an entry level position as an Auxiliary/Non-Licensed Operator at a civilian plant.  Period.  Along with every other 6 and outer that is going to be competing with you for that job.   

Lastly, if you want to be a doctor (I assume this from your original post about wanting to go pre-med after the Navy), being an enlisted Nuke isn't going to do anything for you, other than take away 6 years of your life.  It's not going to put you in a position to finish a Bachelor's degree that will get you into med-school.  Sorry to sound harsh, but this is reality.

Good luck.

[JoeSBK]

Thank you, I'm understanding the nuke program alot better now, I'm happy to join as long as I get experience enough to get a stable job after I'm out, and use the GI bill to get a degree/premed.

My expectations were a bit illogical now that I see that free time isn't a thing, but again, all worth it as long as I can get a degree eventually, and part of a degree and or comprehension of the field while in. I don't think it will be a waste of six years granted I probably wouldn't be able to afford college on my own, and that nukes would give me a whole lot more knowledge than most branches.

I appreciate the honesty.


So is there is nothing to help prepare for the field? I have at least a year to study anything I want.

[spekkio]

If MD is your ultimate goal, the Navy has a medical school scholarship program in return for service obligation. You'd commission directly as an O-3 and you'd basically be a physician while in the Navy. If you go underway, you'd be on a carrier or a specialty hospital ship. You'd have to speak to the medical officer recruiter in your NRD for more details (and you'll have to get your bachelor's on your own).

If medical is your passion and you are still set on enlisting, why not HM? It won't get you into medical school, but surely you can use experience actually treating patients on a medical school application essay a lot better than what you do as a nuke. And your job will at least be something you are somewhat interested in doing.

[Marlin]

If MD is your ultimate goal, the Navy has a medical school scholarship program in return for service obligation. You'd commission directly as an O-3 and you'd basically be a physician while in the Navy. If you go underway, you'd be on a carrier or a specialty hospital ship. You'd have to speak to the medical officer recruiter in your NRD for more details (and you'll have to get your bachelor's on your own).

If medical is your passion and you are still set on enlisting, why not HM? It won't get you into medical school, but surely you can use experience actually treating patients on a medical school application essay a lot better than what you do as a nuke. And your job will at least be something you are somewhat interested in doing.

When submarine hulls were teak some of the boomers carried a doctor instead of a Corpsman does that still happen?

[JoeSBK]

If MD is your ultimate goal, the Navy has a medical school scholarship program in return for service obligation. You'd commission directly as an O-3 and you'd basically be a physician while in the Navy. If you go underway, you'd be on a carrier or a specialty hospital ship. You'd have to speak to the medical officer recruiter in your NRD for more details (and you'll have to get your bachelor's on your own).

If medical is your passion and you are still set on enlisting, why not HM? It won't get you into medical school, but surely you can use experience actually treating patients on a medical school application essay a lot better than what you do as a nuke. And your job will at least be something you are somewhat interested in doing.

I have looked into that, it requires requires 4 years of college I can't afford, HM could possibly also be another choice, but I'm interested in nuclear physics/engineering too, so it's not something I would hate to do.

Plus if I were to go medic route, I would probably go Ranger medic, I know alot of people that are medics over there, but they say it doesn't at all compare to being a doctor.

However I will probably do the medical school scholarship after I get my MD (theoretically), who knows! I might love the nuclear science enough to pursue that instead.

[spekkio]

Have you spoken to a college financial aid counselor?

Also similar to ship selection, you cannot go into Army medic with a guarantee to be attached to the Rangers regiment. Instinctively I wouldn't think they'd even take first tour guys (similar to subs and HMs), but who knows.

Medic is essentially a field EMT. Yea it's quite a bit different from being a physician but a lot closer than cleaning bilges.

[JoeSBK]

Have you spoken to a college financial aid counselor?

Also similar to ship selection, you cannot go into Army medic with a guarantee to be attached to the Rangers regiment. Instinctively I wouldn't think they'd even take first tour guys (similar to subs and HMs), but who knows.

Medic is essentially a field EMT. Yea it's quite a bit different from being a physician but a lot closer than cleaning bilges.

I really don't want to end up with over 50k in debt because I had to take loans, and with having a GED comes with a loser/dropout stigma, so scholarships aren't really an option.

And about the Ranger medic, from what they say, with a good performance record and a airborne contract (BAC I think?) it's a pretty good chance I would end up Ranger, either way I'm pretty sure 68w's can get option 40 contracts, which is sorta hard to get, but I also know some recruiters and they are more than willing to help me out, But I really would like to go a more intellectual route, and Navy nukes (to me at least) seem to be brilliant.

[spekkio]

You want to be an MD, who make a min average of $180k/yr for pediatric and internal medicine and above $200k/yr for everything else, and you're sweating the undergrad loans to the point that you want to delay this goal by 6-8 years? Doesn't make a whole lot of sense, but good luck.

[JoeSBK]

You want to be an MD, who make a min average of $180k/yr for pediatric and internal medicine and above $200k/yr for everything else, and you're sweating the undergrad loans to the point that you want to delay this goal by 6-8 years? Doesn't make a whole lot of sense, but good luck.

I could possibly do that, I don't think I would be able to pay off the debt in time though, you also have residency, which you only get paid 50k a year for 4 years, med school, plus college, adds up to around 230k, but not only that, it's 4 years of college, 4 years of med school, and 4 years residency. All while getting a job in the mean time is pretty hard, most people can't even work during med school due to intense studying, I'm not from a privileged family.

I'm talking to the college counselor on Monday, So I'll see what's feasible or not.

[Fermi2]

Being an ELT has a lot of distractions as you are constantly being chased and adored by supermodels and hot actresses. Even now as an ex ELT Sofia Vergara refuses to leave me alone.

[GLW]

Being an ELT has a lot of distractions as you are constantly being chased and adored by supermodels and hot actresses. Even now as an ex ELT Sofia Vergara refuses to leave me alone.

I've been waiting four days for you to post truth as only you can post it,....

As always, it was worth the wait,....

[Fermi2]

I was busy job hunting! But I knew it was my obligation to set everyone straight on this important matter!

[spekkio]

I could possibly do that, I don't think I would be able to pay off the debt in time though, you also have residency, which you only get paid 50k a year for 4 years, med school, plus college, adds up to around 230k, but not only that, it's 4 years of college, 4 years of med school, and 4 years residency. All while getting a job in the mean time is pretty hard, most people can't even work during med school due to intense studying, I'm not from a privileged family.

I'm talking to the college counselor on Monday, So I'll see what's feasible or not.

Yea it's a lot of schooling and you'll have some bills due at first, but as long as you don't use your new employment to buy a mercedes and million dollar estate you should be able to handle paying it off in under 10 years (including residency).

I'm just curious where you think being an enlisted nuke makes any of that stuff go away vice just putting it off for 6-8 years. It only gets harder as you get older, and if you're just in it for the GI bill for undergrad then pick a rating with only a 4 year commitment.

[GLW]

.....I'm just curious where you think being an enlisted nuke makes any of that stuff go away vice just putting it off for 6-8 years. It only gets harder as you get older, and if you're just in it for the GI bill for undergrad then pick a rating with only a 4 year commitment.

The OP should really heed those words,...

I've lost count of how many times I've cautioned this,...

Only go nuke if you want to be a nuke,....

If you want the GI Bill, or a twenty year career, or anything else then choose something else,...

Propay, bonuses, fast rate advancement, none of it, none of it, none of it will make you happy if you're miserable being a nuke,...

But if you like it, if you know you want to be in the propulsion department of a nuclear submarine by all means go for it, 'cause it's the only way you'll get there as an enlisted sailor,...

It ain't "beam me up Scotty" stuff, but it can be okay if that's your cup of tea,....

And the ELTs are the only ones privileged to be "Masters of Their Domain",...

[HydroDave63]

Only go nuke if you want to be a nuke,....

If you want the GI Bill, or a twenty year career, or anything else then choose something else,...

Very true...sonar tech makes rate pretty quickly, no ORSE hassles, you have a wider array of ships/subs to choose from [plus a way better chance of getting beach liberty in Phattaya or Da Nang or Subic or Tasmania] rather than simply being stuck on a floating 5000 person crime wave with a noisy 24/7 airshow topside.

[Fermi2]

Sigh, I still remember Farrah Fawcett whispering "say charged disk again baby" in my ear.

[HydroDave63]

Sigh, I still remember Farrah Fawcett whispering "say charged disk again baby" in my ear.

And then you woke up, with the LELT dipping your hand in a cup of warm water, right?

[DLGN25]

When submarine hulls were teak some of the boomers carried a doctor instead of a Corpsman does that still happen?

Not since they fixed the leaks.
We had a doctor, trained in nuclear medicine, on Bainbridge.  He hated it, but it was better then a MASH unit.

[JoeSBK]

The OP should really heed those words,...

I've lost count of how many times I've cautioned this,...

Only go nuke if you want to be a nuke,....

If you want the GI Bill, or a twenty year career, or anything else then choose something else,...

Propay, bonuses, fast rate advancement, none of it, none of it, none of it will make you happy if you're miserable being a nuke,...

But if you like it, if you know you want to be in the propulsion department of a nuclear submarine by all means go for it, 'cause it's the only way you'll get there as an enlisted sailor,...

It ain't "beam me up Scotty" stuff, but it can be okay if that's your cup of tea,....

And the ELTs are the only ones privileged to be "Masters of Their Domain",...

Good points I guess, I want to go nuke because of the College perks, but I guess those are non existent, but I mean, can you seriously get loans you only have to start paying back in 8-9 years?

[spekkio]

I've been out of the game for a while wrt college loans, but when I went in the early 2000s you saw the financial aid specialist. Depending on your income (or your parents if they still claimed you as a dependent for the deduction on their income taxes), you qualified for a certain amount of subsidized or unsubsidized federal loans (or grants if your income was exceptionally low). Beyond a certain maximum, you had to take private loans. All of those numbers would be different in 2013.

Your student loans were due when you stopped being a full-time student, and if you had trouble getting employment or had financial hardship you could just notify the company and defer the payments (interest kept accruing though, and some motivated people would pay down some of their on the loans while working part-time in undergraduate school). Student loans are exceptionally easy to work with to defer payment compared to other credit card/loans. And when you do start repaying them, the interest is deducted from your annual income for taxes. That's not a whole lot, but it helps.

But to put things in perspective, I paid off $25k in student loans in my first two years of the Navy, during which time I made $48k and $40k/year, respectively, which includes BAH/BAS and the nuclear accession bonuses. The loans were low because I had an academic scholarship to a state school based on SAT scores so the loans were to support room/books; if you're 'nuke material' you probably scored well enough to qualify for scholarships yourself. Paying off the loans is about prioritizing and I chose to not have cable and internet and drove a cheap car instead of paying double my loans back over the life of the loan. Student loans are only scary if you spend a lot on a private university and come out the other end with no job prospects because you majored in something dumb and spent your free time playing GTA V.

There aren't really any college perks wrt being an enlisted nuke that you couldn't get through any other rating -- all Navy servicemembers can get the GI bill and some random A or C school credits that medical schools wouldn't give two poops about. Also, I wouldn't expect medical schools to know about the Navy nuke program or how quickly they feed you the information (this is unfortunate because if they did then it would certainly give you a leg up against the competition because it would support your ability to succeed in medical school). They're more likely just to put you into the 'prior military service' blanket category.

[Fermi2]

And then you woke up, with the LELT dipping your hand in a cup of warm water, right?

  Yet ANOTHER Non ELT Type hater who is jealous because the Pussycat Dolls don't have HIM on speed dial!

[HalfHazzard]

I could possibly do that, I don't think I would be able to pay off the debt in time though, you also have residency, which you only get paid 50k a year for 4 years, med school, plus college, adds up to around 230k, but not only that, it's 4 years of college, 4 years of med school, and 4 years residency. All while getting a job in the mean time is pretty hard, most people can't even work during med school due to intense studying, I'm not from a privileged family.

I'm talking to the college counselor on Monday, So I'll see what's feasible or not.

Not to pile on into this thread, but readjust your focus here.

For the last decade and more, the federal government has been loaning money to college kids to get USELESS degrees (let alone medicine which there is a shortage of) who end up unemployed and living with their parents.  If you doubt me, get a subscription to the Wall Street Journal, it's been well documented.  As if this isn't crazy enough, our politicians feel that the money isn't easy enough to get.

So consider: you're not the first kid to go to medical school with lack of funds.  Not every doctor out there comes from a family that can pay Harvard tuition for their kids for 8+ years.  And you're (almost) guaranteed a job if you finish and get that residency done.

Have you checked into programs that repay med school loans if you commit to practice in a rural area for some time?  That's just option that I personally know someone who took.

Yeah the military is an option, and probably a good one if you can put life on hold for 6 years.  Plenty of us on here did that or more and it worked out.  But unlike college loans, nothing else will be given to you, and you still have to ask for those.

Good luck.

[spekkio]

For the last decade and more, the federal government has been loaning money to college kids to get USELESS degrees (let alone medicine which there is a shortage of) who end up unemployed and living with their parents.  If you doubt me, get a subscription to the Wall Street Journal, it's been well documented.  As if this isn't crazy enough, our politicians feel that the money isn't easy enough to get.

I don't think that the degree is the problem per se; people with college education eventually earn a lot more than people without on average.

I think the problem is that my generation was told a college degree will entitle you to a near 6-figure income, and thus many students do nothing more than [not] attend class for 15-20 hours a week and spend their free time doing things that generally aren't productive. Frequently I would attend lectures where a class of 200-300 students widdled down to 30-50 regulars during the semester, except when exams were given. So when someone graduates college and their resume is filled with bullshit paired with a mediocre GPA, their job prospects are slim. Now add in the fact that employers don't like taking chances on young 20 somethings with no outstanding special talents because they like to jump ship often or call in drunk on Fridays.

[JoeSBK]

Hmm, I guess I should see what my options are.

Is it possible to go to college while enlisted at all? my only problem with college is room and board, since I'll be busy with academics, I won't be able to be as reliable to my employers.

Would student loans pay for food/campus rooming?

[DLGN25]

Hmm, I guess I should see what my options are.

Is it possible to go to college while enlisted at all? my only problem with college is room and board, since I'll be busy with academics, I won't be able to be as reliable to my employers.

Would student loans pay for food/campus rooming?

Go see to college career counseling to help you figure out what you want to do. 

I did the nuke program, had no time for family, let alone getting a quality college degree.  In at 19, out at 25 with a wife and a house.  Five years later while working with skills the Navy taught me,  I had my degree at age 30.  And yes earned with the help of the GI Bill back then, I became an accountant.

You do not want to go that route. 

Time for you to go to a different site to try and figure out what you want to do.  What is offered here is a difficult path with a different future.  Here is not the place I believe you want to be.

[spekkio]

Is it possible to go to college while enlisted at all?

Not during your first tour as a nuke.

You can take SOME college credits via PACE courses and such (which amounts to self-study with a CD and textbook), but you cannot be a full-time student while you are enlisted in the military. You'd end up with 2 or 3 classes under your belt, not even a semester's worth of coursework.

As a nuke, you'd have to get a cushy shore duty, which is really hard to get as a nuke, to be able to attend night school part time. But that requires reenlisting and another sea tour. The de-facto nuke shore duty is prototype, which is shift work and thus doesn't allow you to attend college. You're also looking at 10-12 years of commitment to the Navy to be able to do it, and the shore tour is only 2-3 years which won't allow you to finish school just going part-time at night. There are no undergraduate shore duties that put you through school akin to NPS/NWC for officers and select few SNCOs with undergrad degrees.

So, keeping in mind that you originally said that you already have post-Navy plans and don't want to be a career Sailor, I'd bet a large sum of money that getting a degree while serving in the military isn't going to happen for you. You'll be too busy qualifying and learning your rate, and by the time you get good enough at your job to even start thinking about taking college coursework you will be 1-2 years from saying "see ya" to the Navy. By that point, you might as well wait until you get out and use the GI bill instead of kill yourself to get 9 credit-hours of work done in a couple of years with mediocre grades because you have no access to professors.

There are some people who have done their bachelor's while on their first tour, but they weren't submariners or nukes and even they said it required non-stop work and a high amount of discipline to finish.

my only problem with college is room and board, since I'll be busy with academics, I won't be able to be as reliable to my employers.

Would student loans pay for food/campus rooming?

All good questions for a college financial aid counselor. Living off campus and doing your own grocery shopping will cut costs on rent and food (bonus: they also don't kick you out over the summer so you can stay local and continue to hold your job(s)), but you'll have to find a way to get to/from college. The university I attended allowed you to use the local bus system for free.

Also, spend some time on the internet searching for scholarships/grants that can help you out.

As for working part-time, schedule all your classes only in the morning or only in the evening to the max extent possible. If it's anything like when I attended college, you won't have a big issue until the 10 or 11 am class. The kick in the balls is going to be labwork if you do a technical major (and you should if you're trying to get into medical school or just generally want to be employed after college).

And if you do decide to enlist for the GI bill because the numbers don't add up, this goes back to my original advice: Pick a rating with a 4 year commitment that you think will be interesting to you. Because when it comes to the GI bill, it doesn't matter what you do in the Navy, the 6-8 year nuke tour (depending if you STAR for that extra stripe) is going to pay the same $18,700 tuition and E-5 BAH that the 4 year BM tour will pay.

[HeavyD]

I briefly touched on this in an earlier response but wanted to make sure it is addressed adequately.

The college credits that the recruiter is boasting about are real.  However, as I said earlier, they are RECOMMENDATIONS made by ACE (American Council on Education).  A college/university is not obligated nor required to give you those credits based on your service.

Second, and this is probably more important for your specific scenario, to maximize those credits, you are going to have to get your degree from one of the handful or so colleges/universities that offer specialized degrees or degrees targeted towards certain vocations that your Navy experience translates into. 

For Nukes, two of those colleges are Excelsior and Thomas Edison State College.

Here is a degree program for a Navy Nuke MM from Excelsior (BS in Nuclear Engineering Technology):
https://my.excelsior.edu/c/document_library/get_file?uuid=fef0af5d-4fa7-428d-b83f-6fb2f0debea0&groupId=78666

Thomas Edison State College, Navy Nuke of any rate (BS in Applied Science and Technology in Nuclear Engineering Technology):
http://www.tesc.edu/ast/bsast/Nuclear-Engineering.cfm

So, what is so bad about those degrees?  Nothing, if you want to work in the Nuclear industry and don't want a job that requires an actual Engineering degree.  Eng Tech degrees are more about application of Engineering based concepts in an industrial type setting.  Engineering degrees are about analysis, calculational application and design of systems and/or structures and processes in a variety of fields.

If a job says "requires a degree in an engineering discipline" and you have an engineering tech degree, you aren't eligible for that job.

I don't post this information to dissuade you; I post this so that you have a clearer picture of the real world application of what the recruiter is using to sell the Nuclear Power Program to you.  Is the recruiter wrong?  No.  Is the recruiter a Nuke?  That's a question to ask:0

My recruiter was a MS (now CS, Culinary Specialist, i.e. a cook).  I asked him what he knew about the Nuke program and he told me "Well, I don't know a whole lot.  I hear it's a tough program, quite a few people don't make it through, Nukes have big bonuses and they get advanced pretty quick."  (I still appreciate his honesty.  Maybe I had a unique experience.)

Do I say these things because I am against the program?  Absolutely not.  I thoroughly enjoyed being a Nuke; so much so that I spent 20 years on Active Duty.  I had a pretty quick advancement up through Chief (E-7) and would have made Master Chief (E-9) easily if I hadn't screwed up and did something that I knew better than to do.  (that's a different story for a different time).

In short, I want to ensure that you have the information in front of you to be able to make the best decision for you.  If you join as a Nuke and end up being miserable, it will effect your performance, which in turn will get the attention of your Chief and has the potential to effect your entire division.  You don't want to be that guy/gal.

We here can offer our past experiences and advice.  We CANNOT make the decision for you.  Research, soul search, try and figure out at least a short range (1 - 2 year) and medium range (2 - 5 year) plan that includes what you want to be doing at the end of those phases.  Do what will end up being best for YOU.

Best of luck to you, in everything!

[SpaceJustice]

Not during your first tour as a nuke.



There are some people who have done their bachelor's while on their first tour, but they weren't submariners or nukes and even they said it required non-stop work and a high amount of discipline to finish.

Not entirely true.  There were several individuals in my department who were able to finish bachelor's and master's degrees on the submarine.  The trick is finishing your quals quickly and working either during off-crew (SSBN/SSGN exclusive) or getting a boat that is going into a refueling overhaul.

[JoeSBK]

I briefly touched on this in an earlier response but wanted to make sure it is addressed adequately.

The college credits that the recruiter is boasting about are real.  However, as I said earlier, they are RECOMMENDATIONS made by ACE (American Council on Education).  A college/university is not obligated nor required to give you those credits based on your service.

Second, and this is probably more important for your specific scenario, to maximize those credits, you are going to have to get your degree from one of the handful or so colleges/universities that offer specialized degrees or degrees targeted towards certain vocations that your Navy experience translates into. 

For Nukes, two of those colleges are Excelsior and Thomas Edison State College.

Here is a degree program for a Navy Nuke MM from Excelsior (BS in Nuclear Engineering Technology):
https://my.excelsior.edu/c/document_library/get_file?uuid=fef0af5d-4fa7-428d-b83f-6fb2f0debea0&groupId=78666

Thomas Edison State College, Navy Nuke of any rate (BS in Applied Science and Technology in Nuclear Engineering Technology):
http://www.tesc.edu/ast/bsast/Nuclear-Engineering.cfm

So, what is so bad about those degrees?  Nothing, if you want to work in the Nuclear industry and don't want a job that requires an actual Engineering degree.  Eng Tech degrees are more about application of Engineering based concepts in an industrial type setting.  Engineering degrees are about analysis, calculational application and design of systems and/or structures and processes in a variety of fields.

If a job says "requires a degree in an engineering discipline" and you have an engineering tech degree, you aren't eligible for that job.

I don't post this information to dissuade you; I post this so that you have a clearer picture of the real world application of what the recruiter is using to sell the Nuclear Power Program to you.  Is the recruiter wrong?  No.  Is the recruiter a Nuke?  That's a question to ask:0

My recruiter was a MS (now CS, Culinary Specialist, i.e. a cook).  I asked him what he knew about the Nuke program and he told me "Well, I don't know a whole lot.  I hear it's a tough program, quite a few people don't make it through, Nukes have big bonuses and they get advanced pretty quick."  (I still appreciate his honesty.  Maybe I had a unique experience.)

Do I say these things because I am against the program?  Absolutely not.  I thoroughly enjoyed being a Nuke; so much so that I spent 20 years on Active Duty.  I had a pretty quick advancement up through Chief (E-7) and would have made Master Chief (E-9) easily if I hadn't screwed up and did something that I knew better than to do.  (that's a different story for a different time).

In short, I want to ensure that you have the information in front of you to be able to make the best decision for you.  If you join as a Nuke and end up being miserable, it will effect your performance, which in turn will get the attention of your Chief and has the potential to effect your entire division.  You don't want to be that guy/gal.

We here can offer our past experiences and advice.  We CANNOT make the decision for you.  Research, soul search, try and figure out at least a short range (1 - 2 year) and medium range (2 - 5 year) plan that includes what you want to be doing at the end of those phases.  Do what will end up being best for YOU.

Best of luck to you, in everything!

Thanks so much, I won't be joining the nukes then, I'm looking into Air Force careers and it seems completely possible to get alot of college work done in a few careers, especially linguist.

[Fermi2]

I bet he realized he'd never meet the ELT Hot Babe standard.

[HydroDave63]

I bet he realized he'd never meet the ELT Hot Babe standard.

Oh, I'm sure you ELT(SS) types would find an Air Force guy to BE a 'Hot Babe' 

[spekkio]

I'm looking into Air Force careers and it seems completely possible to get alot of college work done in a few careers, especially linguist.

Good luck. Although even though we like to make fun of the cushy AF now and then, I'd be weary of any promises your recruiter is making that you can get significant college coursework done during your enlistment.

[Fermi2]

Good luck. Although even though we like to make fun of the cushy AF now and then, I'd be weary of any promises your recruiter is making that you can get significant college coursework done during your enlistment.

Things may have changed but my brother averaged 25 hours of golfing a week during his airforce time with 4 of those on his duty day..

[HydroDave63]

Things may have changed but my brother averaged 25 hours of golfing a week during his airforce time with 4 of those on his duty day..

One of my jobs post-Navy was as a rent-a-cop. My dayshift relief (Chair Force guy) was complaining he had just finished a 24 hour "alert". Apparently he had to eat MREs, stay comfy watching TV in his lizard suit and be available to fuel a plane if it needed it. I figured there was no point trying to convey 6 weeks of water hours for two broke flash distillers, making turns barely above steerageway in order to maintain reserve feed, port & starboard feed control watches in 120 degree engineroom, every squid reeking of crotchrot and sweat because no one could catch the 30 minute potable water window to shower and not be able to eat cold stuff from cans on paper plates.

Olangapo and Guam in hot humid spring vs. Minot and Ellsworth in the winter.... you call the play!  

[JoeSBK]

Good luck. Although even though we like to make fun of the cushy AF now and then, I'd be weary of any promises your recruiter is making that you can get significant college coursework done during your enlistment.

Thanks, and don't worry, one of my brothers is AF and he will help me with get the most logical (best?) contract agreement.

But the recruiter seems like an awesome guy, he said if I sign up for the 6 year enlistment I'll get to meet Micheal Jackson and become a nuclear air bomber in the mega-death steel regiment!

[Fermi2]

LOL!

[HydroDave63]

But the recruiter seems like an awesome guy, he said if I sign up for the 6 year enlistment I'll get to meet Micheal Jackson and become a nuclear air bomber in the mega-death steel regiment!

In other words, filthy greasy with hydraulic fluid and burnt rubber, while changing tires on a KC-135 (that was built before your parents were born) out of March ARB, in crushing summer heat listening to salsa music on 96.3 FM, right? 

[DLGN25]

Thanks so much, I won't be joining the nukes then, I'm looking into Air Force careers and it seems completely possible to get alot of college work done in a few careers, especially linguist.

What a loser, the Air Force option, like the Navy will soon learn.   I only hope he does not become a doctor...