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Fermi2

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Army Nukes
« on: Jan 03, 2014, 05:11 »
Does anyone know what the Army called their nukes?

Offline liam

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #1 on: Jan 03, 2014, 05:34 »
There was a previous discussion about Army Nukes.  Hanford Tech was an Army nuclear operator.  Read his posts.

http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,27304.25.html

DSO

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #2 on: Jan 03, 2014, 11:11 »
Speaking of Army Nukes...any truth that the Supervisor that directed the individual to manually pull the rod in the SL-1 incident was having an affair with eventually impaled individual's wife? First time I ever herad this little bit of trivia

Fermi2

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #3 on: Jan 04, 2014, 12:21 »
Yes it is true. Always was the primary theory. Heard that back in 1985.

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #4 on: Jan 04, 2014, 08:39 »
There was a previous discussion about Army Nukes.  Hanford Tech was an Army nuclear operator.  Read his posts.

http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,27304.25.html

Did you just SPOON FEED BZ....
instead of telling HIM to search??

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Offline GLW

Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #5 on: Jan 04, 2014, 08:54 »
Yes it is true. Always was the primary theory. Heard that back in 1985.

that was always one of those "Knew a guy who knew a guy who knew a guy" legends,....

then, 20+ years ago, I was mentored by the guy who knew the guy,....

to the point: the guy who trained and qualified the guy prior to the guy who did the training and qualifying being transferred to Thule,...

he was an Army nuke officer back in the day, being a Navy nuke did not hold any special cache with him, you still had to prove yourself just like anybody else he did not already know,....

he was crusty, gruff, parsimonious with the spoken word and amongst the brightest and sharpest I have ever had the privilege to work for and learn from,...

he suspected the rumours too, then again, he contended that in those days out in the "nowheresville" that was Idaho, that diversionary shenanigans and drama of that sort were all too common amongst folks stuck in the middle of the high plains desert,...

my nuke school class had a contingent that went to Idaho, the rumor was one of the guys from my nuke school section got off the bus, walked in on his wife in flagrant dilecto, and then dispatched both her and her paramour with a shotgun (circa 1981-1982),...

he was such a level headed and mature guy all through nuke school down in peninsular Florida,...

must be that high altitude air,...
« Last Edit: Jan 04, 2014, 08:55 by GLW »

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Fermi2

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #6 on: Jan 04, 2014, 12:38 »
Incorrect. This came from a guy who was on the investigation...

Offline GLW

Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #7 on: Jan 04, 2014, 09:43 »
Incorrect. This came from a guy who was on the investigation...

no, my tale is true, it is not incorrect,...

anecdotes about dangerous liaisons amongst the doomed crew were bantered about during most of my NNPP conversations concerning SL-1,....

the former Army nuke I mentored under did indeed train and qualify the doomed crew,...

I was never privy to conversations with any of the investigating personnel as I was never on a need to know basis for those particulars of what happened at SL-1 and my former mentor would never speak of such facts as facts if he knew them to be facts, only in the terms that he would not be surprised if such rumors were true and such shenanigans were too common and detrimental to good order,...

your knowledge of investigation facts may corroborate all the anecdotes I ever heard back in the day, my first person experiences during official NNPP presentations on the  SL-1 accident never detailed facts concerning adultery and miscegenation, all references to adultery and miscegenation were off the record and anecdotal during my NNPP exposure to the events,...

and any after NNPP discussions of same,....

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #8 on: Jan 04, 2014, 10:11 »
   The only person who knows for sure was pinned to the roof of the building by a control rod. The investigation attributed the accident to poor Army design. The potential for a love triangle was in the report as one of several possible contributing factors. My civilian radcon instructor at prototype was on the recovery team entering the building on one of the initial monitoring teams. The accident was presented to us by people who knew the real deal as part of our operator and ELT instruction. The accident happened ten years before I was assigned to S1W and there were a number of very knowledgeable people still at INL and NRF.

BetaAnt

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #9 on: Jan 05, 2014, 11:17 »
The love triangle story was spread to hide the design deficiency. It's hard to justify using a faulty design when you can blame it on human error or deliberate sabotage (the homicide-suicide love triangle).

The Rx was above ground in an unheated sheet metal bldg. The high temp over the week was 17F. The control rod sleeves leaked and stuck. Military Rxs use HEU (90%+). When the stuck central control rod suddenly broke free, too much reactivity was added to the cold core (cold water is denser - reflects more neutrons - and increases the core reactivity). A prompt criticality occurred, the water flashed to steam, water hammer accelerated from the core reactive zone to the top of the vessel. The vessel jumped/recoiled approx 8', central control flange sheared pinning technician to ceiling. Criticality stopped when the Rx water boiled/flashed - fuel rods were no longer in critical geometry. The two technicians on top died in the steam explosion and the control room technician died from the massive flux.
See the AEC's report on the "Analysis of the SL-1 Excursion" and additional AEC reports and diagrams.

My ELT class at A1W was fortunate enough to have one of the first responders talk to us about SL-1 and narrate the two films. The control room operator was still alive when they arrived. His RO 'Cutie Pie' had gone off scale outside the control room, they evacuated the building, and radioed for assistance. The AEC report doesn't mention sabotage, only operator error.

Offline Marlin

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #10 on: Jan 06, 2014, 01:08 »
So what were the Army nukes called?

Other than their operations titles.


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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #11 on: Jan 06, 2014, 09:49 »
They  Were  called  NBC Specialists, Nuclear  Biological  Chemical  Specialists now  they  are  CBRN,  Chemical  Biological Radiological  Nuclear  ,  All  states to  my  understanding  have  these  as  active  National  Guard  Components.  They   now  actually  have an  Officer specialty  called  Health  Physicist.  I will  post  these.

Chemical, Biological, Radiological, and Nuclear (CBRN) Specialist (74D)

Overview
Chemical, Biological, Radiological and Nuclear Specialists are primarily responsible for defending the country against the threat of CBRN weapons and Weapons of Mass Destruction.


Careers: Military

Description:

A career with the U.S. Armed Services as a health physicist may take one of two paths. First is a career as a commissioned officer in the military. The second path is as a civilian employee in the Department of Defense. As a military health physicist, your duties will be similar to those of other health physicists—you could work in a health care setting, in an industrial setting, often as a radiation safety officer, or even developing policy and regulations. There are some opportunities unique to the military, such as duty at sea on a nuclear-powered surface ship or in a nuclear submarine.

Requirements for the Following Positions in a Military Setting1:

Military Officer

Minimally a BS degree in health physics, physics, environmental science, or a related science for entry as an O-1. An MS or PhD and experience may result in entry at a higher rank and pay grade. Officers will also need to meet their service's requirements as an officer, including passing a comprehensive physical exam and periodic demonstration of physical fitness. The ability to obtain and retain a security clearance is also needed.

Military Services:
•U.S. Air Force
•U.S. Army
•U.S. Navy
•U.S. Marine Corps
•Department of Defense

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« Last Edit: Jan 06, 2014, 10:15 by thenukeman »

cedugger

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #12 on: Jan 06, 2014, 11:04 »
They  Were  called  NBC Specialists, Nuclear  Biological  Chemical  Specialists now  they  are  CBRN,  Chemical  Biological Radiological  Nuclear  ,  All  states to  my  understanding  have  these  as  active  National  Guard  Components.  They   now  actually  have an  Officer specialty  called  Health  Physicist.  I will  post  these.

Chemical, Biological, Radiological, and Nuclear (CBRN) Specialist (74D)

From my experience, the CBRN guys and Army health physics types aren't related. The CBRN types are the 74-deltas, as you mentioned, but they are far from HP techs as they are real heavy on the 'C', light on the 'B', and damn near ignore the 'RN' all together. That's why they come to us in Albuquerque so we can attempt to flip 'RN' to the top of their priority list.

The Army's HP are divided between enlisted and officer. The enlisted are the November-4's (N4) Health Physics Specialist, the actual HP techs, and are a specialized subset of the 91S MOS (Preventative Medicine Specialist). The officers are 72-alphas (72A), Nuclear Medicine Scientist.

The states' Active Guard Reserve Civil Support Teams are mostly CBRN types. They don't have a true HP, but instead a Nuclear Medicine Science Officer (NMSO) that performs some duties expected of an HP.

All that said, these aren't the Army Nukes of concern in this thread. They were asking about the actual Army nuclear operators of yesteryear. My site RSO was an Army 72A (prior enlisted 91S/N4) and was part of the Army's program before it was done away with. He mentioned being in school originally with Navy personnel, but I don't know much more than that. I'll have to hit him up tomorrow and find out what MOS and rating titles they held back then.
« Last Edit: Jan 06, 2014, 11:11 by slavutich »

Offline mars88

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Re: Army Nukes
« Reply #13 on: Jan 07, 2014, 03:50 »
Incorrect. This came from a guy who was on the investigation...
wow, just wow.

 


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