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Offline DipDog3

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Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« on: Aug 11, 2005, 02:57 »
Is it possible to negotiate salary for an AO position having no experience and only a degree?
If I did want to negotiate, how would I go about it?
Would it be a good idea or should I just take what they offered?

I kinda need to know ASAP.

You can PM me if you have any specific details.


Thanks ahead of time.

halflifer

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #1 on: Aug 11, 2005, 03:59 »
if the position is at a 'Union' plant, that is, a plant where you are required to join and be represented by a union, then you can't negotiate anything. The union has already done the negotiating.
if not, it is theoretically possible, but don't bet the farm on your success. remember, you have never actually DONE anything.....yeah, I know, you finished college....you and a million other people. and what did you DO in college? not, what did you study? what did you do. if you turn down what they offer you, they will probably just go to the next name on the list.
in order to negotiate successfully, you need to be able to show them that you are worth more to them than they are offering, and again, what track record do you have to base such a claim on?
my advice, take the offer and in a couple of yrs, when you have proven that you are the creme of the crop, you'll be able to show them why.

Offline Already Gone

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #2 on: Aug 11, 2005, 05:50 »
I absolutely agree.  You may be first in line, but if you say no, they'll just open the door and yell, "NEXT!!"  But, the picture is not so bleak.  The reason AO jobs come open is that people leave them.  They either get promoted to the Control Room, bid out to better jobs outside operations, quit, or retire.  What I'm saying is that there is zero growth in AO jobs.  The number of them is fixed or shrinking.  So, in order for an opening to have occurred, someone had to go away.  When they left they took all their training and experience with them.  When you get hired, you fill only a small part of the gap created by their departure. 
What this all means to you is that once you fill out the rest of the missing talent and experience you become valuable.  At that point, keeping you is way better than replacing you.  Unless you are taking over the job of someone who was fired, they would have rather kept him than hire you.  When they can say the same about you, you can expect a little appreciation in your pay envelope.  The time to ask for money is when you are sitting in the Op's Manager's office going over your stellar performance review.  So, give it your best shot for the next six months or so and good luck.  During this time, keep your eyes open for those openings for Shift Technical Advisor, Shift Engineer, Refuelling or Project Engineer ... etc.  If one of those opens up, you will stand out from all the other NucE graduates because you will already have a track record within the company.
But, based on my experience, they are not going to haggle with you at this point.  They are going to go down the list of all the qualified candidates until one of them says yes.  If it is enough to keep you out of bankruptcy court, and you have no better offers, take what they are paying.  Then, do your best to earn a raise.
« Last Edit: Aug 11, 2005, 06:01 by Beer Court »
"To be content with little is hard; to be content with much, impossible." - Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach

Offline hamsamich

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #3 on: Aug 11, 2005, 06:04 »
negotiating for more is always good to consider, but if you have put all your eggs in one basket, it is not the right choice.  Do you have other offers?  Do you have a special skill?  Have you researched the amount of pay you should receive?  If you are asking "should I take whatever they offer and just ask for a bit more", then the answer is no, especially if you have put all your eggs in one basket here and don't have a plan "B".  Negotiating is for people who have very good knowledge of what they should be paid, and for people who are not desperate for one particular job.  If this is not your dream job, and you could take it or leave it, then ask for more.  That is one example.  It all depends on your situation,the companies situation and how prepared you are for what MAY lie ahead next.  Don't just ask for more because it seems neat, have a good reason for doing so.  Check out T.O. for the Eagles.  He is in a special situation.  He is arguably the best WR in the NFL right now, and the Eagles know this.  So he is asking for more, he may not get it, but at least he is in some type of special position making it plausible for him to ask for more.  Not that I agree with TO, but divorcing myself from the moral issue of contract breaking, he isn't in the worst position.

Offline hamsamich

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one example
« Reply #4 on: Aug 11, 2005, 06:17 »
When I was an AO, and Brunswick was canvasing for people to go to lic. class, I asked for more because I really didn't want to go, and thougt the ROs were underpaid.  I said I would go to class if they gave me 10 extra hours of OT per week of Lic. class and a guaranteed amount of money at the end int the form of starting salary.  They laughed, of course, but my point is, I didn't have my heart set on Lic. Class and I knew exactly how much it was worth to me to do it, so I asked for more. 

Offline DipDog3

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #5 on: Aug 11, 2005, 09:26 »
This is a non-union plant.

Everyone does make good points.  I guess that I really don't have any leverage to negotiate with...

I got burned in my last job (not nuke related) by accepting a low initial offer, and even though I always had the best reviews and got the highest raises.  It was still not enough to make up the difference between me and the others that held out for more in the beginning...

Would it be okay to call them up and ask "Is this the most you can offer?"
(I am pretty sure I know what they will say, but at least I could take comfort in the fact that I asked)

« Last Edit: Aug 11, 2005, 09:29 by DipDog3 »

Fermi2

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #6 on: Aug 11, 2005, 09:38 »
It won't hurt to ask but as a manager I'll tell you this, they probably interviewed a LOT of people for your position, and between you and those they didn't offer the job there might be .5% perceived difference. Given the amount of people who interviewed no manager in his right mind will offer you anymore than they offered anyone else. They'll just hire someone else, or go one short.

Mike

Offline hamsamich

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #7 on: Aug 11, 2005, 10:21 »
yeah, I agree with KKG.  if there is no special reason to go after you, then you have no leverage.  and if you want to just give it a whirl and try to see if they will pay more, you are risking not getting the job.  they MAY pay you a little more, but they may just go with the next guy.  my buddy on the other hand, got his licsense, didn't nesc. want to go anywhere in particular, had a good name in the biz, so he was in the position to make a counteroffer.  he knew the place he was going wanted him, so he got all kinds of goodies plus a bonus and few thousand more per year to start.  but he already had a job and if he didn't get it no sweat off his back.  i think you need to be in a better position before you can counter offer. 

thenuttyneutron

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #8 on: Aug 12, 2005, 05:20 »
I have a nuke engineering degree and am starting as an AO.  So far I like it.  I like my co-workers and I am learning a lot.  One thing to remember is this.  Don't get an ivory tower attitude.  I was hired on the same day as this other nuke graduate and during the initial HR intro etc I met everyone around the table.  I asked what they would be doing etc, basically trying to get to know people I would be working with.  It seemed like that engineer had that attitude, he proudly proclaimed that he was a reactor engineer. 

Opps people will eat you for lunch if you do that.  Go in there with the attitude that you know nothing and have a lot to learn from your co-workers.  You will get a qual manuel most likely.  Read it and get familiar with what you have to learn.  When the chance comes up to observe the procedure you will be learning, jump on it.  If you have a good "I want to learn all I can from you" attitude you will be accepted by your other operators and have a good time at the job.

You will learn on your first week that us "engineering weenies", as I am affectionaly called, have so much to learn.  Eventually you will probably be shoved into an SRO class.  Remeber that will make you the boss of your former co-workers.  Earn their respect now and you will have no problems later.

JnyMac

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #9 on: Aug 12, 2005, 08:24 »
First of all all If you don't mind me asking what was the offer?  I have worked outside the Nuke Industry.  I am betting that with your salary and built-in overtime that you will probably be making making what an engineer in the real world with a PE and several years exp. would be making.

 By the way heard Palo Verde is looking to hire 12 AOs by the end of the year.  I don't know if it will be a mix of Navy Nukes and No exp.  Last time they only wanted prior operationds exp. or Navy Nuke.

Offline DipDog3

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #10 on: Aug 13, 2005, 02:39 »
First of all all If you don't mind me asking what was the offer?  I have worked outside the Nuke Industry.  I am betting that with your salary and built-in overtime that you will probably be making making what an engineer in the real world with a PE and several years exp. would be making.

 By the way heard Palo Verde is looking to hire 12 AOs by the end of the year.  I don't know if it will be a mix of Navy Nukes and No exp.  Last time they only wanted prior operationds exp. or Navy Nuke.

I PMed you.

With the overtime and everything the pay would certainly be more than I could make as a entry level engineer.

JnyMac

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Re: Negotiating Salary. Is it possible? Is it wise?
« Reply #11 on: Aug 13, 2005, 06:33 »
Sounds like a pretty good offer.  If the cost of living is dirt cheap I think I would take it.

 


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