NukeWorker Forum
Career Path => Navy Nuke => Topic started by: PapaBear765 on Jul 08, 2008, 10:33
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Was watching TV last month and came across "The China Syndrome." It was really interesting and entertaining to me with no commercial experience, as I'm sure many movies on the military are to those who haven't been in. Had a lot of actors back in their younger days, the movie was made in the late 70s. I was wondering how accurate it is? Does any of it resemble any commercial plant? Are there any other movies out there like this one with a lot of commercial nuclear power involved in the plot?
Also, this week the National Geographic Channel (I think) had a fictional show called "Aftermath"—what would happen if the human race disappeared. Of course, they had to address the nuclear disasters that would occur. The show didn't address operational plants but described how the "400 tons" of spent fuel in the "spent fuel" buildings across the country would release "more radioactivity than the bombs from WWII." It depicted the spent fuel cells submerged in huge tanks of water for them to "cool down." Any truth to it all and would the environment be at risk if the electricity supplying the buildings were to go away?
Thanks.
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The Control Room was a mock up of an actual commercial Control Room. IIRC a utility offered the producers tours and such then were not happy when the movie came out.
So far as I know no plant has an alarm system that gives the detailed sequence theirs did and I SURE wish there was an alarm that said Event complete!
My guess is the stuff in the Turbine Building could have been filmed anywhere, theres no difference between a Commercial turbine building and a dirt burner.
So far as breaking into the MCR the method they chose is not how I would do it but oh well.
There seemed to be too much room around the vibrating Coolant Pump but I haven't been in a Free Standing Air Containment, and so far as I know vibration of an RCP isn't so much a pipe issue as a pump damage issue.
If the electricity went away the water would heat up. The actual amount depends on how recent the fuel has been irradiated. The pools themselves are designed for Natural Circulation. The fuel floor would get MIGHTY Humid, usually at pool temps above 110 F the refueling floor can sweat. Eventually I suppose boiling will occur, the pool would suffer a constant level loss. If you had a way to make up the water loss from evaporation you'd end up ok.
Mike
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If the electricity went away the water would eventually evaporate and uncover the fuel and some of the fresher fuel would probably melt and release a significant amount of radioactive gas, but probably not much more than that. If it melted through the floor of the pool it would eventually mix with the metal and concrete and cool down (at least that is what the core in Chernobyl did and it was an active fissioning core.) I think the gasses would still be the biggest problem and most of them are pretty short lived, so the fuel would have to be fresh out of the core to cause a major problem except locally.
As far as the movie goes, it was a farce in many ways but the physical depiction of the plant was not too far fetched. Except that if you wanted to trip the reactor you could do it from a lot of places without having to get into the control room. Some of the instrumentation will trip the reactor if you stare at it too hard. Well, that may be a bit of an exaggeration.
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Some of the instrumentation will trip the reactor if you stare at it too hard. Well, that may be a bit of an exaggeration.
Naw I think you are right. :) Some of my required reading as a newb is all of the OE involving trips caused by people blowing by instrumentation too fast LOL. Ok maybe a little exaggeration, but not too far off. :)
Justin
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Thanks for the info everyone.
So if the control room was fairly accurate, then was the setup of personnel accurate? Was the guy in charge of Wilford Brimley the SRO and Brimley the RO?
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t115/mikeoksbigg765/Funny/Diabeetus.jpg (http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t115/mikeoksbigg765/Funny/Diabeetus.jpg)
If there's nothing like that event/alarm recorder from the movie, then is there a video or audio recording system? From threads in the past you commercial guys have talked about 100 alarms going off just for a basic scram, seems like too much to write into the logs with enough accuracy that some other form of automated recording would be warranted.
What are some other culture shockers other than the size of everything being much larger? That is, are logs hand-written or automated? Does someone in the control room have to get relieved before he can go the bathroom? Is there one guy walking around outside of the control room filling the role of the 5-6 watch standers used in the navy, or is there just about the same number of those rovers? Et cetera...
Thanks
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Thanks for the info everyone.
So if the control room was fairly accurate, then was the setup of personnel accurate? Was the guy in charge of Wilford Brimley the SRO and Brimley the RO?
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t115/mikeoksbigg765/Funny/Diabeetus.jpg (http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t115/mikeoksbigg765/Funny/Diabeetus.jpg)
If there's nothing like that event/alarm recorder from the movie, then is there a video or audio recording system? From threads in the past you commercial guys have talked about 100 alarms going off just for a basic scram, seems like too much to write into the logs with enough accuracy that some other form of automated recording would be warranted.
What are some other culture shockers other than the size of everything being much larger? That is, are logs hand-written or automated? Does someone in the control room have to get relieved before he can go the bathroom? Is there one guy walking around outside of the control room filling the role of the 5-6 watch standers used in the navy, or is there just about the same number of those rovers? Et cetera...
Thanks
I think every place is a little different. At peach, the operating crew consists of;
One shift manager
3 SROs... one dual unit CRS, one work control supervisor and one floor supervisor. On weekdays during the day, depending on work load, each unit will have a CRS.
4 ROs... one per unit, one common guy (electrical/diesel stuff mostly) and one guy driving the work.
7 NLOs... one per unit in the reactor building, one per unit in the turbine building, one outside/substation guy, one water plant guy and one rad waste guy. There are often 1-3 extra NLOs to do the work for the day. I will submit that in my opinion, each NLO replaces at least 3 navy watch standers... just based on all of the crap in each area like the turbine building.
The logs (called rounds) here are not automated, but most of them are on handheld PDAs and are performed once per day. Depending on the NLO and the location, they take anywhere from 2-5 hours. On any given day, they will have a routine inspection of a system(s) during which more detailed logs are taken. Depending on the equipment, some things may be looked at only once per week. During rounds, it is expected that they perform minor housekeeping, e.g wiping up oil. After rounds, they support work.
In the control room, yes for an RO to go to the bathroom, he has to get someone to cover him (not necessarily relieve him). But there is a bathroom in the control room behind the controls area, so he doesn't have to go far. In fact, unless they smoke, it is rare for an RO or CRS to actually leave the control room during the shift. If they are short and don't have the 4th RO to do the reliefs, they can have the common plant RO cover them for a few minutes to use the bathroom or grab their lunch out of the kitchen that is also in the control room behind the controls area. Yes, they eat at their desks in the control room. That isn't to say that food is allowed near any controls.
There is in fact an event/alarm recorder here and at Palo Verde. Sometimes they go by so fast that you might have to back it up to see what actually tripped the alarm. This is because for any given alarm, there could be a dozen things that set it off, but the actual alarm window doesn't tell you what it was. The event recorder and the plant "computer" can. There isn't any video cameras, at least not that I could see. I don't know about audio. but I doubt it.
Justin
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Yes there is an Alarm Recorder. Example my plant has hard wired alarms which go to the Alarm Windows on the operating Panels.
The inputs to these panels also go to the Event Recorders (Alarm Printer), this will print out to the millisecond when an alarm initiates and clears.
It also goes to a computer Screen which gives the same info as the Event Printer.
There is also a system called ICS (Integrated Computer System) that has the ability to monitor and trend just about anything and which you can use to get historical data. IT has it's own alarm system too.
As for logging.. what needs to be retrieved goes to the Event Printer. You only log the event, what procedures you entered and if an Alarm Window caused you to make a certain decision you log it.
There is a "First Out" alarm area too. In event of a trip this will tell you what tripped you though for all practical purposes it doesn't matter. You enter the same procedure regardless of the cause of the trip.
Mike
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So is it Dockers and polo shirts, t-shirt and jeans, or "just the TLD"?
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It depends. My old utility required us to wear light blue button down shirts with either Khaki or grey pants. Shift Managers wore Ties M-F till 1530. About a year before I left we had Polo Shirts but SMs couldn't wear them M-F on days. Jeans were NOT allowed.
So far as I know TVA has no uniform requirement though most SROs wear Shirts that have the TVA Logo on them. We can order uniforms but not all the SROs wear them. I like the Polo Shirts.
ROs have no uniform requirement.
Mike
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So is it Dockers and polo shirts, t-shirt and jeans, or "just the TLD"?
At Peach Bottom, the MCR staff wheres slacks and white company shirts, either polo or button down. The NLOs can wear jeans and T shirts but most wear cotton scrubs just like doctors. They are much more comfortable and much easier to just take off and toss into a bin if you get crapped up or more probably... gassed up.
At Palo Verde, they moved to NLO uniforms. I am not sure what kind of pants but they have grey polos now I think.
Justin
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Really, it depends on the plant.
Some plants require the operators to have a dress code at least during the dayshift. Some actually issue polos, buttondowns, or Dickies with the company logo along with cargo pants (for NLO's) or Khaki's or (the ever-popular) dickies. FPL even issues coveralls to its maintenance workers in addition to the uniforms for operators AND launder them at company expense.
Regardless of titles, Jack Lemmon and Wilford Brimley most likely BOTH had SRO licenses.
My old home plant always required at least one RO to be on the working side of the main control board.
Almost ALL commercial plants prohibit the wearing of hardhats in the Control Room unless you are doing some job that requires it. Apparently, somebody dropped one on the board once and nearly caused an incident.
And BZ could not be more wrong about the turbine hall. A "dirt-burner' comes by that name for more than one reason. A coal-fired steam electric plant will have coal dust, fly ash, bottom ash, and dirt all over the place. Sometimes, during an outage ( a major, once-in-a-lifetime outage) they will turn a firehose on the levels below the turbine and washdown most of this crap. They sweep the turbine floor - and even polish them sometimes - but the material conditions are still shabby compared to nukes. An oil-fired steamer will be cleaner, but not as neat or well-maintained as a nuke turbine building. You'll see abandoned equipment, hanging wires, demolished walls, torn insulation, heat damage, steam leaks, and tons of other stuff that they won't spend the money to fix because there is no NRC or INPO to impress. The only other type of power plant that comes close to the cleanliness and material upkeep of a nuke is a gas combustion turbine -- which would never be confused for a nuke.
The turbine building in this movie looked a lot like a cleaned-up oil fired steamer to me.
Without the technical discussion to cloud things up; the spent fuel would eventually return to the earth from whence it came. The environmental impact in the local areas would be temporary, as evidenced by the area around Chernobyl. Eventually life would adapt to the conditions in these areas and the radioactivity (while decaying) would merely be one of many environmental factors.
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I have a First Class Steam Engineers License from the state of Ohio and worked at two dirtburners. The Turbine building layouts were exactly like the plant in that movie and very much like Sequoyah. If you took the Concrete walls out of the turbine building at a BWR it'd look like that plant too. Thee are minor differences of course but that Turbine building could have been a dirt burner or a nuke plant virtually anywhere in the states.
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Do modern comercial plants still use the (for lack of better words) really old IC systems displayed in the movie
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Do modern comercial plants still use the (for lack of better words) really old IC systems displayed in the movie
What, like timing sequencers that look like the rotating drum barrels out of a self-playing piano? Or like switches that have two feet worth of contacts behind the panel such that the switch makes a big ka-chunk sound when you turn it?
Yes.
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What, like timing sequencers that look like the rotating drum barrels out of a self-playing piano? Or like switches that have two feet worth of contacts behind the panel such that the switch makes a big ka-chunk sound when you turn it?
Yes.
+1. Like I said before, you thought the navy was behind the times... come to Peach once. :)
Justin
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I have to side with BZ on the material condition of a dirtburner discussion. The only one I was in was at Crystal River (1981) where I was assigned to do a monthly (quarterly?) routine survey at one of the coal plants next door. The place was immaculate, roomy and what I saw was very shiny and well kept. Granted, I did not get into the deep dark bowels of the plant, but for what I saw I was surprised and impressed.
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Yeah, I guess the only part that I really didn't agree with was the word "anywhere". As I wrote earlier, it was probably filmed in a fossil plant. But, the vast majority of those simply could not be passed off as a nuke. They are simply too filthy and shabby. The turbine deck is usually not so bad, but even the clean ones would take millions in paint and upkeep to pass as a nuke.
A lot of that is changing now that big generation companies like Exelon and FPL are sending their nuclear managers to run the fossil units. You see a lot more upkeep, outage scheduling, procedures, and the like in fossil units than you did before. Still. most of them are just plain filthy.
Anyway, The China Syndrome was Hollywood's version of nuclear power. It was a joke to those of us who have seen a real plant, but it was a documentary in comparison to Atomic Twister.
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Anyway, The China Syndrome was Hollywood's version of nuclear power. It was a joke to those of us who have seen a real plant, but it was a documentary in comparison to Atomic Twister.
Anyone know of any other movies with commercial power in them?
What kind of important things are done manually in commercial land and which ones uses computers or are completely automated as compared to the navy? For example: estimated critical positions (manual in the navy but could easily be done with Microsoft Excel), chemistry (now completely computerized in the navy), calorimetrics, etc.
Is working for the NRC a good deal, or does it have a lot of drawbacks compared to all of the other non-NRC jobs?
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It isn't even worth comparing the two. They are not the same type of job. In fact, some of the things you cite as examples are things you may or may not ever involve yourself with. If you are an operator, you will not calculate ECP's.
At least, not in any way which resembles what you did in the Navy. A Reactor Engineer will use a special computer hookup to help him collect data during physics testing that he will use to calculate rod placement and Boron concentrations (in a PWR, where you actually dilute the reactor coolant to criticality with the rods in a predetermined position).
You will move fuel bundles once every 12 to 24 months. Sometimes the machine will be computerized and sometimes you will do it manually. Sometimes a vendor will operate it for you.
You will regenerate resin beds (ones that are bigger in volume than your whole engineroom), recycle the liquid that you discharge from the RCS, borate, deborate, discharge waste gas, .......
It is a totally different animal. And that is without considering the Boiling Water Reactors like the ones that BZ operates. (much better from a reactor control standpoint, but a pain in the butt for radiation exposure)
Some of the things will look the same. Every control panel in the world is the same shade of puke gray-blue-green as your RPCP, but that is where the similarity ends. The objective out here is to make the ratio of calendar days to EFPD equal to 1. Yeah, that's EFPD with a D. There is no fast recovery startup, no crashback drills, no 2F/2F, no spill drills, no EAB's, no reverse engine, no throttle wheels, no battleshort. Everybody who works on site is a nuke (to one degree or another). There is no Flank bell, but if there were it would be the only position on the dial other than Stop. Training and eating do not compete for the same space. You don't train on the actual control board - especially never a "casualty". That's right - you NEVER trip a nuclear reactor for practice out here on land. That is what simulators are for.
Actually, a huge portion of your training will be computerized. There are some "magic box" looking instruments in chemistry that do analyses and spit out results. (ion chromatograph, gas chromatograph, atomic absorption spectrophotometer, automatic titrators, gamma spectrometers, liquid scintillation counters, ... etc.) There are even machines that will automatically count a stack of smears (swipes) and print out the results. Radiation surveys are computerized in a lot of plants and handwritten in others - sometimes without even a map. You normally step into a booth to exit an RCA instead of using a frisker. You can survey your own notebook and flashlight out by sticking them in a thing that looks like a small refrigerator.
There are no EO's or MO's. There are non-licensed operators (the ones who work outside the control room), Reactor Operators and Senior Reactor Operators (who work inside the control room). A larger proportion of NLO's, RO's, and SRO's were Machinist Mates in the Navy than the other two rates. I'm not sure why, but I think is is because MM's go to ops, while ET's go to instrumentation or reactor engineering or to something non nuke and EM's tend to stay electricians. Naturally, it isn't right to generalize about these things.
You do not have to learn to do anyone else's job but your own unless you are their supervisor - in which case it is prohibited to know anything at all about their actual job.
Although you will be expected to maintain a professional appearance, and possibly a dress code (as discussed above) there will never be a time when having a serious discussion about work when a senior person will ask you if you shaved that morning just because you were right and he was wrong about which way to do the job.
There has never been a realistic motion picture made about nuclear power. There is a VERY good reason for this. Nuclear power is the most boring thing you can imagine. It is safe, unglamorous, as uneventful as we can make it, reliable, clean, quiet, and duller than your uncle Charlie's stories about his vacation to Mount Rushmore. Real-life nuclear power could not hold the attention of an audience for more than eight minutes. Now, if you wanted to capture the antics of the employees that have nothing to do with the reactor, that might make a good flick. We're talking about the same stuff that probably goes on in thousands of other workplaces though -- sex in elevators, affairs, divorces, financial hijinks, personality conflicts, ... the usual workplace stuff. Come to think of it, that isn't very interesting either.
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Very very well said.
Justin
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Some of the things will look the same. Every control panel in the world is the same shade of puke gray-blue-green as your RPCP, but that is where the similarity ends.
Are you kidding? I'm going to have to continue to look at that wonderful sea-foam green? Arrr!
Thanks for the info. How are casualties like fires handled? Is it similar in that the guys closest to it fight it until the fire department comes?
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Are you kidding? I'm going to have to continue to look at that wonderful sea-foam green? Arrr!
Thanks for the info. How are casualties like fires handled? Is it similar in that the guys closest to it fight it until the fire department comes?
Again... it depends on where you go. At Palo Verde they have a full fledge fire department that even responds to community fires. Here at Peach Bottom, we have a fire brigade made up of NLOs that go to fire school, just like the Navy. Difference is, they all get their own customized fire fighting gear so they aren't wearing the same disgusting sweaty FFE as 50 other guys.
Justin
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The Control Room was a mock up of an actual commercial Control Room. IIRC a utility offered the producers tours and such then were not happy when the movie came out.
The control room scenes were filmed at the Trojan simulator. PGE was told it was a pro nuclear film and they agreed to let them use the simulator. Yep, they were not happy to be misled.
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Oh, and as a final little tidbit on the Trojan simulator, the simulator flooded in '96. The visitor center building and the training building are ~ 20 feet lower than the plant site, and when the Columbia flooded, it rose to about a foot deep in the building.
After that, several Federal agencies used it for practice raiding buildings and blew a bunch of holes in it. Last I saw it before it was demolished, you could walk through the outside wall and into a severely trashed simulator.
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Fires are not very frequent in nuclear plants. Y'see, they have lots of safeguards against fire. There are sprinkler systems, roving fire watches, fire doors and barriers that you cannot hold open without a permit, fire-loading permits (you need permission to leave a wooden crate in the power block and possibly a fire watch to make sure it doesn't burst into flames), permits to have a flammable cabinet, housekeeping and maintenance inspections, a fire protection engineer on every site, added to the fact that everything is concrete and steel.
There are still some fires. Mostly electrical. Sometimes a butt can gets going good. Occasionally, someone will start a little one with a welding torch - but there will be a firewatch with an extinguisher and a radio or phone right there.
Basically, fire is not the disaster that it can be inside a closed ship. Even if you have to trip the reactor because of it, you don't have to worry about getting to the surface. You are already there. A reactor trip is not really a "casualty". Neither is a case of chlorides in a S/G, nor a chem tech spilling a sample, or a seawater leak from a half-inch pipe. These are problems, but they don't threaten life or the safety of the free world.
The stuff you train for is the "big one". You have to be ready for a LOCA, or a loss of electrical power, or a big steam leak. Yes, you will drill for fires. But you will be trained and do it in full gear. Only the fire brigade (as described above) will go anywhere near a fire. A couple of times a year, the plant does the E-Plan drill, where you pretend that the core is melted and there is a plume of radioactivity blowing at a kindergarten. The actual control room and on-duty operators will not be involved. You'll do the procedures, the event will escalate, and it will all be over by quitting time.
Occasionally, you will run the contaminated injured worker drill where you have to get the person into an actual ambulance and to an actual hospital. You will take far longer dicking around with the fact that he is contaminated than you should, and he will die of his injuries before you get him into the ambulance, but FEMA will say you are doing a wonderful job, and you'll get to pat yourselves on the back.
(The message that I'm trying to get across here is that if you see me bleeding or unconscious and NOT glowing blue get me to the #*@k!ng hospital and clean up the zoomie dust AFTER somebody saves my life PLEASE!!)
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... no battleshort...
Hate to break it to ya, BC, Duane Arnold's Emergency Operating Procedure RPS Logic Defeat Keylocks, when turned, illuminate lights labeled BATTLESHORT.
And that's not a sea story.
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Hate to break it to ya, BC, Duane Arnold's Emergency Operating Procedure RPS Logic Defeat Keylocks, when turned, illuminate lights labeled BATTLESHORT.
And that's not a sea story.
Actually, that's kinda cool.
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Also, this week the National Geographic Channel (I think) had a fictional show called "Aftermath"—what would happen if the human race disappeared. Of course, they had to address the nuclear disasters that would occur. The show didn't address operational plants but described how the "400 tons" of spent fuel in the "spent fuel" buildings across the country would release "more radioactivity than the bombs from WWII." It depicted the spent fuel cells submerged in huge tanks of water for them to "cool down." Any truth to it all and would the environment be at risk if the electricity supplying the buildings were to go away?
Hummmm.........I believe that would leave Politicians, Bankers and Lawyers! :P
BIG QUESTION, would you really care? :-\
RIP....RG!
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Would a Navy nuke feller such as myself be able to tour a commercial plant? We can tour all the Navy (decay heat) plants, and I do my best to see all our program has to offer (only missing SSN-21 class, and they are all on the West Coast now). I live right near Seabrook Station for another ten days or so, and I would really like to get a chance to check out a big kids' plant.
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Would a Navy nuke feller such as myself be able to tour a commercial plant? We can tour all the Navy (decay heat) plants, and I do my best to see all our program has to offer (only missing SSN-21 class, and they are all on the West Coast now). I live right near Seabrook Station for another ten days or so, and I would really like to get a chance to check out a big kids' plant.
Others will have to chime in, as I am not sure of any federal rules regarding it, but at my plant you can tour the simulator and stuff outside the power block. That means no real plant stuff like the turbine or reactor buildings. I think its more of a dose issue than anything.
Justin
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That probably wouldn't really give a picture of the size and scope of the plant, would it? Or do the control panels have the simplified schematics on them like RPCP desk sections?
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Interesting that this should be brought up today......
I'm scheduled to tour Seabrook tomorrow with a group of guys from MIT. I was hoping we'd get to see the plant.
Withroaj.....Seabrook has a Visitor's Center....I'll let you know if it would be worth your time to go check it out.
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Interesting that this should be brought up today......
I'm scheduled to tour Seabrook tomorrow with a group of guys from MIT. I was hoping we'd get to see the plant.
Withroaj.....Seabrook has a Visitor's Center....I'll let you know if it would be worth your time to go check it out.
Timing could not be more on my side for my question. I would really appreciate that.
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Would a Navy nuke feller such as myself be able to tour a commercial plant? We can tour all the Navy (decay heat) plants, and I do my best to see all our program has to offer (only missing SSN-21 class, and they are all on the West Coast now). I live right near Seabrook Station for another ten days or so, and I would really like to get a chance to check out a big kids' plant.
Pre 9/11 easy. Post 9/11 not so easy. Most plants no longer give tours inside the protected area (i.e. past security fence.) I am sure there are some exceptions, but very rare. Most plants have Visitor Centers. Calvert Cliffs closed theirs on 9/11 and never reopened it.
Back in the usta years, you could take your family on a tour of most of the plants. One plant I was working in the very early 80s had a tour for about 50 clerks and secretaries one night...actually took them into containment! Started with the VP's secretary wanting a tour and ballooned from there. Very interesting at the S.O.P.
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Does a security clearance mean anything around those parts? Maybe I could bring in a copy? Though now that I put it out there I think I would probably look like a big dingleberry (not that that's ever stopped me before -- see my previous posts in other topics).
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A security clearance means everything... if the utility issued it to you (or their contractor who is willing to sign the 'good guy' letter.) The letter basically say you have been under continuous observation (normal workdays, minimum) since your last clearance and there are no unaccounted for gaps of employment for >30 days. Any gaps of employment must be accounted for with a supplemental form and people that will vouch that they know you have not been attending the Yassir Arafat School of Charm during your absence from work... or making regular trips to Cali or Medellin.
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A security clearance means everything... if the utility issued it to you (or their contractor who is willing to sign the 'good guy' letter.) The letter basically say you have been under continuous observation (normal workdays, minimum) since your last clearance and there are no unaccounted for gaps of employment for >30 days. Any gaps of employment must be accounted for with a supplemental form and people that will vouch that they know you have not been attending the Yassir Arafat School of Charm during your absence from work... or making regular trips to Cali or Medellin.
Does that apply to the Navy kids who get out and go full-time college student to avoid the cardinal sin of middle class existence, and wind up returning to the industry for the decent money and steady employment (based on the assumption that Ops and Maintenance won't downsize any time soon)?
Also - do you think a Navy one might help me be a commercial nuke tourist for a day?
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To the first question, everyone needs the clearance -- some get it easier than others. Some people have 5 page questionairres (short working histories or only one job, one residence, easy to find references) some have 20 pages (more complex histories.)
To the second... no. There is a possibility that the plant will give you an escorted tour, but the navy clearance will make no difference. Unescorted access requires a specific clearance (navy will not do it) and we could take Osama Bin Laden on an escorted tour if we wanted to.
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we could take Osama Bin Laden on an escorted tour if we wanted to.
and who wouldn't want to show him the solid waste compactor? ;D
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and who wouldn't want to show him the solid waste compactor? ;D
I want to show him a spent fuel bundle up close and personal... preferably at the bottom of the spent fuel pool. (I'll stand back so he can get the full effect.)
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Why waste a perfectly good opportunity to study what the effects would be of having a person inside a Reactor Compartment at FULL power for XXX number of days. We might as well learn something while we are at it.
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A couple of year ago at SONGS, our crew was discussing the hypothesis that if a person tried to swim to the top of the fuel he would not live to get there.
I think that I'd like to test that theory with Mr. Bin Laden.
I already have the experiment designed.
The first problem is to get him to want to swim to the top of the fuel. So, you drop him in the cavity with a cable locked to his ankle that will only allow him to get within an inch of the water surface. You put the key to the lock on top of the center bundle. To save himself from drowning, OBL has to swim to get the key to free himself before his SCUBA tank runs out of air.
Will he make it?
Of course, I also rigged the test. The key that I placed on the fuel will not actually work that lock, but he won't know that until he tries to use it.
Am I evil?
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A couple of year ago at SONGS, our crew was discussing the hypothesis that if a person tried to swim to the top of the fuel he would not live to get there.
I think that I'd like to test that theory with Mr. Bin Laden.
I already have the experiment designed.
The first problem is to get him to want to swim to the top of the fuel. So, you drop him in the cavity with a cable locked to his ankle that will only allow him to get within an inch of the water surface. You put the key to the lock on top of the center bundle. To save himself from drowning, OBL has to swim to get the key to free himself before his SCUBA tank runs out of air.
Will he make it?
Of course, I also rigged the test. The key that I placed on the fuel will not actually work that lock, but he won't know that until he tries to use it.
Am I evil?
No, Troy, you would have fit in great at Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay.
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Am I evil?
Yes. The proper response is to ask his forgiveness, ask him what we can do to make his life better, give him a bunch of money and politely ask him to not attack us any more.
I may vomit.
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Yeah...because thats the way we treat those guys over there ::) >:( :-\ >:( :-\ >:(
Yea because we really tortured people in Abu Gharib. Not some pansy "waterboarding" technique, but stuff like feeding them alive to carnivorous animals, smashed their bodies with sledge hammers, electrocuted them, and stuff of that nature. OH WAIT, that wasn't us, that was the guy who ran the place before us, you know the one that we brought to justice. Heck, at least we apologized for heinous(but paltry in comparison) acts that our guards allowed and helped perform. I could be mistaken, but I am pretty sure we never heard an apology from Mr. S. Hussein.
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Yea because we really tortured people in Abu Gharib. Not some pansy "waterboarding" technique, but stuff like feeding them alive to carnivorous animals, smashed their bodies with sledge hammers, electrocuted them, and stuff of that nature. OH WAIT, that wasn't us, that was the guy who ran the place before us, you know the one that we brought to justice. Heck, at least we apologized for heinous(but paltry in comparison) acts that our guards allowed and helped perform. I could be mistaken, but I am pretty sure we never heard an apology from Mr. S. Hussein.
Ummm...my post was wrapped in sarcasm, thus the egregious overuse of emoticons.
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Back on topic - Years ago, I worked at D. C. Cook (in southwest Michigan) where they had a huge visitor's center. Apparently it is still there ( http://www.cookinfo.com/powertrip.htm ). At SONGS, within the past year I escorted in plant tours for SDG&E and SCE summer interns, and college students studying nuclear engineering. So, it's worth at least trying to contact the communications people at your local plant and ask.
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Ok....just returned from my tour of Seabrook.....Obviously my comments here are directed to us navy folk......
Withroaj......No reason to go just to check out the visitors center.....pretty much a 2nd grade view of nuclear power. Unless you can become part of a tour group that gets to see what I saw, its pretty much worthless. Even then, I really didn't see much.
Got to observe a minor LOCA in their simulator.....not an overly impressive event....but it was cool to see the "control room".
Eventually got to go to the real Control Room and walk through the turbine building. I was impressed with the level of cleanliness....oh and the turbine is about as long as a school bus....pretty cool.
Didn't get to go into the RCA.
I was also impressed with the level of security. Multiple layers of security to access the plant areas.
Overall, I wouldn't say it was a wasted day, but I wouldn't recommend it to others.
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That's more like two rows of four school buses, wouldn't you say?
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...T-Roy,,I agree with your idea about Bin Ladin, but we have to catch him first, or have I missed the news?....don't get to much international news down here in the Sandhills..see you in Reno...
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Well, I guess I'll have to wait until I grow up to check out a big kids' plant. Bummer.
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That's more like two rows of four school buses, wouldn't you say?
You got me.....
I meant to say that the generator portion was about the size of a school bus...the turbine part was much bigger.
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That's more like two rows of four school buses, wouldn't you say?
I was going to say something similar yesterday, but was trying to avoid comments about short busses.
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I was going to say something similar yesterday, but was trying to avoid comments about short busses.
sew dere's sum thing rong wit quick kisses?
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Why waste a perfectly good opportunity to study what the effects would be of having a person inside a Reactor Compartment at FULL power for XXX number of days. We might as well learn something while we are at it.
You see the Myth Busters episode where they tested the "Cockroaches will inhabit Earth after nuclear war" myth? Can't remember the specifics, but they tested roaches, ants, and something else. Exposed three groups of subjects to three different acute exposures; like 1000 rem, 10,000 rem, and 100,000 rem. The ants won.
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You see the Myth Busters episode where they tested the "Cockroaches will inhabit Earth after nuclear war" myth? Can't remember the specifics, but they tested roaches, ants, and something else. Exposed three groups of subjects to three different acute exposures; like 1000 rem, 10,000 rem, and 100,000 rem. The ants won.
I saw that one. I just want to know how I can get their job. :)
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I saw that one. I just want to know how I can get their job. :)
Every time I watch that show (I got to see a little bit yesterday) I want their jobs. By far and away the coolest on the planet.
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A couple of year ago at SONGS, our crew was discussing the hypothesis that if a person tried to swim to the top of the fuel he would not live to get there.
I think that I'd like to test that theory with Mr. Bin Laden.
I already have the experiment designed.
The first problem is to get him to want to swim to the top of the fuel. So, you drop him in the cavity with a cable locked to his ankle that will only allow him to get within an inch of the water surface. You put the key to the lock on top of the center bundle. To save himself from drowning, OBL has to swim to get the key to free himself before his SCUBA tank runs out of air.
Will he make it?
Of course, I also rigged the test. The key that I placed on the fuel will not actually work that lock, but he won't know that until he tries to use it.
Am I evil?
Osama is completely prepared for death, and that would make him a martyr to his mentally defective peers. So we shouldn't kill him.
(He may very well end up dead about the second week of October 2008 - if my political sensibilities serve me correctly...)
Instead, he needs to be sentenced to life in prison. Bubba and the boys need someone like Osama to keep them company on those long lonely nights.
Osama is NOT prepared for that...
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Osama is completely prepared for death, and that would make him a martyr to his mentally defective peers. So we shouldn't kill him.
(He may very well end up dead about the second week of October 2008 - if my political sensibilities serve me correctly...)
Instead, he needs to be sentenced to life in prison. Bubba and the boys need someone like Osama to keep them company on those long lonely nights.
Osama is NOT prepared for that...
The NOI guys in the can would guard him better than the Taliban. If anything he'd be the rock star of that facility, plus as long as you held him live he'd be the martyr-hero of the Queda sympathizers....same reason we didn't whisk Saddam off to Club Fed next to Noriega.
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A commercial urban legend brought up around the camp fire last night: it's been written into federal regulations that the SRO and the ROs may not do anything other than stand watch, i.e. clean while on watch.
Not that cleaning on watch bothers me, just curious.
Also, last year at a CMC call, he wrote on the white board some figures like an initial hiring salary, a hire-on bonus, etc. All really high numbers, meant to impress us. Said that they were for some place up north like Minnesota, that the numbers were so high because it's hard for the companies there to get people to move there. Is it true that geographical location is a big factor in pay? Are some places really coveted like California?
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Is a nuclear engineering degree worth getting? Is it too theoretical in the design realm and not enough relatable knowledge to operations? Do most guys who enter in with a nuclear engineering technology degree, like from Thomas Edison, stop there with their college learning and spend their time learning the specifics of how their plant works?
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Papa Bear, ROs, particularly the one "At The Controls", should watch their panels.
SROs are required to maintain oversight, and monitor (but please don't operate) panels.
The Navy equivalent of Maneuvering or Enclosed Operating Space is a good analogy.
Access is controlled, conversations limited in duration or limited to subjects associated with plant ops. Formality is required.
However, federal regulations don't prescribe specific control room decorum.
The NRC will take legal enforcement actions against licensed operators determined to be negligent. If a control room standards are lowered low enough, long enough - that will likely happen.
The NRC is a regulatory body, not an advisor.
I always taught panel monitoring in the simulator by periodically placing the simulator in freeze
and handing out a form for the crew to fill in Power, Level, Pressure, Temperature, Dead Buses, Actuated ECCS, Actuated Auto Isolations - without looking at the panels.
After filling out 30 or 40 sets of those forms, most trainees would rattle the parameters off to you when they saw the simulator placed in freeze.
Voila - awareness. Check off all those "Monitor" Knowledges, Skills and Abilities.
We have ways of making you watch a panel. ;D
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What were the figures that the CMC had written up? As a native Minnesotan (and one who plans on going back there), I follow average wages for our job field closely.
Makes me wonder, what was the point of the CMC doing this. Most all the khaki were trying to retain us and scare us with having to pay medical insurance, getting little or no paid time off, and guaranteed retirement. That's all pretty much bogus anyways and just retention figures that make the Navy look good.
I have some really recent data on power plants up in MN if you are interested PM me.
Jason
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Most all the khaki were trying to retain us and scare us with having to pay medical insurance, getting little or no paid time off, and guaranteed retirement.
What scares me most is just how many suckers fall for this. I call it "panic re-enlisting."
Justin
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What scares me most is just how many suckers fall for this. I call it "panic re-enlisting."
Justin
Panic re-enlisting is kinda correct. I would call it fear of the outside world. Many of us in the Navy have only known two things life with mom and/or dad and the Navy. I myself came in one month out of high school and for the last ten years the only thing I have known is the Navy. For right now I am putting aside thoes fears of health insurance, pay cut (I gross over 70k), and employment in a falling economy. In the end I had to place more value my family than my fears of the unknown.
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A commercial urban legend brought up around the camp fire last night: it's been written into federal regulations that the SRO and the ROs may not do anything other than stand watch, i.e. clean while on watch.
Not that cleaning on watch bothers me, just curious.
Also, last year at a CMC call, he wrote on the white board some figures like an initial hiring salary, a hire-on bonus, etc. All really high numbers, meant to impress us. Said that they were for some place up north like Minnesota, that the numbers were so high because it's hard for the companies there to get people to move there. Is it true that geographical location is a big factor in pay? Are some places really coveted like California?
No, there are restrictions on how many people must be within certain areas of a commercial control room. For instance, we're a dual unit site with a common control room, normally staffed by 2 SRO's and 4 RO's. At least one RO must be within the "controls area" for their unit at all times, and one SRO must be in there. There is no rule against cleaning, but we do expect the "operator at the controls" to avoid anything that distracts him from monitoring the plant. As for the pay issue, we're comparable to other sites and we are in Minnesota. The biggest factor in pay is cost of living in the area, right now Turkey Point (south of Miami) seems to pay the most... because they have to. Something about $500k small houses with $900/month insurance payments or something. These days many sites are focusing on hiring and training locals because too many nomads get up and leave after you've invested money training them. Decide where you want to live and the pay will likely allow you a similar standard of living.
True story- I had an RO try to clean up some residual adhesive gum on the control board from labels that had been removed. He ends up getting a friction burn on his thumb, I have to fill out an injury report, tell the Ops Mgr and Plant Manager, do a prompt investigation... I decided the rest of the gum could just stay there :P
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Is a nuclear engineering degree worth getting? Is it too theoretical in the design realm and not enough relatable knowledge to operations? Do most guys who enter in with a nuclear engineering technology degree, like from Thomas Edison, stop there with their college learning and spend their time learning the specifics of how their plant works?
There aren't many nuclear engineering degreed people working outside the nuclear engineering department. It will not give you an edge elsewhere, like Operations. The rule of thumb is that your undergrad degree shows you can run a calculator and learn stuff. The stuff you learn in license class is what will really help you get ahead.
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There aren't many nuclear engineering degreed people working outside the nuclear engineering department. It will not give you an edge elsewhere, like Operations. The rule of thumb is that your undergrad degree shows you can run a calculator and learn stuff. The stuff you learn in license class is what will really help you get ahead.
+1. Like I said earlier, my shift manager who was just promoted to ops superintendent has the Thomas Edison degree.
Justin
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Speaking a someone with a nuclear engineering degree, you can find NEs all over the place (utilities, vendors, AEs, aerospace, etc) and all over the plant - it's really up to the person. The thing to remember is the vast majority of an engineering education is generic to many of the specialties (nuclear in particular has a lot of overlap with mechanical, chemical, and petroleum engineering).
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For right now I am putting aside thoes fears of...pay cut (I gross over 70k)...
Jump! You not only will likely not take a pay cut, but before long that "over 70K" will be a distant memory. ;)
http://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,14867.0.html
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What were the figures that the CMC had written up? As a native Minnesotan (and one who plans on going back there), I follow average wages for our job field closely.
Makes me wonder, what was the point of the CMC doing this. Most all the khaki were trying to retain us and scare us with having to pay medical insurance, getting little or no paid time off, and guaranteed retirement. That's all pretty much bogus anyways and just retention figures that make the Navy look good.
I have some really recent data on power plants up in MN if you are interested PM me.
Jason
Sorry, can't remember anything accurate enough to post. But they were really impressive. His point was to show us how great a commercial job pays, "so don't screw up while in the navy or else you might not get this great job." At the time I knew essentially zero and took him for being genuine, now I know better.
Anyone see the news on granite countertops being radioactive? They had a Geiger counter, but I couldn't tell what it was reading. The radiac sounded like the granite was at all ahead flank, though.
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Sorry, can't remember anything accurate enough to post. But they were really impressive. His point was to show us how great a commercial job pays, "so don't screw up while in the navy or else you might not get this great job." At the time I knew essentially zero and took him for being genuine, now I know better.
Anyone see the news on granite countertops being radioactive? They had a Geiger counter, but I couldn't tell what it was reading. The radiac sounded like the granite was at all ahead flank, though.
I thought that was common knowledge. The radon in my basement with the radon abatement system secured would set off your APD.
Justin
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I thought that was common knowledge. The radon in my basement with the radon abatement system secured would set off your APD.
Justin
I don't own an APD. Diggit.
Just for everyone who didn't see that Myth Busters the test subjects were cock roaches, beetles, and fruit flies. The exposures were 1000 Rad, 10,000 Rad, and 100,000 Rad for 3 minutes. The fruit flies won. They believe it's a function of the complexity of the cellular structure. That is, humans are more susceptible than roaches who are more susceptible than flies.
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I don't own an APD. Diggit.
Just for everyone who didn't see that Myth Busters the test subjects were cock roaches, beetles, and fruit flies. The exposures were 1000 Rad, 10,000 Rad, and 100,000 Rad for 3 minutes. The fruit flies won. They believe it's a function of the complexity of the cellular structure. That is, humans are more susceptible than roaches who are more susceptible than flies.
;D
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Do you guys say "aye"?
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Do you guys say "aye"?
When acknowledging communication you're more likely to hear "That's correct" or "I Understand you want me to......" followed by an affirmation or correction if the repeat back was incorrect. You're more likely to hear Arrrggghhh than Aye at a commercial plant.
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When acknowledging communication you're more likely to hear "That's correct" or "I Understand you want me to......" followed by an affirmation or correction if the repeat back was incorrect. You're more likely to hear Arrrggghhh than Aye at a commercial plant.
That's correct. 8)
Justin
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Do you guys say "aye"?
We say aaaaight, which kinda rhymes with aye, but is actually a kinda ghetto slang for alright.
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The drill I observed in the trainer at Seabrook was filled with what I would consider lack of formal communications. Only once did I hear a verbatim repeat back. I don't know if it was because it was a show for us MIT students or if that is how they do business all the time. I got the feeling that all the players knew what they were doing, but it was certainly different then what I expected.
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The drill I observed in the trainer at Seabrook was filled with what I would consider lack of formal communications. Only once did I hear a verbatim repeat back. I don't know if it was because it was a show for us MIT students or if that is how they do business all the time. I got the feeling that all the players knew what they were doing, but it was certainly different then what I expected.
So it's not the make-believe of the navy in which the EOOW says "secure port vital bus" and the EO wants to say "aye" or "got it" but can't because Rickover thinks that could...under the right circumstances...cause confusion and the EO secures the wrong bus?
I can't wait to start.
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The drill I observed in the trainer at Seabrook was filled with what I would consider lack of formal communications. Only once did I hear a verbatim repeat back. I don't know if it was because it was a show for us MIT students or if that is how they do business all the time. I got the feeling that all the players knew what they were doing, but it was certainly different then what I expected.
I understand exactly where you are coming from. When I first saw the "3 part communication," I thought "geez that is real informal." Nothing has to be verbatim repeated back. It can be paraphrased for understanding, and sometimes things just don't need to be said back. So ya, for Navy people, it is part of the culture shock at first. Now I realize just how silly verbatim repeat backs and the submarine interior communication manual were, while at the same time being a necessary animal in the NNPP... or like Mike likes to say... the Big Leagues vs Minor Leagues. :P
Justin
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So it's not the make-believe of the navy in which the EOOW says "secure port vital bus" and the EO wants to say "aye" or "got it" but can't because Rickover thinks that could...under the right circumstances...cause confusion and the EO secures the wrong bus?
I can't wait to start.
That's correct. :)
Another thing to keep in mind too, is that we speak in acronyms out here. If you try to give the noun name to something, people might look at you funny and they will almost definitely give you crap about it. There are instances of people not actually remembering anymore, what an acronym means LOL. No more EOs telling you "its spoken EVAPORATOR" when you call up and say "the 10K is filling potable." ;D
Justin
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Very condescending comment. We, the navy, provide the blanket of freedom under which you and every other American citizen sleeps. We, the navy, are the most powerful seagoing service in the world....yet you refer to us as "minor league."
You, the commercial nuclear industry, provide electricity to 20% of the country. Your the "big leagues" alright. ::) ::) ::)
Wasn't meant to be condescending... hence the reference to Mike and the tongue sticking out smiley (no one calls the Navy minor league by the way... just the NNPP). Was supposed to be a harmless jab. Take it as you will though, I couldn't care less.
Justin
I did notice you left off the smiley in your quote. You could also at least cite your source when you make grandiose statements like "blanket of freedom."
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The whole 'big league/minor league' issue isn't a matter of importance of job... just the size of the reactors. Commercial power plants are big league because of the output. Navy nuclear reactors are toys by comparison. You, too, would be impressed by the magnitude.
Don't get your knickers in a twist. And thank you for your service.
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Very condescending comment. We, the navy, provide the blanket of freedom under which you and every other American citizen sleeps. We, the navy, are the most powerful seagoing service in the world....yet you refer to us as "minor league."
You, the commercial nuclear industry, provide electricity to 20% of the country. Your the "big leagues" alright. ::) ::) ::)
Good movie is "Office Space". One part in particular is where a guy tells of his one good idea that he is sure will make millions, like the pet rock. It was called the "Jump to Conclusions Mat", where contestants move to different spots on a mat and Jump to Conclusions.
Gamecock, your response was lame. I just hope you forgot to add the smiley or you were actually poking fun at "A Few Good Men". Somehow, I doubt it. :(
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Hey, thanks for the blanket of freedom.
I served during the cold war, and we only made handkerchiefs of freedom. ;)
Anyway, I appreciate you.
Now quick - use your GI Bill before they divert the funds to assist the disadvantaged, unemployed, illegally immigrated, encarcerated, and addicted.
Being in nuclear power, you are way too fortunate.
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We, the navy, provide the blanket of freedom
Patrol blanket? ;)
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Patrol blanket? ;)
You mean patrol sock?
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As long as a guy was wearing the appropriate clothing, as talked about before, would anyone care if he had tattoos covering his arms? Besides the obvious things like a "F--- YOU" on the forehead, is there anything that would keep someone from getting hired or be frowned upon later after they're hired?
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The only thing I've seen is one co-worker has been told to cover his confederate battle flag tattoo. This was after a visiting worker complained about it a couple of years ago. Tattoos shouldn't be an issue. We've got a supervisor with a tattoo covering his whole arm and it's not an issue.
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What would be a good, short list of "commercial facts" that would be useful for a navy nuke who's on the fence that's some no BS info about the outside world?
That is:
1. A job in Operations pays well, much better than navy pay. The first one or two years will be low but it soon ramps up quickly. A bulk of that high pay includes overtime, but the only people who don't get overtime are those who deliberately don't request it. What is a guarantee is if you do 6 and out and start at AO somewhere, you will make at least two times what you made in the Navy after the first year. An SRO often comes in under an RO or an AO for money for the year. You might be talking base pay, but when they get paid double-time to work on a Sunday or holiday and the SRO doesn't, it adds up fast. Most AOs I know have paid off FICA for the year this month.
2. Working hours: rotating shift work or regular hours? Need input...
3. Learning the plant will be more challenging than navy nuke systems due to complexity and quantity of the systems, but not impossible. Your navy nuke experience at qualifying will be a big help in transitioning to commercial ways of business.
4. There's nothing that would automatically turn someone away not to get hired. Like: non-EWS, not a chief, non-EOOW, only did 6 years, etc. Some of these things might affect one's starting salary, but they're not disqualifiers.
5. A degree in engineering (electrical, mechanical, nuclear) is no better or worse to a position in Operations than a Nuclear Engineering Technology degree. Someday you will tire of shift work and OT. Someday you may even tire of working at a commercial generating station and the BS it can involve. When that time comes, companies like AREVA, GE, and Westinghouse have very high paying jobs in very cushy corporate buildings with very normal working schedules. Coupling an accredited degree with licensed commercial Ops experience will put you at the front of the line for those positions.
Anything else? I'd just like to be able to give a dozen or so data points to guys when we're talking about getting out vs. staying in.
Thank you.
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You hit it pretty well except I'd make a couple corrections. In Number 1 the pay is never low as you'll still make more money than you did in the Navy.
In number 5, I don't believe anyone said a degree of any type wasn't appealing, of course a degree is appealing. The point is a degree of any type isn't a deciding factor.
Mike
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Without actually finding the post (smite me), but I think it's in the "Do you regret getting out" thread, someone said that their first year or two was about the same or a little under what they were making in the navy, so that why I threw it in there.
I've read it a couple times by commercial guys that the actual engineering degree isn't as useful as the technology if you're going into Operations. But if it's better not to make that remark...
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18 years as a commercial nuke and I've yet to see anyone who didn't make more their first year out of the Navy especially if you go into Operations.
There is no degree that helps anymore than any other in Ops. A degree in advanced Shia Tsu is just as useful as an Engineering degree.
On the other hand any education is nice.
Mike
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There is no degree that helps anymore than any other in Ops. A degree in advanced Shia Tsu is just as useful as an Engineering degree.
Though I do agree that a degree is not necessary for - nor does it make - a person excel in Operations, nonetheless I do believe it can be very useful for the fact that it qualifies an operator to be a Shift Technical Advisor. Plants short on the STA position can make priority of operators wanting to license and that have the engineering degree.
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How common is it for people to change employers—go to different plants, that is? Just a couple people or is it the norm?
Are people with shipyard STE training desirable hires? I presume their experience is as translatable to commercial operations as a standard navy nuke's.
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How common is it for people to change employers—go to different plants, that is? Just a couple people or is it the norm?
Are people with shipyard STE training desirable hires? I presume their experience is as translatable to commercial operations as a standard navy nuke's.
In short. No.
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Panic re-enlisting is kinda correct. I would call it fear of the outside world. Many of us in the Navy have only known two things life with mom and/or dad and the Navy. I myself came in one month out of high school and for the last ten years the only thing I have known is the Navy. For right now I am putting aside thoes fears of health insurance, pay cut (I gross over 70k), and employment in a falling economy. In the end I had to place more value my family than my fears of the unknown.
Without asking for all of the pros and cons of staying in or getting out, would the current economic situation still make it "panic re-enlisting" for a guy to re-up now?
How is the nuclear industry fairing in this "financial meltdown"? Are any companies slowing down how many new people they hire? Any companies laying people off?
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How is the nuclear industry fairing in this "financial meltdown"? Are any companies slowing down how many new people they hire? Any companies laying people off?
It varies depending on the specific utility (and usually plant specific) circumstances. For example, if you (as a utility) are paying close to $1 Billion to cleanup a little "oopsie" at one of your dirt-burners, you may not be quite as aggressive as you would have liked.
A few people are working a little longer than they had planned a couple of years ago, but companies still have to be ready to replace them. Since the huge bailout and stimulus haven't targeted nuclear, there isn't a big increase from previous estimates in hiring.
I would say the biggest downside of current nuclear power hiring (from a Navy Nuke considering getting out) is that so many from other industries are considering moving to the relatively stable job market of nuclear power. But there are a lot of jobs out here.
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How is the nuclear industry fairing in this "financial meltdown"? Are any companies slowing down how many new people they hire? Any companies laying people off?
Entergy has put their plans to split into seperate entities on hold...waiting for the economy to settle out...
That hasn't seemed to translate to anything different on hiring...they are still filling positions as they come open...
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Without asking for all of the pros and cons of staying in or getting out, would the current economic situation still make it "panic re-enlisting" for a guy to re-up now?
How is the nuclear industry fairing in this "financial meltdown"? Are any companies slowing down how many new people they hire? Any companies laying people off?
I heard that Exelon laid off 500 people. And we (Entergy) just imposed a hiring freeze...even though there are about 650 open positions in the fleet.
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I heard that Exelon laid off 500 people. And we (Entergy) just imposed a hiring freeze...even though there are about 650 open positions in the fleet.
Yes but our layoffs were nothing to due with the generation or delivery side of the house. The exelon layoffs involved things like HR and other similar departments. Many of them involved merging redundant positions in an effort to better streamline the business, and all made economical sense. We are still hiring.
Justin
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...If you are an operator, you will not calculate ECP's...
Not true.