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Author Topic: How would you fix the NNPP  (Read 438315 times)

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dad

  • Guest
Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #775 on: May 16, 2013, 04:55 »
The quoted portion from your post is not factual.

Cheers,

GC

Good to hear.  I certainly would not want it to be true.

But then again, a lot of things are going on in this country which I wish were not true.


« Last Edit: May 16, 2013, 05:07 by NF Dad »

HeavyD

  • Guest
Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #776 on: May 16, 2013, 08:05 »
From 20 years of experience in the Navy nuke field, what normally happens is a twisting of things to fit one's own need or justify one's own view.

Individuals or small groups within the organization are unhappy about something (literally anything).  They see one scenario play out and then start talking "This is what everyone is doing.".  This morphs into what is known as confirmation bias.

Confirmation bias is a cognitive science term that describes a human tendency to search for, remember or interpret information in such a way that it confirms one's own preconceptions.  An example of this is the "everybody thinks X" idea.  This is what your son was experiencing from some of the staff at prototype.

I can say that things within the program did indeed change during my 20 years.  ADM Skip Bowman was at the head of some of those changes.  One of his initiatives was to lower attrition.  Some would say we lowered our standards; I would not agree with that assessment.  What we did do was work in other opportunities for those that struggled to show that they could, indeed, do the job.  I know several very successful nukes who struggled with classroom work and would have failed out under the old structure.  However, because they were afforded a second chance, they were able to push through (usually with around a 2.6 GPA) and ended up being very good operators in the fleet.

Just some food for thought.  Also, congratulations to your son and to you!  As a father, you should be proud of his making it through the pipeline.  Best of luck to both of you in the future.

Offline MMM

Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #777 on: May 16, 2013, 09:47 »
GC is correct. We (as instructors) don't lower our standards right at the end. If a student is still around by then it's because they have shown the desire to succeed and that they generally have the ability. By about week 21, most of their classmates have qualified, so we are able to focus a little more on them and get them ready to qualify. Some instructors might be a little more liberal with the grading criteria around week 22/23, but typically they are like that all the time.

Also if a student is still around by week 22, I don't usually have enough to justify disenrolling them (I try to do that by week 17).

drayer54

  • Guest
Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #778 on: May 16, 2013, 11:44 »
I know they old saying "A B#*%ing sailor is a happy sailor" but I just wanted to get some input from both new and old glow-worms on what you would do to "fix" what we perceive to be wrong with the Navy Nuke program, and not just the broad brush stroke of "raise the standards of recruitment" or "do away with NRRO", I mean real specific answers.  I am sure that there is a lot that we would agree on and even some that we wouldn't.  Who knows maybe someone with some power will read this and see what they can do to put it into play. 

For 5 years old men have cried about decreasing standards and lower output quality of the NNPP. It's probably an older trend than 08. Meanwhile, the watch has been safely been turned over as carriers and submarines sail safely on longer and longer deployments with rough sea - shore rotations. 8 month deployments have become normal topside. I hated our 8 month deployment, but these guys do it regularly now.

Still doesnt need fixing IMHO.

Offline spekkio

Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #779 on: May 17, 2013, 01:47 »
Good to hear.  I certainly would not want it to be true.

But then again, a lot of things are going on in this country which I wish were not true.
When I was at prototype, it was under-staffed and backlogged. There are only so many watches the plant can support; only so many checkouts to go around. This made the beginning of being in-crew extremely frustrating. Show up early, get on the top of the check-out list. Then get kicked out immediately because we were not a certain class. "You're not the priority" we would be told. Being knowledge complete except end of cards (which were off-limits until a couple weeks before graduating), coming to work for weeks knowing that you're going to sit in a cubicle for 12 hours and cannot possibly make progress toward graduating was really annoying. Instead of finishing a month early and having August in Saratoga practically off, I graduated two months late thanks to backlogs.

Then one day it was "our turn." The skies opened up and we were put on the watchbill. Staff gave us checkouts over junior classes. And we graduated. Well, most of us...we had some FEW and board failures. It wasn't because they lowered the standard; it was because after months of studying for 12 hours a day in a cubicle and finally an opportunity to get watchstanding experience, we had the knowledge required to graduate.

What your son perceives as 'relaxing the standards' is actually his class reaping the benefits of their knowledge coming together after a year in nuclear power training and a staff that was making them the priority for checkouts and watches. It's the moment he realized that he was being expected to do what thousands upon thousands of Sailors before him did, and that it doesn't take a genious to pass the program, but just someone who knows 62.5% of the material.

The 6 month prototype training schedule planned for various phases of plant operation. Through various other factors it may have become backlogged (in my case, a training hold), and in those cases the students will be held as long as they need to graduate.

Wash, rinse, repeat.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2013, 01:49 by spekkio »

Offline GLW

Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #780 on: May 18, 2018, 02:35 »
When I was at prototype, it was under-staffed and backlogged......


well, five years without a post,....


which can only mean,....


it's fixed,....


mission accomplished,...


anchors aweigh!!!!!!!



been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

TVA

  • Guest
Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #781 on: May 19, 2018, 11:29 »
What is there to fix?

Offline GLW

Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #782 on: May 19, 2018, 07:15 »
What is there to fix?

fair question,....

for five years and ten days, 779 posts, and over 378,000 views,....

somebody, thought something needed fixing,.....

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

Offline spekkio

Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #783 on: May 27, 2018, 03:56 »
10 years in the Navy and being a student at prototype was hands down my worst tour ever.  I swear if I had one bullet and a free pass to shoot anyone it would be that a**hole E-5 who screamed "no talking in the training area" every 15 minutes at someone whispering 2 cubicle rows away that I couldn't even hear.

Anyway, I wouldn't say it's "fixed." It does what it does. The senior/master chiefs are pissed off that it doesn't filter enough rocks, the submarine force is frustrated that all the JOs are hitting the fleet as O-2's and separating before shore duty thanks to delays in the pipeline. But hey, it's all perfect I suppose.

Modified for language
« Last Edit: May 28, 2018, 10:13 by Nuclear NASCAR »

Offline GLW

Re: How would you fix the NNPP
« Reply #784 on: May 28, 2018, 11:38 »
10 years in the Navy and being a student at prototype was hands down my worst tour ever........

sorry to hear that,...

I really liked prototype,....

so much so that 37 years later (WOW, when did THAT happen?!?!?!?!):

I'm still living right around the corner from the place,...

and the spooky part is,...

37 years before I was stationed at the NPTU there was no NPTU,...

dam, Trinity had yet to occur,...

and yet, the NNPP is still here and still sustaining the engine rooms with adequate (or better) personnel,...

been there, dun that,... the doormat to hell does not read "welcome", the doormat to hell reads "it's just business"

 


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