Too good to be true?

[withroaj]

A friend of mine checks out on terminal in 12 days.  The command (and Navy) just offered him three years at PMT in Pearl if he elects to reenlist.  This will waive his first term sea duty requirement, and send him to shore duty with about 4 years on board.  Is this too good to be true?  Also, if any of you fellers have worked at PMT Pearl Harbor, how was it?

[Roll Tide]

Pearl is beautiful. But it is wickedly expensive.

[withroaj]

Yeah, we were stationed there, so the dude already knows the places to go and people to do.  Also got some pals out there.  The issue here is:  should he trust this deal?

[93-383]

If he wants to do it. Have him negotiate the orders with the detailer under the provision that once orders are in hand he will re-up. Detailers can cut orders that your current EAOS cannot fill the caviout with thoes orders is to accept them you mus OPLISERV prior to detachment of your current command either by extention or re-enlistment.

He should NOT TRUST the command to do this for him, when it comes to re-enlistment and orders (or for that matter any thing to do with your career), you must take charge of you own career to make sure its done right. This isn't to say that he shouldn't ask for the commands help or more importantly someone in the COC that knows the detailer and can make things happen.

[withroaj]

I will pass the word. True heroes, all of you.

[withroaj]

By the way, they're only asking him to re-up for three years, the length of shore duty, without obligated service on a ship after shore duty.  The guy's awesome at what he does, and the command appreciates that from him, but would they really just hook him up with a sweet deal for being good at his job?

[Gamecock]

I took this from the submarine officer community status brief.....

"Attracting our most talented nuclear operators to NPTU instructor duty is essential to maintaining nuclear fleet readiness.  Instructor duty is the most important shore duty in the Naval Nuclear Propulsion Program (NNPP) and requires our best efforts in attracting and sending the right caliber of Sailor to these positions.  The significance of these billets is recognized by the Navy in the level of Special Duty Assignment Pay for prototype instructor personnel, and in Chief Petty Officer selection board precepts that specifically recognize instructor duty as valued in our Chief Petty Officer selectees."

I think if your friend was such a hot shot...he'd be getting a deal for NPTU....not PMT.
Could be on the up and up...but smells fishy to me.

[withroaj]

Touche'.  I won't pass that on to him (could be a heart breaker), but I will keep that in mind when it comes time for ME to negotiate for shore duty.  To be honest, I think the guy didn't have any solid plans for getting out and said 'Pearl or Bust' when he was facing down life after the Navy.  I also think PMT might be alright for someone who missed the bus when it came to preparing to get out; not for someone trying to get their ducks in a row for a potential Navy career.  With your experience you have to have seen guys 'accidentally' make a career out of the Navy.  Hell, some of the best leadership I've had came in with the 'Six and out' mentality and stuck around when that 'growing up' priority shift hit them.

I like to use the South Park 'Underpants Gnomes' as an analogy for the anti-retention community.

Phase One:  Steal Underpants (replace "steal underpants" with "Get out of the Navy")

Phase Three:  Profit

What's Phase Two? -->  Phase Two?  We haven't gotten around to that.

[Preciousblue1965]

I took this from the submarine officer community status brief.....

"Attracting our most talented nuclear operators to NPTU instructor duty is essential to maintaining nuclear fleet readiness.  Instructor duty is the most important shore duty in the Naval Nuclear Propulsion Program (NNPP) and requires our best efforts in attracting and sending the right caliber of Sailor to these positions.  The significance of these billets is recognized by the Navy in the level of Special Duty Assignment Pay for prototype instructor personnel, and in Chief Petty Officer selection board precepts that specifically recognize instructor duty as valued in our Chief Petty Officer selectees."

Only one word needs to be used to sum up the above quote.

Propaganda

Right now Prototype is so hard up for people to go there that at one time(don't know if it is still true) they are offering guys at NNPTC to do a follow on shore duty if they go to prototype.  They are offering waivers out the wazzu just to get guys to go there.  If the CPO selection board was really that hard up on Prototype, they would just about make it a requirement to go there.  As it is, going to prototype as a sea returnee can as much of a career builder as it can be a career breaker.  All depends on timing.  If you get there at the wrong time, it could be 2 years before they put you into EWS quals just because you had to wait in line behind all the other E6s that were there before you that are waiting to go into quals, let alone have enough time to qualify EOOW(which is just about a requirement to make CPO at Prototype).  Get there at the right time and you could easily jump from SIR to EWS to EOOW in under 2 years. 

[Gamecock]

If you get there at the wrong time, it could be 2 years before they put you into EWS quals just because you had to wait in line behind all the other E6s that were there before you that are waiting to go into quals, let alone have enough time to qualify EOOW(which is just about a requirement to make CPO at Prototype).  Get there at the right time and you could easily jump from SIR to EWS to EOOW in under 2 years. 

This is one of the most ignorant statements I've read in a while....

So, you're telling me that you need to be EOOW qualified to make chief at NPTU.  BS I say.

[Preciousblue1965]

This is one of the most ignorant statements I've read in a while....

So, you're telling me that you need to be EOOW qualified to make chief at NPTU.  BS I say.

I am saying that based on my observations when I was there.  I would venture that out of the 3 years I was there 2003-2006, 70%(my estimate) of the Sailors that were selected to CPO were indeed qualified EOOW.  Those that were not, were qualified EWS in the fleet and were in their first full year at prototype.  When the majority the majority of people at prototype are CPO eligible First classes, it is really tough to stand out enough to get the MP let alone the EP.  About the only way to do it was to Qualify EOOW or work for one of the support barges to which you were only being compared to others in that area.  Yes I saw a few people that were selected that weren't EOOW qual'd, but I saw A LOT more that were.  I am sure that there are a few other people that will back me up on this one. 

[JustinHEMI05]

This is one of the most ignorant statements I've read in a while....

So, you're telling me that you need to be EOOW qualified to make chief at NPTU.  BS I say.

Ya I agree with you. Being qualified EOOW/EDO didn't get me MMC first time up as sub MMs at the time were making MMC at the 10-12 year point. Second time up, probably would have but by that time I was ROAD so I didn't even crack the booklet. I saw many many non-sub EMs make EMC without even EWS. Same for surface ETs. Seemed sub guys needed EWS at least. EOOW didn't mean crapola. What was more depressing is that it didn't mean crapola to the commercial world. 

Justin

[Preciousblue1965]

I will concede that there were somepeople that were not qualified EOOW that made CPO at NPTU Charleston. I will concede that it is probably not an "official" requirement by the CPO board.  However, it was my perception(we all know what they say about perception) that in order to have a realistic chance at CPO you had to be qualified EOOW.  It easily could be due to the evals, but just from what I saw, CPO slots went to few sailors at NPTU and most of those were EOOWs.  Of course there is always that one guy/gal that everyone asks "how in the heck did they make Chief?" 

[AmericanPride]

"Attracting our most talented nuclear operators to NPTU instructor duty is essential to maintaining nuclear fleet readiness.  Instructor duty is the most important shore duty in the Naval Nuclear Propulsion Program (NNPP) and requires our best efforts in attracting and sending the right caliber of Sailor to these positions.  The significance of these billets is recognized by the Navy in the level of Special Duty Assignment Pay for prototype instructor personnel, and in Chief Petty Officer selection board precepts that specifically recognize instructor duty as valued in our Chief Petty Officer selectees."

I think if your friend was such a hot shot...he'd be getting a deal for NPTU....not PMT.
Could be on the up and up...but smells fishy to me.

Thats exactly what the recruiters kept shoving down my throat... You can go to NPTU or Prototype (BTW, I'm the guy withroaj was talking about). It didn't sound like my cup of tea so I was going to get out and go to college. I came back from leave and halfway through my checkout process the COB offers PMT and anything else I reasonably wanted (sea time waiver, orders, "terminal leave", no more extended time on the boat... etc.).

So basically it came down to:

1) University of Connecticut -> Free tuition for vets (which the new GI bill trumped)
    BS Job until intern and even then its an iffy.
    4 Credit Acceptance from the Navy (4 years min for BS in MechEng)

-Or-

2) Online TESU BS in NucTech (still don't know if it means anything but hey its a piece of paper in a much faster time frame)
    Additional schooling around the country from manufactures (Oil Analysis to Mechanical Seals)
    Continued Experience Growth
    PMT in Pearl (screw the winters here)
    52k bonus for three years

Its just silly to not do it on my part. Also, now that I know about this gem of a website; I can lurk, network, plan for a real life after the Navy. It seems like I'm locked into getting a maintenance position when I get out though with everything I have/will be doing. I don't know but I have 3 years to figure things out. (Maybe the US will open the flood gates for Nuclear power by then  )

[Smooth Operator]

In my opinion it boils down to do you want to stay in the Navy for 3 years? An extra 52K can easily be made in a year of fully qualified time at a nuke plant vs. 3 years of additional Navy time.

It also depends a little on what you want to do in nuclear power.

If you want OPs and you wait 3 years, you might be getting out when there are no OPs classes available. You may be waiting 6 months to a year before a class starts at a plant where you want to work.

Also, its hard to interview for a post Navy nuclear job, way out in Pearl.

[AmericanPride]

In my opinion it boils down to do you want to stay in the Navy for 3 years? An extra 52K can easily be made in a year of fully qualified time at a nuke plant vs. 3 years of additional Navy time.

It also depends a little on what you want to do in nuclear power.

If you want OPs and you wait 3 years, you might be getting out when there are no OPs classes available. You may be waiting 6 months to a year before a class starts at a plant where you want to work.

Also, its hard to interview for a post Navy nuclear job, way out in Pearl.

I suppose that is the big boy question. What do I want to do? Yes...

I was planning on going to college if I didn't stay in so I'd be looking at joining the market 3-4 years anyway. The job hunters have been giving me terrible options at least minor things that aren't interesting to me. (and in the most obscure places) It seems like they just want to clear their list of "hot jobs".

I'm going to spend some quality time here to figure things out. I need to learn all the paths in the nuke industry. Maintenance seems the most comfortable but I don't want to be a full time wrench turning knuckle dragger until I'm 65. Also I'm not picky on location when I get out. Whatever is the best opportunity and offers the most growth will suit me just fine.

Off to the search function...

Jeff

[JustinHEMI05]

2) Online TESU BS in NucTech (still don't know if it means anything but hey its a piece of paper in a

If it means anything, my Shift Manager who just got promoted to Ops Superintendant has that degree.

Justin

[Preciousblue1965]

Off to the search function...

Jeff

AWWW......I think I just saw BZ shed a tear

[Already Gone]

I'm going to break with my normal pattern here.
The economy is soft.  Jobs are out there, but you have a job now.  If it is truly 3 years ashore, and they're going to give you a $52k bonus, and it gives you time to finish college, and you want to do it, take the deal.
The idea that you can increase your income out here has a lot of merit, but maybe not by as much as you might think.
Put away the calculator for a minute.  Sit on your porch with a cold beer and ask yourself what do you want to do.  Forget the money, just concentrate on what you want.  The answer will become clear, and the money will follow.

[RDTroja]

Put away the calculator for a minute.  Sit on your porch with a cold beer and ask yourself what do you want to do.  Forget the money, just concentrate on what you want.  The answer will become clear, and the money will follow.

Similar to some advice I heard before for making decisions, but I think this one may work better. Flip a coin... when the coin comes down you will likely either feel happy or sad with the result. If happy, stick with it. If sad, ignore the coin... what the hell do they know anyway?

[135i]

I think if your friend was such a hot shot...he'd be getting a deal for NPTU....not PMT.
Could be on the up and up...but smells fishy to me.

NPTU, at least in NY, is by no means a "deal". Most of that (CPO etc) he wouldn't care about anyway since it's already been stated that he's getting out after his shore tour.

So, you're telling me that you need to be EOOW qualified to make chief at NPTU.  BS I say.

Sounds about right from what I've seen. There are some good EWS who make it but EOOW is really what nails it.

[JustinHEMI05]

I suppose that is the big boy question. What do I want to do? Yes...

I was planning on going to college if I didn't stay in so I'd be looking at joining the market 3-4 years anyway. The job hunters have been giving me terrible options at least minor things that aren't interesting to me. (and in the most obscure places) It seems like they just want to clear their list of "hot jobs".

I'm going to spend some quality time here to figure things out. I need to learn all the paths in the nuke industry. Maintenance seems the most comfortable but I don't want to be a full time wrench turning knuckle dragger until I'm 65. Also I'm not picky on location when I get out. Whatever is the best opportunity and offers the most growth will suit me just fine.

Off to the search function...

Jeff

Something else caught my eye when I re-read this. You mentioned recruiters not giving you good options. I am assuming you are talking about those worthless head hunters, and therefore I agree with you. They aren't going to help you with squat as far as commercial nuke power is concerned. You pretty much have to do the work yourself, if commecial nuke power is something you are interested in. I knew the head hunters were worthless when the first one wanted me to interview for a job starting at 35K. You are in the right place as far as starting on the path to commercial nuke power. You might want to consider the option of going to college later too, as most companies have some sort of tuition assitance programs. Exelon even has a great deal with Excelsior college for their version of the NET degree. There are tons of options to consider.

I also just realized you already made your choice. Good luck!

Justin

[G-reg]

I'm heavily inclined to agree with Troy.  First consideration HAS to be given to what you really want to do with your LIFE.  If maintenance is your thing, then the PMT/college/$52K and out sounds like a worthy plan.

And in regard to turning wrenches for the rest of your life, if you like maintenance and you really "get it", then you can certainly aspire to become a supervisor/manager/planner/etc. within the Maintenance field (to carry you into your golden years).

Just one guy's thoughts...

Peace,
 - Greg

[LuckyKid]

Only one word needs to be used to sum up the above quote.

Propaganda

Right now Prototype is so hard up for people to go there that at one time(don't know if it is still true) they are offering guys at NNPTC to do a follow on shore duty if they go to prototype.  They are offering waivers out the wazzu just to get guys to go there.  If the CPO selection board was really that hard up on Prototype, they would just about make it a requirement to go there.  As it is, going to prototype as a sea returnee can as much of a career builder as it can be a career breaker.  All depends on timing.  If you get there at the wrong time, it could be 2 years before they put you into EWS quals just because you had to wait in line behind all the other E6s that were there before you that are waiting to go into quals, let alone have enough time to qualify EOOW(which is just about a requirement to make CPO at Prototype).  Get there at the right time and you could easily jump from SIR to EWS to EOOW in under 2 years. 

This man has much knowledge. There will be a shrine, and a band of worshipers with incense who have ceased to shave their armpits and bathe.

If NPTU is the shizzle, why was the Admiral 08 himself here today to have some words at the instructors? I spent all today cleaning anything mildly unsightly (after the previous all day field day yesterday) and ducking into corners anytime the radios of the MA's started to go nuts about his movements.

[Smooth Operator]

An O8 Admiral tour at Proto is no big deal from one to another.

Bowman came to Charleston in 99-00 timeframe when I was a SPU to deliver a you f-in guys speech, training standards, blah, blah, blah.

Then we got a MUC for qualifying so many students in 00.