Advice you would give to a (female) NLO starting training

[darlingetoile]

What kind of advice would you give to a female NLO starting training?  I'm a 23 and I start in a few weeks.  Most of the advice I wanted (how to approach the training, what to focus on, general nuclear discussion) I found from the search function.  However, the only threads I can find about females in nuclear didn't quite discuss my situation.

So for example, let's hypothetically say that your daughter or sister were starting NLO training (non nuke), what type of advice would you give her? I'm looking for both generic advice you would give but also advice you would give in terms of how I need to draw boundaries and anything I should watch out for.  Maybe it won't be an issue - and I hope not -  but I don't want to assume one way or another as I haven't been there. 

I hope that this makes sense.  This isn't really a question I like asking, I try not to really think about it, and I sincerely hope that no one is offended by it, but I think it's important to get a perspective (even if the perspective is that you'd give me the same advice as anyone). 

Thanks everyone! 

[Cycoticpenguin]

I hypothetically suggest you realize you are in a business, and your position requires the same advice as any male.

Im not offended. Its just ignorant.

But since you asked.
1) It's a business. They are here to run reactors safely and make money doing so. Keep that in your mind with your actions.
2) Theres no grounds for harassment anywhere. Even in the Navy.... Im not following your concern here.
3) If you feel like you are studying enough, and barely passing, I have bad news for you.
4) Utilyze your staff. You got hired in, you can make it through, and its 99.5% your fault if you dont pass.
5) Dont make an example out of yourself, or do make an example out of yourself. Just make sure you are on the right side of the fence.
6) No one likes a kissass.
7) The only boundaries you need to be concerned with from this point forward at work,(hopefully) are fission product boundaries.

You are not a special snow flake, and I have seen only the utmost in professionalism in the plant at all times. If you randomly had issues with someone, guess what, go talk to your AOM, and problem solved, I gaurentee it.

[Fermi2]

1: Have a thick skin.

2: Participate in class. Keep it pertinent, no one cares about the womans perspective, it's a power plant not an encounter group.

3: Study hard and review constantly.

4: Walkdown the plant has much as you can.

5: Do not be meek, especially during qualification, no one is going to spoon feed your qual book. If you want it done it's up to you.

6: Do not expect extra help from the qualified NLOs simply because you're a woman, on the same note please do not fail to ask a question because you're a woman.

7: The three or four most successful women I've ever seen as NLOs or in any training program simply viewed it as their job to do well in class then kept that in mind and got it done. They were and are very successful operators. The two that didn't do well had the "I'm a woman attitude therefore..." That simply doesn't cut it in the NLO break area, which is as close to a Lions den as you'll ever see. They won't actively discriminate however they won't actively help if any attitude is displayed. That actually applies with anyone.

8: This industry eats the meek. Hit it hard right off and then hit it harder. I have an opinion from watching good operators over the last 27 years including my time in the canoe club. If you're not willing to drive 10 miles per hour over the speed limit you simply don't belong in a nuclear facility. It's an attitude thing.

[darlingetoile]

I hypothetically suggest you realize you are in a business, and your position requires the same advice as any male.

I'm not offended. Its just ignorant.

But since you asked.
1) It's a business. They are here to run reactors safely and make money doing so. Keep that in your mind with your actions.
2) Theres no grounds for harassment anywhere. Even in the Navy.... I'm not following your concern here.
3) If you feel like you are studying enough, and barely passing, I have bad news for you.
4) Utilyze your staff. You got hired in, you can make it through, and its 99.5% your fault if you dont pass.
5) Dont make an example out of yourself, or do make an example out of yourself. Just make sure you are on the right side of the fence.
6) No one likes a kissass.
7) The only boundaries you need to be concerned with from this point forward at work,(hopefully) are fission product boundaries.

You are not a special snow flake, and I have seen only the utmost in professionalism in the plant at all times. If you randomly had issues with someone, guess what, go talk to your AOM, and problem solved, I gaurentee it.

2) I'm not actively concerned about that, although if there was something I could do to prevent it in any way I would want to know so I could do that from day 1. I doubt it will be an issue but I'd rather make it clear that I'm there to work/work my butt off in the training  so that there is no room for confusion (but like you said, it's a business). 

3) I tend to overstudy, which has never been bad for my grades - but from the posts I've read that's probably the minimum effort you would need to put forth.  I'll definitely need to study even harder than that.  I mean I'll be being paid to pay attention and know the material like the back of my hand so, I think that's a fair expectation.

5) I'm not sure what you mean?

7) Haha.

Thanks, this - and the other posts - were really helpful.  Honestly, it's not that I am sitting here anticipating some horrible group dynamic, it's me wanting to ask this so I can negate all the ridiculous unsolicited advice/acedotes that I have been hearing from people in my life who have never set foot in a nuclear plant, and never been in an NLO training program.  Also I mean, I want to make sure I'm doing whatever I can to prevent (highly unlikely) issues. I'd be thrilled if this is a redundant exercise, as you have suggested.  But sounds like your thoughts are similar to mine (and I'm glad to have that confirmed)...as long as I focus on working my butt off on the training, I won't have time to worry about it and it won't be an issue anyway.

[darlingetoile]

1: Have a thick skin.

2: Participate in class. Keep it pertinent, no one cares about the womans perspective, it's a power plant not an encounter group.

3: Study hard and review constantly.

4: Walkdown the plant has much as you can.

5: Do not be meek, especially during qualification, no one is going to spoon feed your qual book. If you want it done it's up to you.

6: Do not expect extra help from the qualified NLOs simply because you're a woman, on the same note please do not fail to ask a question because you're a woman.

7: The three or four most successful women I've ever seen as NLOs or in any training program simply viewed it as their job to do well in class then kept that in mind and got it done. They were and are very successful operators. The two that didn't do well had the "I'm a woman attitude therefore..." That simply doesn't cut it in the NLO break area, which is as close to a Lions den as you'll ever see. They won't actively discriminate however they won't actively help if any attitude is displayed. That actually applies with anyone.

8: This industry eats the meek. Hit it hard right off and then hit it harder. I have an opinion from watching good operators over the last 27 years including my time in the canoe club. If you're not willing to drive 10 miles per hour over the speed limit you simply don't belong in a nuclear facility. It's an attitude thing.

2: I kind of laughed when I read this.  I agree with you entirely, but I laughed because it sounds like you've encountered this before? I wouldn't want to listen to that either.  

7: I know the types of women you mean...(the "I am a woman and therefore..." women).  They are same type of women (speaking from my experience only) who have given me useless unsolicited advice.  It's almost like when you fall into my demographic, and accept any kind of industrial or remotely technical job they find you and try to convert you to that kind of thinking.  It's annoying and it's not really productive.  Thinking about it, I'm probably more likely to experience that kind of annoyance than any other adverse situation, haha.  

[UncaBuffalo]

I hypothetically suggest you realize you are in a business, and your position requires the same advice as any male.

Im not offended. Its just ignorant.

2) Theres no grounds for harassment anywhere. Even in the Navy.... Im not following your concern here.
7) The only boundaries you need to be concerned with from this point forward at work,(hopefully) are fission product boundaries.

You are not a special snow flake, and I have seen only the utmost in professionalism in the plant at all times. If you randomly had issues with someone, guess what, go talk to your AOM, and problem solved, I gaurentee it.

I do NOT agree that nuclear power is the same for women.  At most plants they are still outnumbered AT LEAST 10 to 1 in the 'hands-on' (craft, NLO, etc) positions.  Even if there were NO chauvinist jerks (there will be), the simple fact is that all the guys will know her name within the first month & 90% of them will say 'Hi' every time she walks by.  This kind of spotlight has its advantages & disadvantages, but to say "It's all the same whether you are male or female"...?

My advice to anyone (male or female) coming into a new plant is to keep everything on a professional & "business-only" basis for the first couple of months.  Two years from now, no one will remember if you were a little bit quiet & 'standoff-ish' when you first got to the plant.  After a couple of months you will know better what 'boundaries' are appropriate & can become a bit more involved with the 'personal' side of work...if you think you should.

Good luck.





Modified for spelling...

[buckeye99]

If you're not willing to drive 10 miles per hour over the speed limit you simply don't belong in a nuclear facility. It's an attitude thing.

[darlingetoile]

It can break that way...the trainers, supervisors, etc may be oversensitive about making sure they can't be accused of discriminating...and cut her extra slack.  

But, in my opinion, the female nuke worker always has to fight a few coworkers' bias that she might be getting a free ride...so she has to work harder & do better, just to put that possibility to rest.

Most plants have fired enough people for harassment so blatant 'grabass' isn't the issue anymore.  Continually being in the spotlight, dealing with unwanted flirting, having to exceed expectations, etc are the issues...

Yea, I don't want to be cut extra slack.  It would be hard to be on the receiving end of that because it's not going to help me as an NLO to do the job, and it's hard to prevent someone from doing that, plus your coworkers are going to hate you.  I think you summed up what I was trying to be cautious about pretty well - the spotlight type behaviour.  I just want to make sure I give off the right attitude so that I don't give anyone the impression that I want attention or feel entitled to some sort of special treatment;  Hopefully that will help me avoid those situations.  I completely agree with feeling the need to exceed expectations - but I'm alright with having a bit of extra motivation.   

Thanks for your responses. 

[retired nuke]

OK, here is a non-operator perspective, of your situation....

We have a couple female ROs. One is part of a married couple of ROs, both licensed, different crews. The other is also married to another plant worker.

Both are competent and respected. One came from Chem, one from USN.

We got another that is in instant class - from engineering... again, competent.


DO your job
KNOW your material
STAY OUT of the hot tub parties
LISTEN more than speak.

Same advice I have for other OPs people.
Operators may know the plant. But if they can't work with the support organizations (Maint / RP / Engineering) they will not be effective SROs..

Good luck, sounds like you have identified the rocks, and are preparing to sail around them...

[Fermi2]

Yep,

Do you job, keep your nose clean, accept feedback and at least consider acting on it whether you like it or not, work to high standards and you'll be just fine.

BTW in answer to the encounter group question the answer is yes.

[Stngray]

This is my bf's account but I had to respond because this is the exact same situation I was in when I started NLO training.  I was 23, I had been out of college for a year with a degree in biology/chemistry, and had absolutely no idea of what to expect.  I felt like I was going to be in WAY over my head...but 3 years later I just got accepted into the next license class.  So here's my advice on how to cope. 

       People will treat you differently.  I work at Palo Verde and out of the 330 operators, we have 10 women.  Some of the women (like the men) are very competent, while others are not.  If the male operators have had to deal with incompetent women in the past, they probably will not have a great first impression of you.  The only way you can get around this is by proving that you can get the job done just as well as they can and that is going to take time.  If anyone is too obnoxious to you, ignore them for the time being, eventually they will come around once your intelligence and work ethic are established.  As previously mentioned there will be lots of men that want to talk to you, say hi at every opportunity, and are generally more friendly to you than to anyone else in your class.  Use this to your advantage and network, but also let them know that you are in a relationship, or just not interested in becoming involved with people at work so that there is no mystery about your intentions.

       If you get easily offended, this is probably not the right field for you.  First, remember that in the nuclear world "feedback is a gift".  You will be getting a lot of "gifts", and if you don't remember that line you will quickly become disheartened and depressed.  Also, once your male counterparts feel comfortable with you, they are likely to talk about everything (and I do mean everything) in front of you.  You can deal with this in one of several ways - Talk to you supervisor (this will most likely mean that you will be ostracized, so probably not a good option), tell the guys that it bothers you when they talk about certain things (although this is better than the last option, the third option is by far the best), ignore it - most of it is just talk anyway, if it really bothers you and you can't ignore it get up and walk down some systems.  Your crew will become the biggest asset to help you with things in your future career. 

        Understand your limitations.  There will be valves in the plant that you won't be able to operate by yourself and you will have to ask for help.  Try to do things on your own first, the guys will appreciate your effort and be much more willing to help out.  Also, teamwork is always best, so if you help them they will have no problems helping you.

You will probably get special treatment, even if you don't ask for or want it.   You will have to work harder than your male counterparts to be recognized as one of the capable NLOs.  Everyone will assume that you got where you are because you're a girl.  There's nothing you can do about any of these things, but like previously mentioned, if you are pleasant (but not flirty), helpful, and work hard everyone will respect you and you shouldn't have any issues.  Good luck with initial training!   

[Starkist]

Thats a great post!! 

[darlingetoile]

This is my bf's account but I had to respond because this is the exact same situation I was in when I started NLO training.  I was 23, I had been out of college for a year with a degree in biology/chemistry, and had absolutely no idea of what to expect.  I felt like I was going to be in WAY over my head...but 3 years later I just got accepted into the next license class.  So here's my advice on how to cope. 

       People will treat you differently.  I work at Palo Verde and out of the 330 operators, we have 10 women.  Some of the women (like the men) are very competent, while others are not.  If the male operators have had to deal with incompetent women in the past, they probably will not have a great first impression of you.  The only way you can get around this is by proving that you can get the job done just as well as they can and that is going to take time.  If anyone is too obnoxious to you, ignore them for the time being, eventually they will come around once your intelligence and work ethic are established.  As previously mentioned there will be lots of men that want to talk to you, say hi at every opportunity, and are generally more friendly to you than to anyone else in your class.  Use this to your advantage and network, but also let them know that you are in a relationship, or just not interested in becoming involved with people at work so that there is no mystery about your intentions.

       If you get easily offended, this is probably not the right field for you.  First, remember that in the nuclear world "feedback is a gift".  You will be getting a lot of "gifts", and if you don't remember that line you will quickly become disheartened and depressed.  Also, once your male counterparts feel comfortable with you, they are likely to talk about everything (and I do mean everything) in front of you.  You can deal with this in one of several ways - Talk to you supervisor (this will most likely mean that you will be ostracized, so probably not a good option), tell the guys that it bothers you when they talk about certain things (although this is better than the last option, the third option is by far the best), ignore it - most of it is just talk anyway, if it really bothers you and you can't ignore it get up and walk down some systems.  Your crew will become the biggest asset to help you with things in your future career. 

        Understand your limitations.  There will be valves in the plant that you won't be able to operate by yourself and you will have to ask for help.  Try to do things on your own first, the guys will appreciate your effort and be much more willing to help out.  Also, teamwork is always best, so if you help them they will have no problems helping you.

You will probably get special treatment, even if you don't ask for or want it.   You will have to work harder than your male counterparts to be recognized as one of the capable NLOs.  Everyone will assume that you got where you are because you're a girl.  There's nothing you can do about any of these things, but like previously mentioned, if you are pleasant (but not flirty), helpful, and work hard everyone will respect you and you shouldn't have any issues.  Good luck with initial training!   

This was really helpful, thanks!  It's good to hear from someone who has been there, and gone to the license class as well.   Thanks so much!

[Hitec757]

Is the nuclear industry any different than any male dominated occupation?  Maybe, maybe not and probably varies a lot by company and management. Do you consider yourself very attractive and think all the guys will hit on you or is your concern something else?  What I have seen that is universally true, although outside nuclear, is that women that were actually smart enough and good enough to really be there in the first place w/o being a quota, and who didn't play the female card, all ended up getting the same if not more respect than the men would. If however, they flirted with all the guys, married ones included and ended up dating a supervisor, well, the names they were called they deserved and the lack of respect and the reputation they had was deserved as well.  While some guys will always be pigs, no one can criticize a job well done.