When Did EMs Lose The Ability To "Touch Rods"?

[dave in St. Louis]

I was looking at old posts when I saw this one quoted below.  Rather than necroing the thread (after the software warned me), I decided to make a new thread.  So here it goes.

Back in the day (1967-72), RO's were either ET's or IC's (Interior Communications).  These ratings had the training in electronic theory necessary for maintenance of reactor instrumentation.  On Bainbridge, those who where or would become RO's were in Reactor Controls Division, which was responsible for reactor operation and instrumentation maintenance and repair.  ET's first qualified as Reactor Technician, basically on the instrumentation and instrumentation alley watch, the secondary control of the reactor.  Once qualified as an RT, you were assigned to instrumentation maintenance and repair.  RO was the next, and final qualification for an ET.  To get there, you had to qualify on all engine room and control room watch stations.   You had to understand all the electrical distribution and plant cross connections.  You had to understand the interaction of everything in the plant.  Back then, the RO was the second in line watch under the Engineering Watch Officer.

I was looking up a Chief from the USS Thresher after having been told a story by Admiral Cowhill [1] when I saw him at NIH in August on my last day there [2] and when I found EMC/SS Roscoe Pennington, I was surprised to see that he was assigned to RC Division and was the Leading Chief.

http://www.ussthresher.com/roster/penningtonr.htm

When did EMs lose the ability to "touch rods"?  Does anyone know?  Obviously, this was some time before 1967.

[1] Cowhill had been commissioning XO on Thresher.

[2] I was dropped from my study due to the build-up of negative side-effects from the treatment.  I am on a new cancer treatment here in St. Louis and am doing fine.  Admiral Cowhill looked fine (or as fine as a man that old and suffering from cancer can look) then.

[DLGN25]

Dave, he was before my time and served on submarines, which I did not.  The Chief's NEC (as listed on Together We Served) indicates he was a nuclear trained electrician.  How, or even if he was assigned to RC division would only be speculation on my part. 

That said, form my experience in the surface fleet, it seems unlikely that an EMC would be a reactor operator, or for that matter, any chief would be.  On Bainbridge, chiefs in RC division did not qualify as RO's.  They were trained and stood watch as a Watch Supervisor or if you prefer as a Watch Officer in the after engine room. 

How it is done on the boats, I will let another chime in.

[dave in St. Louis]

Dave, he was before my time and served on submarines, which I did not.  The Chief's NEC (as listed on Together We Served) indicates he was a nuclear trained electrician.  How, or even if he was assigned to RC division would only be speculation on my part. 

That said, form my experience in the surface fleet, it seems unlikely that an EMC would be a reactor operator, or for that matter, any chief would be.  On Bainbridge, chiefs in RC division did not qualify as RO's.  They were trained and stood watch as a Watch Supervisor or if you prefer as a Watch Officer in the after engine room. 

How it is done on the boats, I will let another chime in.

The Admiral indicated that Chief Pennington was a Reactor Operator.  It is likely that he normally stood EWS but maintained proficiency on the RPCP - just like all the Chiefs I served with in RC Division on USS Michigan (Blue).

[DSO]

I was a sub EM Nuke from 1985-2005 and EMs were not allowed to touch rods in my time in.....they did qualify Shutdown Reactor Operator (Senior in rate qual) for in port. Chiefs only qualified EWS as DLGN25 said....and no other nuclear watch stations while I was in.

[Marlin]

   As EWS I had to sit a number of RCP watches to qualify and gave the RO breaks when needed. Not the same as qualifying RO but I did legally shim rods and operate the panel as an MM. Only ETs qualified RO (1970-1978).

[DSO]

I was a sub EM Nuke from 1985-2005 and EMs were not allowed to touch rods in my time in.....they did qualify Shutdown Reactor Operator (Senior in rate qual) for in port. Chiefs only qualified EWS as DLGN25 said....and no other nuclear watch stations while I was in.

I stand corrected....as Marlin said- I do remember the ET Chief standing his proficiency watch as RO now while at sea....he regularly stood EWS but was qualified as RO, as its all coming back to me now.

[Zog]

I was an EM, qualified everything I could in and out of my rate (ST, FTC, RT, EWS, SRO, et...) My CO supported me qualifying RO and asked his chain of command for permission but was denied.

[HydroDave63]

I was an EM, qualified everything I could in and out of my rate (ST, FTC, RT, EWS, SRO, et...) My CO supported me qualifying RO and asked his chain of command for permission but was denied.

Agreed. NMPC denies a lot of requests like that. I know a SIR qual'd EM that offered to extend or reenlist with StingerSAM school as the "C" school, signed off until NMPC denied it.

[DLGN25]

The Admiral indicated that Chief Pennington was a Reactor Operator.  It is likely that he normally stood EWS but maintained proficiency on the RPCP - just like all the Chiefs I served with in RC Division on USS Michigan (Blue).

Dave, I have no argument with you on what Chief Pennington did or did not do. The man's achievement was exceptional.  To go from being an steward in the segregated Navy, then as an E-6 Steward to an E-6 Electrician Mate, then to a nuclear qualified EMC is a statement of who he was and what he had to over come in his career.  He survived a dark time in Naval history to serve in the most demanding of navy assignments.

Now back to the topic. Here is an article written in 1983 in memorial of him and the naming of a training facility after him.  You will notice the reference to "Leading Chief Reactor Technician", which is the same as the in memory post of 1963 which you cite.  So one can assume that the later article was in part based on the former. 

During my time in the NUC program (1967-70), just four years after his death, I never heard of such a title, not that it did not exist, just that I never heard of it.  The good chief's NEC was EM-3364-Submarine Nuclear Propulsion Plant Supervisor-Electrical. 

If I may be so bold as to suggest that the title referenced in the articles may have been a misunderstanding, and does necessarily not mean Reactor Control.

Regardless of his actual assignment, he was an exceptional man.

Oh, by the way, after the loss of Thresher, all RPCs were altered to eliminate the automatic closing of steam stops on a reactor crash.



http://navy.togetherweserved.com/usn/servlet/tws.webapp.WebApp?cmd=ShadowBoxProfile&type=Person&ID=300953