Limdu - Mental Health

[oooo35980]

Hey, new to the boards and haven't been able to find anything to answer my question, so here goes.

First some background:
In nuke school I got an ARI, wasn't masted or punished in any way (Basically just passed out drunk on the beach, but a civilian though I might have AP and so called the ambulance against my friends objections.)  I got "treated" and continued with my school, got through prototype NP, and when I got to my first command the DAPA their decided I hadn't been treated adequately and sent me to see SARP, who referred me to mental health, who treated me for depression and pulled me off the submarine while telling me it wasn't the end of the world and I wouldn't get de-nuked or de-sub.

My first 6 month limdu just ended and they were going to med-board me but I was improving so after basically begging to be given another chance because I'm hoping to get back to my old self and go back to work they extended me another 6 months.  They also De-nuked and De-sub'd me, which bummed me out, but the worst is they are taking back my bonus pretty much cutting my paycheck by 1/3.  There is nothing I could have done to avoid being pulled, other than just lying to mental health about what is going on with me.  I have a wife and kid and alot of bills and was barely getting by before.

I thought they couldn't pull my bonus unless I had voluntarily separated or done something illegal and been masted out.  Is this something I should pursue?  Is it possible they just saw my De-nuking and refunded the bonus without even checking the situation?  I am starting to think maybe it isn't worth it to try to stay in and I should just stop fighting it and let them separate me.

[HydroDave63]

Is it possible they just saw my De-nuking and refunded the bonus without even checking the situation? 

What is there to check? Loss of NEC = loss of bonus.

Ethanol is a wonderful solvent. It can dissolve almost anything, from stirfry sauce to fingernail polish to NEC, DD-214 and even families. You spend most of your post bemoaning your loss of bonus money and pride, and trying to save something already lost. Focus on how you are going to succeed in a different path, for the wife and little one! If you can stay in the fleet as a different rating, the dry out and do it. You never know when you might learn a new valuable trade that you can leverage for future jobs.

[Smooth Operator]

Hey, new to the boards and haven't been able to find anything to answer my question, so here goes.

First some background:
In nuke school I got an ARI, wasn't masted or punished in any way (Basically just passed out drunk on the beach, but a civilian though I might have AP and so called the ambulance against my friends objections.)  I got "treated" and continued with my school, got through prototype NP, and when I got to my first command the DAPA their decided I hadn't been treated adequately and sent me to see SARP, who referred me to mental health, who treated me for depression and pulled me off the submarine while telling me it wasn't the end of the world and I wouldn't get de-nuked or de-sub.

My first 6 month limdu just ended and they were going to med-board me but I was improving so after basically begging to be given another chance because I'm hoping to get back to my old self and go back to work they extended me another 6 months.  They also De-nuked and De-sub'd me, which bummed me out, but the worst is they are taking back my bonus pretty much cutting my paycheck by 1/3.  There is nothing I could have done to avoid being pulled, other than just lying to mental health about what is going on with me.  I have a wife and kid and alot of bills and was barely getting by before.

I thought they couldn't pull my bonus unless I had voluntarily separated or done something illegal and been masted out.  Is this something I should pursue?  Is it possible they just saw my De-nuking and refunded the bonus without even checking the situation?  I am starting to think maybe it isn't worth it to try to stay in and I should just stop fighting it and let them separate me.

So how do you go from drunk sailor passed out on beach (common) to depressed, de-nuked, de-subbed sailor (uncommon)

There seems to be some details missing between the initiating event and the Navy's actions.

You made it sound like you just partied one night and the civvies got involved and it spiraled beyond your control.

When did you become a sad panda?

[MacGyver]

Hey, new to the boards and haven't been able to find anything to answer my question, so here goes.

First some background:
In nuke school I got an ARI, wasn't masted or punished in any way (Basically just passed out drunk on the beach, but a civilian though I might have AP and so called the ambulance against my friends objections.)  I got "treated" and continued with my school, got through prototype NP, and when I got to my first command the DAPA their decided I hadn't been treated adequately and sent me to see SARP, who referred me to mental health, who treated me for depression and pulled me off the submarine while telling me it wasn't the end of the world and I wouldn't get de-nuked or de-sub.

My first 6 month limdu just ended and they were going to med-board me but I was improving so after basically begging to be given another chance because I'm hoping to get back to my old self and go back to work they extended me another 6 months.  They also De-nuked and De-sub'd me, which bummed me out, but the worst is they are taking back my bonus pretty much cutting my paycheck by 1/3.  There is nothing I could have done to avoid being pulled, other than just lying to mental health about what is going on with me.  I have a wife and kid and alot of bills and was barely getting by before.

I thought they couldn't pull my bonus unless I had voluntarily separated or done something illegal and been masted out.  Is this something I should pursue?  Is it possible they just saw my De-nuking and refunded the bonus without even checking the situation?  I am starting to think maybe it isn't worth it to try to stay in and I should just stop fighting it and let them separate me.

You should listen to HydroDave63.

And, for a little perspective in the day and time I went through the program you would have been keelhauled right after they removed you from the program.  We didn't tolerate even a bounced check.

Get better soon, you don't have a choice (e.g. family).

Mac

[Fermi2]

They can take your bonus. They just don't ask for any back.

Did the LimDu thing for 18 months!

[oooo35980]

  Alot did happen between my ARI and getting pulled, about half of power school and all of prototype...  I never heard anything else about the ARI until I got to my first command and they wanted me to see SARP because the DAPA there felt I hadn't been treaded adequately despite having kept my nose clean for over a year.  The SARP medical officer (who is a psychologist) asked me some questions which I answered honestly and then referred me to mental health, who treated me for a few months and then disqualified me the week before I went on my first underway.  Other details are just personal matters than never involved the Navy until I was referred to mental health and are 100% unrelated to alcohol, my ARI, or my job performance.  The ARI is something that quite literally has nothing to do with my situation except for the fact that getting it led to me being seen by a psychologist who either screwed my career or saved me from a psychotic break, I'm honestly not sure which, but it's probably the latter.

I'm not going to go into detail about my personal problems except to say it has nothing to do with work and isn't anyone's business.  Fact is I was de-nuked for a medical condition which will likely lead to me being separated if I can't get it together soon and was looking for advice on enlistment bonuses preferably from someone who had been in the same or similar situation.  I wasn't really looking for life advice since I have that coming out of my ears at this point, but honest thanks for trying.  "Smooth Operator", I'm not sure if you were trolling with the "sad panda" crack, but it definately seems like you were and I have no interest in feeding the trolls thanks.

[HydroDave63]

I'm not going to go into detail about my personal problems except to say it has nothing to do with work and isn't anyone's business. 

But you came here looking for validation on any possible upside (how do I get my NEC/money back?)

Step 1 - We admitted we were powerless over our addiction - that our lives had become unmanageable

[oooo35980]

But you came here looking for validation on any possible upside (how do I get my NEC/money back?)

Step 1 - We admitted we were powerless over our addiction - that our lives had become unmanageable

Not sure what you mean, could you clarify?

Step 2 - We came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity

[Cycoticpenguin]

Not sure what you mean, could you clarify?

Step 2 - We came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity

Dave.... Im anxiously awaiting your reply hahaha

[HydroDave63]

My reply is..... the past cannot be changed, work hard for the future. Personally I'm hoping to read of a success story sometime in the future (I even remember the story of a young lad whose TLD was removed and was forced to be a Nuclear Janitor for a while. last I heard he is doing okay   )

[Smooth Operator]

  Alot did happen between my ARI and getting pulled, about half of power school and all of prototype...  I never heard anything else about the ARI until I got to my first command and they wanted me to see SARP because the DAPA there felt I hadn't been treaded adequately despite having kept my nose clean for over a year.  The SARP medical officer (who is a psychologist) asked me some questions which I answered honestly and then referred me to mental health, who treated me for a few months and then disqualified me the week before I went on my first underway.  Other details are just personal matters than never involved the Navy until I was referred to mental health and are 100% unrelated to alcohol, my ARI, or my job performance.  The ARI is something that quite literally has nothing to do with my situation except for the fact that getting it led to me being seen by a psychologist who either screwed my career or saved me from a psychotic break, I'm honestly not sure which, but it's probably the latter.

I'm not going to go into detail about my personal problems except to say it has nothing to do with work and isn't anyone's business.  Fact is I was de-nuked for a medical condition which will likely lead to me being separated if I can't get it together soon and was looking for advice on enlistment bonuses preferably from someone who had been in the same or similar situation.  I wasn't really looking for life advice since I have that coming out of my ears at this point, but honest thanks for trying.  "Smooth Operator", I'm not sure if you were trolling with the "sad panda" crack, but it definately seems like you were and I have no interest in feeding the trolls thanks.

I wasn't asking for the color of your wife's panties, but if you are looking for advice, then the best advice comes after someone has a better understanding of the situation.

I went LIMDU for a back injury sustained on the boat and eventually lost my NEC etc, and no one ever came looking to recoup my nuke money. Why they came after yours? I don't know, the devil is in the details.

My guess is to get a copy of your contract and a lawyer.

[Gamecock]

I don't know, the devil is in the details.

Other details are just personal matters than never involved the Navy until I was referred to mental health and are 100% unrelated to alcohol, my ARI, or my job performance.  in feeding the trolls thanks.

My guess is that those "personal matters" involved a pre-exisiting condition which you failed to disclose prior to entering the navy.  As such, we can take your bonus back for fraudulent enlistment. 

[Smooth Operator]

My guess is that those "personal matters" involved a pre-exisiting condition which you failed to disclose prior to entering the navy.  As such, we can take your bonus back for fraudulent enlistment. 

You know GC, I was thinking the same thing.

[IPREGEN]

Take the separation and start from there. Be honest with yourself and what you need to do. Sit down with people that love you and ask them for support and their honest opinion on how you have been and what they would like to see you do. DO NOT SPEAK OR REACT AT ALL during this. If you do they will not tell you what you need to hear. Recovery has a high failure rate, decide every day when you get up where you want to be.

[Smooth Operator]

Take the separation and start from there. Be honest with yourself and what you need to do. Sit down with people that love you and ask them for support and their honest opinion on how you have been and what they would like to see you do. DO NOT SPEAK OR REACT AT ALL during this. If you do they will not tell you what you need to hear. Recovery has a high failure rate, decide every day when you get up where you want to be.

Didn't you read, he doesn't need your life advice?

[IPREGEN]

Every town needs a wino

[oooo35980]

My guess is that those "personal matters" involved a pre-exisiting condition which you failed to disclose prior to entering the navy.  As such, we can take your bonus back for fraudulent enlistment. 

The "Personal Matters" are related to things that happened while I was in the Navy and were unavoidable and out of my control according to my doctors.  They happened between my ARI and getting to my first command.  There is no Pre-existing personality disorder involved, and I was never diagnosed with anything related to mental health (Or physical health come to think of it) before entering the Navy.

The story I have related is 100% true and complete save for the exact details of my personal life.  I have no reason to lie or cover up pertinent details. I don't think whoever actually did the removal of my bonus knows the exact story anyway.  Shouldn't they just see that I was diagnosed with depression and lost my NEC?  What actually led to the depression should not be available to anyone but myself and my doctor, or am I way off base?

[Cycoticpenguin]

Time to back off gentlemen. He's purposely not air drying his dirty laundry.

[drayer54]

Personally I'm hoping to read of a success story sometime in the future

I agree. Don't let any of this stuff get to you, life will go on and you will be just fine. People on here have had issues similar to this and recovered just fine and hopefully so will you. This is another one of lifes lessons and use it wisely my friend.
Good luck to you.

I even remember the story of a young lad whose TLD was removed and was forced to be a Nuclear Janitor for a while. last I heard he is doing okay   )

He was forced to go work for some of the Navy's finest actually . I wouldn't say he was as much of a janitor as he was a jack of all trades on hand for random tasking at all hours.
He did well, it was probably that time that set him up for that success to be found later.

[oooo35980]

Thanks for all the replies, I finally got through to someone at PSD who wasn't an answering machine, apparently they had calculated the bonus repayment for my soft EAOS, which is a year from now, instead of my hard EAOS, which is 3 years from now.  I'm not getting it back but I did manage to not have to pay back 15k in one year, so the deduction is about 1/3 of what it was.  It's not what I used to make but at least it will be managable.  I'm going to keep trying, I have 5 1/2 months left on my limdu, at the end of that If I'm not eligible to go back on full duty I'll just let them separate me.

Once again thanks for all the replies.

[Smooth Operator]

Well that is good news.

So are you re-paying some money or just not getting future money? Also, this money..are we talking your initial enlistment bonus or a STAR relenlistment or combination of both. I could not ascertain were exactly you were in your time served, but it seemed somewhere near to where you'd be eligible to STAR-up.

Also, I don't think anyone here wants to know information covered under HIPPA, but it is very hard to discuss an issue like yours in an open forum without having details.

A question like how do I get my money back is best not answered here because no one knows your disciplinary record, academic record, medical status, etc etc, all them there things that I am assuming the Navy decision makers use to determine how you will get processed.

Its a Catch-22.

And lastly, sorry for the Sad Panda remark. I was not trolling. My initial read of your story was that you got drunk and ended up in a ridiculous spiralling situation. I was not intending to make light of your actual medical condition.

[oooo35980]

Well that is good news.

So are you re-paying some money or just not getting future money? Also, this money..are we talking your initial enlistment bonus or a STAR relenlistment or combination of both. I could not ascertain were exactly you were in your time served, but it seemed somewhere near to where you'd be eligible to STAR-up.

Also, I don't think anyone here wants to know information covered under HIPPA, but it is very hard to discuss an issue like yours in an open forum without having details.

A question like how do I get my money back is best not answered here because no one knows your disciplinary record, academic record, medical status, etc etc, all them there things that I am assuming the Navy decision makers use to determine how you will get processed.

Its a Catch-22.

And lastly, sorry for the Sad Panda remark. I was not trolling. My initial read of your story was that you got drunk and ended up in a ridiculous spiralling situation. I was not intending to make light of your actual medical condition.

I'm repaying money from my initial enlistment bonus, and I was eligible to star reenlist before I got pulled from the submarine, I had actually planned on it.  My service record is spotless save for the one ARI.  I got through all phases of nuke school with distinction, being honorman in A-school, to 3 or 4 in P-school and just crazy ahead of the curve in P-type.  Never failed a PRT or anything, pretty much a model sailor up until recently.

I probably should have put more details initially, I guess I'm so familiar with my situation I expect people to just fill in the details.  It is somewhat irritating that when someone hears that an ARI was the catalyst for the entire thing they just assume it was all caused by alcohol, but this isn't the first time It's happened and won't be the last so don't worry about it.  It's all good.

[Cycoticpenguin]

Your bonus is toast, and you are probably going to be fed some bologna about force converting. You WILL NOT be allowed to force convert, it WILL get denied. You need to start looking at colleges, and where to go from there.