Why are nukes de-nuked?

[withroaj]

  ...I would think that the school would benefit from re-instituting this practice as many good operators are probably lost unnecessarily and a lot of high end academics do not get the full load they should be carrying...

Like an academic Buffett rule? 

[Marlin]

Like an academic Buffett rule? 

Maybe an inverse Buffet rule as it would provide a greater challenge and learning for the high end students or those who already have college as opposed to those straight out of High School. 

[Starkist]

Much much appreciated. I have the time to try just about anything to study since I'm pretty much on base all the time. I don't know how all those guys in my class just d**k around. There's a lot of talking and hanging out during study time, and they barely get their homework done. I wish there was some sort of credit for putting forth the effort while everyone else coasts to some really good grades. Meanwhile, I'm at NDI trying to figure stuff out. I'm sick of putting out twice the effort for twice the hours and getting by.

If you think you and them aren't noticed for their applicable efforts, you are incorrect. Don't worry about them so much anyway, they don't take your tests nor do your homework. Work ethic isn't something powerschool teaches you, your time will come around.

[Rod Puller]

If you think you and them aren't noticed for their applicable efforts, you are incorrect. Don't worry about them so much anyway, they don't take your tests nor do your homework. Work ethic isn't something powerschool teaches you, your time will come around.

This.  As someone that struggled going through the pipeline myself, it was important for me to learn to forget about what everyone else was doing.  The pipeline is difficult enough without having to concern yourself with other people's actions and comparing yourself to them.  In the end you determine your own level of success.  Work on developing good study skills now; the pipeline isn't going to get any easier.

FYI: I made Chief in 8 years based primarily upon my work ethic and commitment to always doing my best.  Nobody on the Chief selection board is going to be looking at your A-School GPA.

Lower Half/Lower Half ETC

[MMM]

This.  As someone that struggled going through the pipeline myself, it was important for me to learn to forget about what everyone else was doing.  The pipeline is difficult enough without having to concern yourself with other people's actions and comparing yourself to them.  In the end you determine your own level of success.  Work on developing good study skills now; the pipeline isn't going to get any easier.

FYI: I made Chief in 8 years based primarily upon my work ethic and commitment to always doing my best.  Nobody on the Chief selection board is going to be looking at your A-School GPA.

Lower Half/Lower Half ETC

Well, there's the real reason.

[Rod Puller]

Well, there's the real reason.

Touche my friend.  Touche.

[theCITY]

Most of the guys I knew who got de-nuked, the reason was academics. As in, they just weren't able to do the material. If people have the smarts to get through, the program is designed to ensure you put in the effort.

A few went for spice, one for coke, one for police involvement and a decent amount for drinking related issues.

[old_dad_]

De-nuked does not mean de-Navy-d.

But do remember the mantra -- once a nuke - always a nuke.

My darling child graduated Power School over 2 years ago. Then, the washout percent was about 10-15%
Some for academics some for "total gross stupidity"

The Chief of her div made a point of congratulating me on my kids commitment to supporting her classmates.
She was top MM honorman at that grad. She did support her classmates. She did introduce me to one of her classmates who was
"Nuclear waste" -- the man just failed academically, and the Navy had a job for him somewhere else. And meeting with him and talking about future career plans -- the man was on top of it, but bummed - wouldn't you be.

Man I totally hate that "Nuclear Waste" tag -- just gripes my guts

Anyhow - at that same PS grad - there were at least 2 that graduated rated SA - right -- must have been busted a couple paygrades but graduated all the same.

Once a Nuke always a Nuke - take it from there.

Only ways other than failing academic to  get de-nuked are medical, or being a total idiot, or if you want to try for less than honorable.
Or -- the navy needs enlisted Nukes so bad - but --possibly-- some of the officer options.

Anyhow - my kid is somewhere "over there"  in the "fleet" -- likes most of her officers and co-workers -- no idea whether she's re-enlisting.

I have great respect for all who have qualified Nuke -- the people I've met doing it are some of the most calm competent reasonable people I've ever met.

So argue and gripe and bless you all


AND - I still hate that "nuclear waste" tag. - Most of em I'd hire in a minute.

[MoreHooyah]

Appreciate that last response a lot. That's really what I need to hear right now, coming off of another test failure.

I knew this program was tough, but I've never failed anything in my life, and the NDIs all look at me like I'm a complete fool for not understanding the seemingly random numbers and letters on the board. I get the mechanic stuff. I can explain how something over there affects something over here in a system, but they want me to explain so specifically what is happening that I end up losing half the points even if I get the big picture.

Needless to say, I'm frustrated, and I'm going to be spending a lot of meaningless time in that building. There's almost no hope of passing the program at this point, and I'm concerned that the BEQs I've been assigned are now impossible to complete. Isn't failure to finish an ordered BEQ a violation of a direct order? I've never had a military issue of any kind. Never a bad room inspection, uniform inspection, or anything. I'm a good guy who doesn't have what it takes here. I have the utmost respect for you guys doing an awesome job, but I can't do it.

I need out of this program before I start getting punished for not doing my job. I barely sleep. I'm stressed almost all the time. I can't focus in class. I don't have time to workout to relieve any of my stress. It's bad for me. It's not healthy. You guys who made it can't look back and tell me that you did this too because your grades weren't this low. You weren't the class disgrace.

How can I get out of this program without destroying my Navy career?

[jams723]

Appreciate that last response a lot. That's really what I need to hear right now, coming off of another test failure.

I knew this program was tough, but I've never failed anything in my life, and the NDIs all look at me like I'm a complete fool for not understanding the seemingly random numbers and letters on the board. I get the mechanic stuff. I can explain how something over there affects something over here in a system, but they want me to explain so specifically what is happening that I end up losing half the points even if I get the big picture.

Needless to say, I'm frustrated, and I'm going to be spending a lot of meaningless time in that building. There's almost no hope of passing the program at this point, and I'm concerned that the BEQs I've been assigned are now impossible to complete. Isn't failure to finish an ordered BEQ a violation of a direct order? I've never had a military issue of any kind. Never a bad room inspection, uniform inspection, or anything. I'm a good guy who doesn't have what it takes here. I have the utmost respect for you guys doing an awesome job, but I can't do it.

I need out of this program before I start getting punished for not doing my job. I barely sleep. I'm stressed almost all the time. I can't focus in class. I don't have time to workout to relieve any of my stress. It's bad for me. It's not healthy. You guys who made it can't look back and tell me that you did this too because your grades weren't this low. You weren't the class disgrace.

How can I get out of this program without destroying my Navy career?

Do your best, make the mandatory hours with a smile and ask the instructors for help.  Then if you are academically dropped you are out of the program and you can concentrate on the new path.  Always be positive.  That is the inky way "out" of the program that is not negative.

[eaton1981]

Morehooyah,

You need to suck it up. The attitude you're holding right now is not going to get you ANYWHERE in your career, whether it's nuclear or conventional. There is merit to admitting to yourself and others that the program is hard. However, throwing in the towel before they MAKE you throw it in isn't the way to go down.

Let's say you DO make it through A-school. What are you going to do when you get to power school and that new curriculum starts bearing down on you? And then when you go to prototype, where you not only have to learn more "book stuff" but now you have to deal with older sailors who (for the most part) don't want to hear whining about how hard the program is, what are you going to do then? Throw in the towel?

This isn't Hallmark or Disneyland that you're working in. It's the Navy, and to top that, it's the Nuclear Navy. Getting by because you're a nice guy, good at keeping your room clean, able to show up to work on time, and well-groomed isn't going to help you. You either have the intellectual ability from the get go, or you DEVELOP the ability. I was the latter. I had to LEARN to study, and learn to focus on the important parts.

Forming study habits, studying the important stuff, focusing on your studies, and not whining/worrying about what "may become" of you are key.

Based on your last post, it sounds to me that you've given up already. If you truly have, then you might as well not even waste anyone's time on here.

Believe me, there have been many people who have gone through the prototypes in the decades preceding you in just as bad shape "intellectually" as you are now. Attitude is a huge factor when it comes to those guys (and gals) making it through.

As a second point, and perhaps something to motivate you further, you need to realize the VERY REAL possibility of losing your job altogether if you do fail out (i.e. administrative separation).

Sorry that I'm not sugar-coating any of this for you, but these are the facts. Stop wallowing in despair, and get in those books and do your job. If you do fail out, hopefully you can at least say you tried your damnedest.

I, for one, sincerely hope you do NOT fail out though. But again, this isn't happy play time. It's hard work, and not everyone is cut out for it.

I've seen too many young sailors in the last 3 years pull this same self-defeatist bulls*** that you're pulling now. Grow up. Do your job. If you don't pass the tests, at least you still have your dignity and went down fighting. DontgotoNPTU I'm sure will tell you these exact same things, but he tends to be more of a hugger (Burned, Josh).

PM me if you want the OPNAVINST/MILPERSMAN instructions regarding declassification and what not.

Luke

[eaton1981]

Another note...

Don't think that you will be at the end if you go to an Acboard. Myself, and many others on this forum, have seen kids (enlisted and officer alike) retained in the program even after failing their acboards.

Attitude is everything. Having a negative one is the worst thing you can do to yourself right now. Don't give up. Keep trying.

[Fermi2]

Another note...

Don't think that you will be at the end if you go to an Acboard. Myself, and many others on this forum, have seen kids (enlisted and officer alike) retained in the program even after failing their acboards.

Attitude is everything. Having a negative one is the worst thing you can do to yourself right now. Don't give up. Keep trying.

20 years ago that wouldn't have happened which is why the Navy Nuke program is such a joke today.

[jams723]

Another note...

Don't think that you will be at the end if you go to an Acboard. Myself, and many others on this forum, have seen kids (enlisted and officer alike) retained in the program even after failing their acboards.

Attitude is everything. Having a negative one is the worst thing you can do to yourself right now. Don't give up. Keep trying.

Really??? Then why waste time with the board?

[eaton1981]

Good question. It's rare (I saw it twice between 30-40 ac boards in 3 years). I think if the board chairman feels like the kid is a "good guy" and can just barely eek by with a 2.5 gpa, then the kid gets recommended for retention.

I don't really know what the chairman (CO or civilian) is thinking when they recommend retaining a kid who fails. Maybe losses look bad on the fitrep? Maybe it's a new mandate by NR to be more flexible? I don't have the facts, just speculation.

[CitrusMan]

To MoreHooyah.
Hang in there and make it to prototype.
I know that I went to Nuclear Power School (NPS) almost 50 years ago (Yep, 1963) but hard work still applies.
You are right. Some people have the academic skills and some are better at "hands on".
I have seen people with a NPS grade above 3.8 go to prototype and fail to qualify.
The anchor man in my NPS class who graduated NPS with a 2.5 grade went to the D1G prototype in New York and was the first man in his class to qualify at the prototype.
While I had a 3.4 NPS average I found that I was a lot better at "hands on". I was the first in my class to qualify at S3G prototype. (My classmate at D1G with the 2.5 average beat me by over a week).

[jshinevar]

So, I was on so many mandatory hours when I went through A-School and power school that I was there until midnight every night just so I could take Saturday off and then spend all day Sunday there to make my hours.  School was tough.  I don't test well.  However, I kept at it.  My section leader told me that I wasn't going to make it.  Well... I guess I proved him wrong.  When I got to my first boat, I ended up qualifying EWS about a year after qualifying SRO.  Let me tell you, you will do what you want to do.  If you want to be a Nuke, bust your ass as much as you can.  If you still don't make it, you get to hold your head high and say you gave everything.  The more likely scenario is that you will make it and you will see what your hard effort earned you.  It will make you appreciate it even more.

My downfall in the Navy was being fat  and even that, the reason I didn't overcome that is because I let other priorities get in my way.  Remember, you control your own outcome in life.