unsure about the age requirement...

[Grizzly757]

Hi all! New to the forums here. I have searched for an answer about my age question, but all I see are references for enlisted. I am well into the process of joining the navy. I am hoping to be selected for the navy nuclear power program. I'd like to be a submarine officer. Everything looks inline except my age.

I am 29 now with no prior service. I have read some places that I have missed the max age to join, however I have read in others that I can actually join up to 31. Which is true? If I can get a waiver to 31, what are the chances of that? Will it hurt my chances of selection?

Thank you in advance!

[SpaceJustice]

Hi all! New to the forums here. I have searched for an answer about my age question, but all I see are references for enlisted. I am well into the process of joining the navy. I am hoping to be selected for the navy nuclear power program. I'd like to be a submarine officer. Everything looks inline except my age.

I am 29 now with no prior service. I have read some places that I have missed the max age to join, however I have read in others that I can actually join up to 31. Which is true? If I can get a waiver to 31, what are the chances of that? Will it hurt my chances of selection?

Thank you in advance!

While this isn't the direct answer you're looking for, your officer recruiter probably has all the information on that stuff.

[Grizzly757]

That's the thing. He didnt seem 100% sure. He just said in a not so positive way "let's try and see what happens." So at the moment I am assuming I am good, but I have that funny little feeling that there is a gotcha  somewhere that either he or I am missing.

[spikeree]

If you are well into joining the navy at 29 years of age the recruiter should have told you all of these facts! you want to be a nuke sub officer I am assuming you have graduated college and graduate school based on your age? unless the navy is going to pay for all the college loans i would NOT join, find a civilian job.

[Grizzly757]

Yep,  I have both my undergrad and grad degrees completed and have been working as a contractor for the last 12 years (I started here pretty early). I am not hoping to join the Navy to make more money or anything like that. (I actually plan on taking a significant pay cut.)

Being in the Navy has always been something I have wanted to do, but I always convinced myself that I would be giving up to much to join. I finally decided to do something about it, so I began to join the Navy Reserves. After much research and several interviews with active duty folks (most of the nukes) I realized that if I were to join as a reservist, there is a huge chance that I would be restricted in the things I can and can not do. It was after one of the interviews that I was unable to convince myself that I would be giving up too much to join. To me the pros out weighed the cons.

I realize I am coming to the party pretty darn late, but I would rather join and after 6 years if I decide the Navy wasn't for me, leave happily knowing I gave it a try. It would be the "What if's" I will ask myself for the rest of my life.

[cheme09]

I am 29 now with no prior service. I have read some places that I have missed the max age to join, however I have read in others that I can actually join up to 31.

For submarine officer, you're too old already.  You need to be commissioned BEFORE your 29th birthday.  There are waivers available for those with prior service, but you have none.  As far as going officer, you're pretty much left with Intel, Supply, IW maybe, and maybe the professional jobs (JAG, MD, DDS, etc).

[Grizzly757]

Yeah, that's what I was worried about. Thank you for the info.

[spikeree]

From a personal point of view; you will be giving up more than you will ever realize by joining this late in the game! remember the oath only counts when you repeat it in boot camp so you can back out any time prior to that. 

[Grizzly757]

Spikeree,

    Such as what? Not being a prick, it's a serious question. What will joining so late hold me back from? I am trying to get as much info on this as possible.

[Fermi2]

Why is your name Grizzlynuke?

[Grizzly757]

Grizzly is just a nickname, the nuke is misleaing I suppose. It was just to make a name that I would remember for this communities forum, and by no means a way to suggest I currently work with nuclear msterial.  I should probably change it/create a new account.

[Fermi2]

It's a free country but to me Nuke means someone who has qualified something in the nuclear industry.

[Grizzly757]

You are absolutely right. I don't want to mislead anyone. Name is changed. Sorry about that.

[maroon]

For submarine officer, you're too old already.  You need to be commissioned BEFORE your 29th birthday.  There are waivers available for those with prior service, but you have none.  As far as going officer, you're pretty much left with Intel, Supply, IW maybe, and maybe the professional jobs (JAG, MD, DDS, etc).

Not true, 29 is the stated age limit for commissioning, but age waivers can be given up to 31 even if you do not have prior service. 

Since you have already graduated, you may still have a shot at Subs.

[spekkio]

Source?

[spikeree]

Control over your own life!

[HeavyD]

Information directly from MILPERSMAN:

http://www.public.navy.mil/bupers-npc/reference/milpersman/1000/1100Recruitinig/Documents/1131-010.pdf

2.c. Appointment in the Regular Navy is limited by statute to persons able to complete 20 years active commissioned service before age 55 (exceptions are physicians, dentists, chaplains, limited duty officers, and commissioned warrant officers).

d. Notwithstanding initial entry grades listed below, prospective appointees for any officer program, Regular or Reserve, with prior commissioned service on active duty or in an active status, shall be granted entry grade credit under statutes and regulations. Policy governing appointments in Medical Corps, Dental Corps, Medical Service Corps, Nurse Corps, Judge Advocate General Corps, and Chaplain Corps are addressed in applicable SECNAV instructions referenced in "Initial Entry Grades and Limiting Ages," below. Prospective appointees to the line, Supply Corps, and Civil Engineer Corps may be granted 1 day of entry grade credit for each day of prior commissioned service on active duty or in an active status under DOD Directive 1312.3. Entry grade credit shall be used to determine a prospective appointee's entry grade and date of rank. Dates of rank in all cases are as determined by CHNAVPERS under statutes, regulations, or lineal/promotional policies, as applicable.

e. Except where specifically prohibited, Chief of Naval Operations (CNO) (N13) will consider waivers to limiting ages
addressed in "Initial Entry Grades and Limiting Ages," below, for applicants for active duty with prior commissioned service on active duty, and for applicants for inactive duty with prior commissioned service on active duty or in an active status.

4. Initial Entry Grades and Limiting Ages. Except as authorized in "Requirements," above, or except as otherwise
approved by CNO (N1), initial entry grade and limiting ages for an original appointment in the Naval Reserve are as follows:

Nuclear Power School Instructor (1105I), Duty at Naval Reactors (1105NR): Initial entry grade ENS

At least 19 but under 29 at time of interview with Deputy Assistant Secretary for Naval Reactors; no waivers unless specifically authorized by Naval Reactors.

Nuclear Power Surface Warfare (1165), Nuclear Power Submarine Warfare (1175), Engineering Duty Option entering via nuclear power training pipeline (1165/1175): Initial entry grade ENS

At least 19 but under 26 ½; waivers may be considered on a case by case basis by Naval Reactors for those who would not exceed 29 ½ at commissioning.

Federal law requires military members to retire at the age of 55 (waivers, waivers,a nd waivers), so in order to complete 20 years of Active Duty as an officer, you need to be commissioned by your 35th birthday.  BUT, this is only what the federal law requires.  Each branch can, and does, impose their own more restrictive requirements.

Again, ask your officer recruiter.  If they can't answer, find one who can.  This is your future, make sure you are in control of it, at least as much as can be expected when you volunteer to serve.

Best of luck!

[spekkio]

Yea, quoting the statute isn't very useful because the Navy is often more restrictive than that.

Also, there are many flag/general officers at or over the age of 55, including the Army Chief of Staff, Chairman of the CJS, and the Commandant of the Marine Corps. In the current peacetime military, it's really hard to make it that far in under 30 years.

Someone posted on another board that the attrition rate for officers who begin their careers over 27 is much, much higher than those who start under, which is why the Navy caps its age limits lower than statute. I don't have the link to that data, though.

Again, there's a CRNC instruction out there that covers this. When I applied in '08, it was 29 waiverable to 31 with prior service. It may have changed, may not, but last I heard most ORs aren't having much trouble meeting nuke quotas recently.

[Grizzly757]

At this point my recruiter believes I am still good for an age waiver. I guess I will find out if I am good to go if I get an invite for an interview with 08. I'll keep everyone posted.

[maroon]

All the Navy officer program authorizations are at the link below.  They specifically require prior service to get an age waiver for programs like aviation or SWO, but prior service is not required to get an age waiver for NUPOC.

http://www.cnrc.navy.mil/Program-Authorizations.htm

[Grizzly757]

Maroon,

  Awesome! Thank you for hooking me up with this. I am much more positive aboit things now that I have seen it on some sort of offical document.

[HydroDave63]

All the Navy officer program authorizations are at the link below.  They specifically require prior service to get an age waiver for programs like aviation or SWO, but prior service is not required to get an age waiver for NUPOC.

http://www.cnrc.navy.mil/Program-Authorizations.htm

bad dope shipwreck... try opening the NUPOC document

http://www.cnrc.navy.mil/publications/PAs/NEW%20Program%20Authorizations/PA%20100A%20-%20NUPOC8_12.pdf

4.c. Age  AT least 19 but less than 29 years of age at time of commissioning. Waivers may be considered on a case basis for those that would not exceed 31 at commissioning.

[maroon]

bad dope shipwreck... try opening the NUPOC document

http://www.cnrc.navy.mil/publications/PAs/NEW%20Program%20Authorizations/PA%20100A%20-%20NUPOC8_12.pdf

4.c. Age  AT least 19 but less than 29 years of age at time of commissioning. Waivers may be considered on a case basis for those that would not exceed 31 at commissioning.

Exactly, that statement proves me right.  Nowhere does it say that you have to have prior enlisted service to get an age waiver up to 31.  (Read the SWO one and see how it compares)

And, I personally know one 30 year old non-prior who was accepted for subs this year...

[HeavyD]

The one thing to keep in mind is that virtually everything is waiverable; IF the people who are responsible for generating and pushing the waiver through feel that the individual is worth the effort required.

As for the flag officers and high ranked enlisted personnel (i.e. Fleet/Force Master Chiefs/Command Sergeant Majors, etc), I am willing to bet that age waivers are already in place in their records.  To go along with that, anyone who wishes to remain on Active Duty past 30 years of service is required to submit a waiver request.  For some, if not all, flag rank officers this is most likely a formality taken care of by their staff.  The DNR comes to mind, given the unique length of their tour.

One other piece of advice; being an officer in the United States Navy is about leading men and women (not currently on most subs, but in the near future).

Many officer candidates simply see being an officer as an opportunity to make more money or have a higher retirement.  Those were the ones that were the biggest pain in the @$$ to deal with. 

Managing programs, evaluating personnel performance, coordinating the work of your division with the other divisions, seeing past your own division as to how what your people are doing fits into the command meeting it's mission, these are the kinds of things that your CO, XO and Chief are going to expect out of you.  Figuring our when the difference between the sailor who simply needs some additional guidance to improve their performance and the sailor who is a cancer to your division; deciding NOT to write a Report Chit against a sailor because of some genuine mitigating circumstances.

Best of luck and thank you for volunteering to serve!

[Grizzly757]

HeavyD,

   Another great post and I couldn't agree with you more. I have lead a technical team for many years now and have always strived to ensure I was fair and worked harder than the hardest working person on my team. I think the most valuable thing I will get out of being an officer is seeing sailors under my charge succeed in their personal goals and motivating those who have the talent but lack said motivation.

This is truly the most exciting thing I have ever thought about doing with my life, and although I wouldn't consider my accomplishments to date to be small or unimportant,  serving the navy as officer would most certainly take the cake.