MARSSIM Discussion Group

[Rennhack]

I have started a new MARSSIM Discussion Group here.  Feel free to exchange ideas.

[Rennhack]

I have created a MARSSIM website, to help people find MARSSIM information and share resources.

If you have any suggestions for the new MARSSIM site, feel free to post them in this forum.

Check out the MARSSIM site here:

http://www.marssim.com

[alphadude]

In association with MARSSIM, VSP training should be taken also (two days B. Pulsipher).
COMPASS is very, very  easy to use so not a lot of training is needed there.

"Managing Uncertainty with Systematic Planning for Environmental Decision Making" taught by Sebastian Tindal is an exellent training class to take in association with VSP. Both of these are free (VSP and Managing Uncertainty) and paid for by the DOE.  An understanding on the management of the DQO process will give the MARSSIM user the background information and insight on the process that MARSSIM provides.  Sebastian believes in the incremental sampling process and I think he does an excellent job on why it should be used for scoping and assessments.

Remember 59 samples is the magic number and 100 samples will work wonders!

[Rennhack]

Remember 59 samples is the magic number and 100 samples will work wonders!

That depends on your DCGL's and area factors.  Many projects can take 12-15 samples.

Thank you for the insight on the training.  I hope others read this thread and the MARSSIM discussion picks up.

Check out the MARSSIM site here:

http://www.marssim.com

[alphadude]

Wellll not really.  Its more convoluted than the DCGL and area factors.  Hence the hint on taking the additional training. If you notice after a while with MARSSIM techniques you will usually have no more than 25 samples for any MARSSIM project. 12-15 samples is typical, (seems a little low-look at the stdev of the scoping and MARSSIM results to see how they agree) and is not really dependent on DCGL, but the risk you wish to assume (alpha and beta), distribution design,  variability, LLD, LBGR etc.  The 100 samples will invoke the central limits theorm thus reducing the need for statistical schemes.  59 samples will provide a nice distribution showing that most sites are log normal and should be planned accordingly.  The 12-15 samples you mention are the end of the road testing that results from limiting the decision unit size, adequate scoping surveys (lots of samples), limiting critical values, and a DCGL well below any level of concern for dose to the population.

[jocro]

Good thread.  Are you guys using the RESRAD program linked to MARRSIM or stand-alone?  I'm not very experienced with either and the suggested training is going to be HELPFUL....

[Rennhack]

Good thread.  Are you guys using the RESRAD program linked to MARRSIM or stand-alone?  I'm not very experienced with either and the suggested training is going to be HELPFUL....

I think you mean RESRAD linked to COMPASS

http://web.ead.anl.gov/marssim/doc/docs/ANL_EAD_TM_02_04.pdf
RESRAD Connection for Facilitating MARSSIM Analysis: An Illustration of Applying the OpenLink Concept (1 MB) ANL/EAD/TM-02-04. The focus of this work is to more tightly integrate RESRAD and COMPASS used in MARSSIM final status survey design.

[alphadude]

go to the Hanford DQO page, lots of interesting stuff there

[mars88]

one thing i do not understand after reading MARSSIM.com--exactly what are the dcgl's and where are they found?  the website had no specifics on these.  i was recently interviewing with the project manager of a job in california and he said, "the dcgl used to be (something pci/g) and now it's 1pci/g, as you know".  of course i nodded wisely, but actually, no, i didn't know.  how does anyone know?

btw, this job is for at least 6 mos, and they are still looking for a rad engineer or chp (i am up for the tech job).  if interested, let me know. 

[wlrun3@aol.com]

   
"For each contaminant, guideline values for residual activity on building surfaces and in contaminated soil are established. In MARSSIM terminology, these guideline values are "Derived Concentration Guideline Levels," or DCGLs. These numerical standards may be obtained through site specific computer modeling, through use of the generic NRC code DandD or established by negotiation with the applicable regulatory agency."

Basic Radiation Protection Technology, Gollnick, 5th ed., p 791

[alphadude]

they are values or amounts of rad material that a subject could injest and remain below some limit  10 mr or 25 etc. factors include the use of the property, pathways etc.  and why would you know some sites DCGLs ?  thats is not some common knowledge thing- what scenario did they use, what has the state required, the stakeholders, what rad material is the DCGL for and so on... its in their D&D plan but unless you have read that DCGLs are not some off the shelf value.

[alphadude]

I think you are in the gray region now MARSSIM

[Llama]

Er....What's a DeGel
Sorry Mike I just had to do it

[toz]

Llama, I think DeGel is what you use to De-Spike your hair.  So you can't ask Mike what it is, he doesn't have any.

[Rennhack]

[Radconpro]

Does anyone have the formula to calculate the scan MDC in pCi/g for depleted uranium usaing a 2" by 2" NaI detector???

Thanks in advance!!

[Rennhack]

I have the formula, you'll have to plug-in your own values.

[Radconpro]

Email me the formula if you can...radconpro@aol.com

Thanks....by the way great MARSSIM website!! Keep up the good work!

[Rennhack]

Keep reminding me if I don't get to it right away.

I have a nice excel spread sheet that does it for you.

[Radconpro]

Please email that spreadsheet to : radconpro@aol.com

Thanks in advance!!

[Laning]

Hey Dan,...I can make you that spreadsheet too...on second thought, why not just hire me and let me work from home buddy 'ol pal!!  :-)

I hope you're doing well.

Uncle Eddie

[Radconpro]

What up Eric?  Go Flyers!!

[Rennhack]

Try the attached spread sheet.

[Rennhack]

Attached to this is a DQA sheet I use to make my charts.

You need to enable macros for it to work.

[Rennhack]

People have been asking me for the procedures referenced in the spreadsheets I shared.  They are Yankee Rowe procedures, and I don't think I have permission to share them.  However, the procedures are mostly a clone of the MARSSIM manual, so just look up the appropriate section in the manual, and you should be fine.