Ramifications of DEP drop-out.

[smoothtoaster]

I have been having serious second thoughts about joining the Navy at this point in my life. What are the ramifications of dropping out of DEP? Would it prevent me from joining as a Nuke later in life? I know that I can't really ask my recruiter about this and get a straight answer.

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smoothtoaster

[Fermi2]

My best guess, and this is only a guess, is yes if you drop DEP now you might as well forget about trying to enlist as a nuke later.

Mike

[ChiefRocscooter]

While I hav'nt been on recruiting duty since 1996 (thus the answer maybe somewhat dated) no it will not prevent you from getting in later.  The Navy would be foolish to slam the door on dep attrites (that is what we call them).  We used to have plenty of them all the time, to get back in you will have to get a DEP attrite waiver (granted by recruiting district CO (so you can see they have vested instrest in letting you in).  The problem would be if you had some other waiver you had to go through to get in in the first place.  Then there might be delays and issues with that, but honsetly I do not think that will be a problem.  If nucs were dropping out of the trees then you would be out of luck but since they have a grada time finding them you should be ok.

Now if you do not mind , what do you think now is not the right time?  What reasons do you have for changing your plan?  What better plan do you now have ?  Cold feet are common and most of the time it is a mistake to back out! Ussually there was a reson that took you to the Navy-- what was it ?

Just trying to help.  Let me know (via PM if you would feel better) if I can help you.

Rob

[taterhead]

The first time I started the enlistment process, the recruiter took me to MEPS the night before (actually to a hotel close by).  I took the ASVAB, and was supposed to go to MEPS the next morning.

I had second thoughts overnight, and intentionally missed the bus to MEPS the next day.

My recruiter had to come get me and drive me home, over an hour away.  He was kinda pissed.

To answer your question, considering how we are well below our prescribed manning on my ship, I couldn't think that you would be turned away if you had a change of heart.

[Navy2B]

Ask your recruiter anyway. Ask specifically about what to do if you want to get back in if you've dropped. There's usually a written proceedure for everything. Heck, you might even 'more ready' later in life than you are now. I certainly wasn't ready to join any military at 18. I'm almost 23 now, and finally have my head on straight. I wouldn't have 5 years ago.

If you do truly wish to drop however, it would be courteous to write a letter to the CO of your MEPs station, (don't have to know his/her name, just to CO), requesting to be taken out of the DEP program, with a stated reason (like higher education, search about.com for a list) . There's little reason they wouldn't grant your request, and so long as you haven't taken your oath on the day you ship out, there's no reprecussions except some delay when trying to re-enter the same service. Waiver delay was already mentioned (paperwork & time issue, nothing major).

However, if you need time, get time. Cold feet and second thoughts are one thing. Serious investigative doubt is another. How long are you do you have DEP left? Got time to ask yourself real questions? I still have 5 months, and plan on physical training and enjoying life up through it.

[smoothtoaster]

For the record I just turned 21. I started thinking about the Navy because I had screwed up much of what I had done in the past (college, work, college again) and I saw it as a way to get a leg up. I was thinking about regrets I have from earlier in life and one of them was not going to the Naval Academy when I had the chance. So I thought, why not just join the Navy and they will help me get my act together. I started looking into it and discovered the nuke program and decided to go talk with a recruiter, went to MEPS, took ASVAB and scored 99 and I joined. I joined July 8th and I ship on Nov. 1st.

Now what would be my military career has nothing to do with what I want to do with the rest of my life (I dont think). While I have a scientific mind, what I have been wanting to do is set design and carpentry (for theatre) or go to culinary school. I had been thinking that if I went into the Navy then I would use it to help me finish school and save up enough money to pretty much do whatever I wanted when I got out (e.g. open a restaurant, finish school for theatre, do other things) and all would be well and good. Lately I have been thinking about all sorts of things that I have been wanting to do that I couldn't if I joined. Things like travelling and backpacking and touring bands and just general free-spirited messing around. Part of it may be that I am not ready to grow up just yet.

I joined and ever since have been struggling with trying to really make a decision before Nov. 1st. I do think that I will serve in the Navy at some point. Mostly because it is one of the few avenues left open to me to really do something with my life. But I am starting to feel that if I choose to go now that I will have serious regrets about not doing some other things first. I reasoned it by saying I would do those things later, but I don't think I actually would, joining means growing up a bit and becoming a responsible member of society and I would like to do some things that I would not be able to do in such a role. So I have been thinking that dropping out of DEP would be the best idea and to come back to the Navy later.

I would love some input on this. Brutal and mean is fine by me as long as it is honest.

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smoothtoaster

[ChiefRocscooter]

As you will note by the time stamp it is late and I have little time right now (test tomorrow that I have been studying all day), but I will come back tomorrow and give you full "blast" (just kidding), or should I say a more reasoned questioning!  But for now let me ask you where do you think you would be if you had just gone in the Navy right out of HS, about just over half way thru 6yrs if you were nuc and almost out if you were 4yo.  You really have to decide what it is you want from the Navy?? . Is it money$$, money for school$$$, fun or some where inbetween.  Cold feet are ok but there is a reason you signed up what massive change occured n your life since that makes the reason not valid??  Just thing to ponder... give us some answers and we'll give you more to think about.

Rob

[Samabby]

I don't think that you should join. PM for my direct reason why not.

[tigger]

I was in the navy long ago. I personally did not enjoy it. I had wanted to go nuke, they said women couldn't, then 2 months into bootcamp they allowed women to go nuke. I grew up with nuclear power all my life through my family. It is what I wanted to do. And it is what I am doing now.
You said you want to travel, you want to go to school, you want money to open a restraunt, well, a couple years ago the reenlistment bonus was $60,000 for nukes. You can get the GI Bill, not sure what it pays now, but the last time I used it, I was getting $1300 a month to take classes. Or if you take classes while in the navy, they will pay a portion of it, don't remember what it was. You can travel. Being on a ship takes you to many places around the world. Some of my friends have been to Austrailia, Italy, France, Greece, Japan, the list goes on. Ask your recruiter where each of the areas (east coast--- west coast) boats travel to. Ask him to name a couple of the ports for each area.
It is a big commitment to make, and before you make it, be sure it is what you want to do. Nuke is 6 years for the initial enlistment.
Good luck to you.

[ChiefRocscooter]

Hav'nt heard a response from smoothtoaster and this is one where your input is paramount!  I will be first to admit it is not for everyone but, I would also insist that almost everyone would benefit from a few years in the Navy, maybe not as a nuke in your case but the Navy like the world is big and there is much to do and see.  You live life by making choices some good, some bad, but all must be made.  I have never met anyone who was not a fu((*&^ up that said being in was bad for them, maybe not right but anyone who has or needs to get his head on right benefits from it.  Even those who hated it had goos times too.  As for doing it later?? hey you are twenty one now your life is over 25% done now, you are old enough now cause unless you plan on making a career out of it you will want to do your time and get out in your mid twentys.  You will see the would then come home ready to take it on!

Good Luck!
Rob     

[smoothtoaster]

For some reason, everytime I sit down to start writing in this topic my thoughts on the whole situation scatter. Recently one of my issues is how much the navy will change who I am and how much the navy will allow me to be myself.

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smoothtoaster

[ChiefRocscooter]

Ok that is a valid concern for someone who has never been in.  The Navy will not change you into anything you do not want to become.  It will give you the chance to become what you want if you have the determiniation to become it.  Self discipline can not be forced upon someone, they must develop it themselves.  The Navy will open the door but you must walk thru.  As for being yourself that is up to you, conformace to the norm is a requirement to succed in or out of the Navy.  The personal standards the Navy expects you to up hold while you are in are not so different from what any company who is foing to pay you that kind of money expects!  They are also the thing that is going to open doors for you when you get out (or retire).  The training will help you land jobs but the personal traits one develops as a successful sailor (marine,soldier, or airman) are often just as important. 

Lastly remember the reason you even went down this road is you where not happy with who you were and where you were at in life!  Maybe you want this change!

Rob   

[tigger]

About your coment on the Navy changing you... The Navy changed my outlook on life. I was a spoiled rotten kid who had everything handed to me. I chose to go in the military so that I could prove to myself I could stand on my own two feet and not have it handed to me. I had the opportunity to go to college, all exspenses paid. But I think had I chosen that route, my life would be very different than it is now. I would still be that spoiled kid. I wouldn't have had to have the responsiblilities placed on me that I had. I would have been at all the parties, ignored my classes, and probably not done very well. I have since had to pay for my education ( got the GI Bill), and make my way in life. I have a lot more respect for what I have earned than i ever did for all tht I had been given. The Navy also taught me not to take anything for granted.
So, did it change who I was, in a way. I gained respect, for myself, for others, and for what I had. But did it change my inner person. No, it did not. I am still a strong minded person with strong morals.
Every life experience has something to be gained. It all depends on how you look at it. If you chose to take away the life lesson, then it was a great decission.
The hardest part for me in the Navy was boot camp. And not the physical aspect. It was the mental part that I found the hardest. I wasn't used to beig told what to do, how to do or when to do it. I was trusted at home, so I made my on choices, and right or wrong had to deal with them.
It is a big commintment and taking the time to ask questions and ponder the answers BEFORE you go in is a  wise choice. We had several in boot camp that decided they didn't really want to be there. And it was a lot harder to back out at that point. The way they went about it, 2 got admin discharges and 1 got a less than honorable discharge (forgot the real name for it).
Again, I wish you luck.

[smoothtoaster]

well, ive decided to go ahead and join. thank you for all your assistance, this place has been a great resource.

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smoothtoaster

[ChiefRocscooter]

Glad to hear that!  Hope thing work out for, and I am sure they will as long as you take the PMA approach to things.

Good luck and continue to look for answers here, most of the time you will get the straight scoop from us who could care less (rethorically) what you do with your life, but want to help people in general.

Rob

[seprintz]

I am in a similar situation. Graduating from college here in December, I just turned 23 and I KNOW I wasn't ready for the military when I was 18. I just posted in a different forum, but this one seems more appropriate. How do I get out of DEP and make everybody (primarily at the recruiting office) as happy about it as possible.

No major changes in my life that make me want to back out, but I have had a recent boost of confidence in myself. I was joining the NAVY out of fear. Fear that I wasn't good enough to get a job, that with my GPA nobody else would accept me etc... Now however I have more confidence and would like to persue a carreer in the civilian market, I don't want to join the NAVY because I am afraid of "real life" if I join it needs to be because I want to join the NAVY.

Here is a bit from my previous post (in a different thread):

I am graduating from collegege here in December and have a ship date of March 5 as AECF, my recruiter had the ball rolling on getting me in the Nuke program and now it would seem as if the ball has dropped. She used to call me nearly once a day and I haven't heard from her in over a week now. I have interviews scheduled at local software firms where I submitted my resume to (trying to keep my options open), I am the only son in my family (heard that it mattered in the military), I don't want to go in AECF, and I am getting cold feet about the Nuke program as well. The level of intelligence and professionallism at the recruiting office has made me really afraid of going into the NAVY, I don't think I can handle it if this is what it is going to be like once I am in.

My question to you guys is this, what can I do to get out of DEP? (aside from just not showing up on March 5th) I want to do things as well as I can and not burn my bridges so to speak, not to mention I want to avoid any potential legal ramifications by breaking my initial contract ans swearing in.

If this has already been discussed then please point me to the most current thread. Additionally, I would like to thank everybody that posts on this forum, it has been a wealth of information and has given me some great insight into what it means to be a NAVY nuke.

[Rad Sponge]

Your story's sad to tell, a teenage ne'er-do-well

Most mixed up non-delinquent on the block,
Your future's so unclear now, what's left of your career now?

DEP drop-out, no graduation day for you
DEP drop-out, missed your ship and flunked math, too.

Well at least you could have taken time to wash and clean your clothes up
After spending all that time to have the recruiter fix your records up

DEP drop-out, signed the name and shirked the oath
DEP drop-out, got all the time now to loaf...

Baby get moving (better get moving), why keep your feeble hopes alive
What are you proving (what are you proving)?
You've got the dream, but not the drive

Baby don't sweat it (don't sweat it), you're not cut out to hold the job
Better forget it (forget it), who wants their PMS done by a slob?

Now I've called the shot, go smoke some pot, I really gotta fly

Gotta be goin' to that bootcamp in the sky

DEP drop-out, go back to highschool
DEP drop-out, go back to highschool

[ChiefRocscooter]

Well said (sung??) JMK. 
Listen, seprintz
IF YOUR scared say so, sounds like you are afraid of the Navy not real life, cause I got news for you partner the Navy is just part of this big trip called "Real Life"!  It sounds like your looking for us to tell you how to renig on a perfectly legal contract, well in my book thats a no go!  Stop trying to back out because you are afraid that it might be hard! 
If you think what you saw in your recruiting office is the Navy then maybe you are not bright enough to be a Nuke anyway.  How many Nukes have you met? (Heres a hint, they only let one or two go to each of the recruiting districts, they have way to many others things they need them for besides recruiting and considering they are getting Big fat SRB's it would be a waste to put lots of them on recruiting!)
As for not being good enough to get a job, and worring that no one would accept your poor GPA let me also point out that they Navy is full of shap guys who came from families that could never send them to college and so they joined they Navy instead.  I would take them at a rate of two to one for every "I barely made it through some Bull$@!t degree program and now I want a big money job!".  AND I got news for you so would most employers!
Listen I have no problem with you chickening out on your country, but DO NOT EVER QUESTION THE INTELLIGENCE OR PROFESSIONALISM LET ALONE SAY THAT THEY ARE NOT IN THE REAL WORLD BECAUSE THIER WORLD IS A WHOLE LOT MORE REAL THAN YOURS!  THEY UNDERSTAND REAL COMMITMENT, HONOR, AND COURAGE! YOU OBVIOUSLY DO NOT!!!

23 Years ago (when the better part of you ran down ....) I joined the Navy because I wanted a better life than my parents could afford to give me!  In 45 days I will check out and go "home" with a better life than I ever thought I could have had.  I have my degree, made lots of money, saw the world, and any company out there that I choose to work for knows what they get when they hire me, A Proven Pro who can get the job done because I have already done it!
What pray tell do they get with you, poor student (you said it ), lacking in comminment (ok that is plain to see ) , oh and scared of the hard things in life , well now I guess you can sit back and continue to sip on that liquid boost of courage because they should be beating a path to your door any time now!!

The only true failure come when you fail to try, and you not even trying to live up to your word!

PS. The only son thing only applies if you are the last remaining son because the other died fighting for their country.  Do not think this will apply for you becasue if you...... well thats enough time wasted on you

[ChiefRocscooter]

Sorry to everyone else for my last post I get a little hot when people think the Navy is not the "real world" and question the intelligence of those who serve, like they are some intelligence being above that sort of thing.  See there I go again...

Sorry about the running down the Le. thing too, I am fairly sure that was a over the top but well, like I said SORRY.

Rob

[seprintz]

I posted in here because I wanted to be on topic in this thread. Additionally, I was not trying to suggest that the navy is not a part of the "real world" just that the navy (and the military in general) is a "different world" than what I am used to. One thing, for example, that the navy can provide that the "the real world" cannot is a guaranteed job. I can sign up, go through meps, sign a contract, and take an oath and I have guaranteed employment on my ship day, easy as pie, no hard work involved. To get a job in the "real world" it requires putting out resumes, interviewing, and impressing the interviewers. For me, going through MEPS was like waiting in line at the DMV to get my drivers liscence renewed, nothing hard, no suprises, and a guarantee that what I get at the end of the line is what I expected when I got in line.

I am not trying to insult anybody here... I just wanted a straightforward answer to a straightforward question. I was not opening up a symposium on why YOU are so much better than ME, having never met me, or known that I am an Eagle Scout, came from a family with little money, payed my own way through college, I know what hard work is (going to school full time and working 36/42 hours a week is hard work) I am glad to see that you feel as though you are well qualified to judge me.

Overall I have been most impressed with the quality of posts on this forum, but at the moment I am sadly dissapointed. What I want, as I stated earlier, is an answer to a question, from a qualified individual.

I feel as though the appology is a sign of good faith, and I am grateful you posted it. Nevertheless, in my defense, I don't believe you have met the individuals at the recruiting office here nor are you aware of the interaction I have had with these individuals. I suppose instead of calling them "unprofessional" I should have just called them bold faced liers? I was making an attempt to be polite. I can't count the number of times she said "I need you to come in for about 30 minutes" and an hour and a half later she is continuing to hand me paperwork to fill out, at which point I need to tell her enough is enough and I am getting tired of this crap. I don't have a problem with paperwork, I like doing things the way they need to be done, but if you know something is going to take two hours, then schedule an appointment with me under the pretense that it will be two hours.

[ChiefRocscooter]

Ok please reread the last post I made it was not to you it was to everyone else!  I may have gone a little over the top on you but I am in no way sorry for it!! The apology was for the sake of those I may have offended with my little rant.
You, an individual who plans to not honor your commitment to your country because you no longer "feel" like it, well to you I have no reason to say sorry to or anything else for that matter.

But unfortunately I can't keep my mouth shut sometimes so here are a few parting gifts!
In order of what you wrote:
1  If you think "joining and becoming a Nuke (or any other AECF) is a matter of standing in line to become one, well once again you show a lack of thought.  All you did is "stand in line" to get into school to become one.  I could go on about how hard it is or the fail to qualify/drop rate from ASVAB to MEPS to BOOTCAMP to A school to Nuke school to Prototype to Fleet, but instead let's just say I have seen plenty of college grad who could not make it thru.
2   I never said I was better than you! If you infer that from what I wrote well then maybe it tells you something about yourself.  All I did was list facts that an employer would be able to use in evaluating your worth as an employee.
3  No I am not judging you because were I able to judge you I would find you guilty of  attempting to break a legal binding contract in an immoral and unethical way.  I am however qualified to evaluate you because as Nuke who spent four years on recruiting duty I have seen your like many times.  While you may not like it my evaluation of you is based on a comparison on those who have honor and those who do not.
4  I am more than qualified to answer your question, as was JMK and many others here, but in your case to do so would lower us to your integrity lacking level!
5 What did you expect when talking with recruiters?  Go spend some time in the ARMY office and see how they do business.  Welcome to your "real" world, for the most part they are trying to do a hard job that is not their true specialty and most struggle but get through, some lie but most are fair with people.  This a whole lot better than what you are going to see in the rest of the "real" world most especially if you get into sales!!

Ok I ran out of fingers so now I have to stop, but let me close by saying you can be sadly disappointed all you want at these posts but in reality the only people who should be disappointed are your parent.  They failed to raise a son who is willing to live up to his commitments and would then bring dishonor on others by asking them to help him with his dishonorable acts! 

The Chief

[Rad Sponge]

You just have to man-up on this issue.

You cannot go into this trying to keep everyone happy. Its your life. You won't be a concern to the recruiters after you leave, they have a job to continue.

You probably won't be making any friends in the recruiters office. You are counting against his quota and you basically wasted his time. That's just the way it is.

Better stop this now before you actually find yourself in a situation with no painless outs.

Also, you probably won't get much sympathy here since we are all active duty or former nukes, but I don't think any of the posts were rude.

Except maybe mine, but for some reason  I got that Frankie Avalon Grease song in my head and just decided it was kinda funny.

[stormgoalie]

After much thinking, I don't want put my foot in an orafice, and I would offer only one small piece of advice.  Unless you feel that you were somehow coerced in to signing your contract you should own up to your decision to sign up and follow through with it.  Speaking from personnal experience I had a similar decision to make while in DEP.  I got offered a full scholorship to a great institution just a couple of months after signing my contract.  I sat down with my parents and had a long discussion about what I felt.  I made a decision based up the value system my parents taught me and stuck with my contract.  Do I regret my decision, no, I waited and went to college after my term with the Navy was over (I wasnt a nuke so it was only 4 years).  Did my recruiter tell me the whole truth and nothing but the truth, no, you have to remember that if you don't ask they won't tell.  You needed to be quite specific in your questioning, then if you do find out that they lied right to your face you have a beef with them, otherwise if you didnt ask the right question how can you expect the right answer.  Remember you are an adult and will have to live with your decision whatever that may be and taking what seems to be an easy path now may lead to difficulty later.

Enough from me anyway as you will do whatever you choose.

Cheers,
Jim Rodgers
RP Supervisor
 

[HydroDave63]

Now however I have more confidence and would like to persue a carreer in the civilian market, I don't want to join the NAVY because I am afraid of "real life" if I join it needs to be because I want to join the NAVY.

Joining the Armed Forces is a lot like eloping....if it doesnt seem like a good match long-term, then it's probably best to step back and do something different.

One of THE smartest reactor operators that I ever worked with, was harvesting 600 acres of soybeans and restoring Minn-Moline tractors 4 yrs ago. Having "4 yrs on the USS SwimmingFish" is not a prerequisite to success.

[wlrun3@aol.com]

   if you don't have an exit strategy and you sense something bad... think of the potentials of a really bad mistake...

   the difference between parris island and harvard, looking back four decades, is extreme...then again...

   the purpose of a ship, or a soul, is not realized in port...