Environmental group pushes for return of San Onofre nuclear plant

[GLW]

.....you still really didn't answer my question fully,....

I thought I did:

.....over in the SONGS thread, from many moons ago there was a post, a dead on post, at that time and for that place:

Simple, we are professionals and realize this is a BUSINESS. If a plant is uneconomical to run then it should be shut down, it's no different than any facility.
SONGs, Crystal River, Kewaunee became uneconomical. Eventually you have to decide if by the time you solve the issues at these facilities and it costs xxx dollars but you'll only earn back XX dollars is it worth it? Well when you are a utility who has to pay a dividend to shareholders then NO it is not worth it. It's pure economics. I got news for you, the utilities are not in business to make ecologically sound energy, they went years without doing so. THEY ARE IN THE BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY!

there has been a change to this status quo as discussed over in this thread:

N.Y. regulators approve clean energy standard with nuclear subsidies

https://www.nukeworker.com/forum/index.php/topic,41771.msg195542.html#msg195542

the change is profound vis a vis this statement:

the utilities are not in business to make ecologically sound energy, they went years without doing so. THEY ARE IN THE BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY!

New York State has determined a going forward path where utilities WILL make ecologically sound energy and those same utilities WILL make money as they do it,...

the cost will be absorbed by the consumer,...

all that is left for the utility is to take the money on the table or walk away from it,...

New York State has already levied the cost for this onto my monthly burden,...

as a shareholder, the utility better dam well take the money and return me my dividend,...

I would like to offset some of that 24 dollars per year with continued dividends, but that is all Phyrric,...

how this new paradigm plays out in other states is yet to be seen,...

as for SONGS?!?!?!?

SONGS broke SONGS, there was no will amongst any of the players, including the greens, to repair and rerun SONGS, and now SONGS is past the point of no responsible return at any level,...

as for this thread: I find it disturbingly amusing that the greens espouse pie in the sky alternatives at every turn with no regard or true knowledge of the comprehensive cycles and impacts that their green dreams entail,...

There's not much more to add about SONGS except maybe this, also from some years ago:

It's because you probably aren't aware of all the history here. Your reaction is analogous to someone watching the "Intervention" TV show and asking "why is everyone being so mean to Uncle Bob the Meth Head? Why not just give him a second chance and start over fresh?" Whereas the family (The Nuclear Industry in this case) has been putting up with Uncle Bob's $hit for years and are fed up, so they are turning their back and cutting him off.

San Onofre has been on the bottom of every Industry and Regulatory Performance Metric scale for over a decade now. They have spent millions of dollars on high visibility, Enterprise Wide, Human Performance Improvement Initiatives and failed miserably. Despite having one of the largest, bloated staffing levels of ANY Nuclear plant they have continued the downward spiral. And they have a consistent track record of botching their high-dollar, complex, major capital replacement projects – the SG's being only the latest example.

No one here is happy with the events that have come to pass. But just as in the analogy above, everyone must at some point finally face the consequences of their actions. Fair or Unfair, history is finally catching up to SONGS.

as far as a different outcome in places like Georgia, well I have espoused a consistent assessment for many years with particular regard to new construction:

"east of the Pecos and south of the Mason Dixon line",...

c'mon you've been reading my posts long enough,...

New York is currently willing to subsidize nukes for a few decades, but the Empire State is in no mood to build new nukes,...

California does not seem to be in the market for either,...

[hamsamich]

Ok my bad.  I thought you said the Songs decision was based 100% on financials only.  Which surprised me.  Never mind then.

[Ksheed]

I only said it would be more likely songs would have stayed open if the greens weren't adding additional pressure.  You have to read my post.  I know what songs did to songs. I talked to one of the engineers and many of the RP techs that worked out there.  And I didn't nickname him so don't direct that one at me, you still really didn't answer my question fully,  your post is just as off topic as the rest of us.

Sorry about the Groot stuff but the guy has earned his nickname not due to his sturdiness in the nuke industry but due to his incessant one-track-mind posting with added somewhat veiled insults.  We all know that financials are important in the energy sector, but rerun talks to most people on this forum like we/they are idiots and doesn't add value with most of his posting.  Time and time again (you can go back and re-read his posts for hundreds of examples) he insults people with back-handed or direct assumptions that they are idiots, lazy, unfit...the list goes on.  And some of them are.  But you can't read a post and assume the worst about people every time, which he does.  He has called others worse than "groot" plenty of times, and however awesome he is as an operator and knowledgeable about the industry, he treats people like dirt on this forum and has been doing it for a long time.  Like I said, he should take a long look at himself and why he comes here to post.  This is a nuclear forum and we would like to have a discussion.  Pros and Cons yes, same exact post and under your breath name calling, no.  Rerun posts like a second grader time and time again and I am sick of it.

Much truth here as well.