Savannah River Site Per Diem

[stownsend]

Kinda sounds like the days of ARC back in the mid 90's

They were kiting checks in the late 80's.The site coordinator at VY would come around and say you,you and you ,you're check isn't going to clear the bank. Then tell you it's not his problem to straighten it out with the home office.Each week it would be something new.Glad they went bye-bye.

[Laundry Man]

They were kiting checks in the late 80's.The site co-ordinator at VY would come around and say you,you and you ,you're check isn't going to clear the bank. Then tell you it's not his problem to straigten it out with the home office.Each wek it would be something new.Glad they went bye-bye.

Wasn't that fun Steve!  Only reason I worked for ARC was VY.  My favorite was when we were tossed off site for two weeks while they got the security clearance stuff cleaned up.  Dicko, Louie, and myself played a lot of racquetball those two weeks.  If I recall correctly, Leacho told ARC that we would all be paid for the time out of the plant and it would not be billable.
LM

[Roadhorse]

Whatever you do, don't ever work for Weirich, Inc.  They have not paid anyone at SRS PD since October. Yes, they are three months behind.  Bob Weirich wants to blame it on SRNS, but I think he doesn't have the money to operate his business so he takes himself a free loan from employees.  Same with 401k.  After a 401k deduction is taken from your check, it is months before he deposits it into your 401k account.  I know people he owes $20,000+ between 401k and PD.

4 months behind on payroll?  Come on.  What a lie.  Not true.  I know for a fact they are never behind on their payroll.  Can't since the IRS would be after them for payroll taxes.  Better check your facts before telling lies especially about payroll.  Fixin2 sounds like a former employee who was fired by the lab.  When he has some employees who've been with him all along, even further back for as long as 10-15 years, they must be doing something right.  Until they lost their contract at LANL, he was the largest sub out there.  Does that sound like a company nobody wants to work for?  Fixin2 needs to stop spreading lies.

Guess if you can't say something nice, some people lie.  How do you sleep at night?

[Fixin2]

Where does anyone say Weirich / WCSI is 4 months behind on payroll?

Fact: Weirich / WCSI is currently four months behind expense reimbursement.  October 2010 expense reimbursement was the last received. 

Fact: If there is a 401k deduction from your check this Friday, it will show up in your 401k account three or four months from now.

Since payroll was brought up, Weirich / WCSI has not been on time with that 100 percent of the time either.   

If Mr. Weirich, aka Roadhorse, wants to jump in again, we'll expand into the next topic.

[peterpan]

As one of the latest musketeers caught in the cross hairs of the per diem controversy and "pass the responsibility buck" saga.. I am compelled to...!!!@#$%$#^&!!.....comment... without the assistance of council...on what I initially thought was a non issue, random audit inquiry.
Good bye never neverland...welcome to the grown up land of...??   I find myself at a loss for words that could truly encompass this land of..Oz. aka..SRNS  aka..WSRC**.. according to the per diem eligibility certificate(s) dated  3/1/93** provided to me by  the large Canadian firm that recruited me to support ARRA.
I would be wise to stop here and save the closing for the Aiken Standard.
Your correct, two (2) issues are being argued; but with even a quick glance at the revisions made to 8/1/2008 SRNS Travel Compensation Schedule, now revision 2. it's clear the per diem questions aren't IRS based issues.
I suggest Rev.3  "Travel at your Own Risk"Compensation Schedule for work at SRS.  leastInsteadofink=topic=25524.msg137957#msg137957 date=1297078937]
You're mixing eligibility for funds with liability for the taxes on those funds.

Persons do not travel to get per diem, they get per diem because they travel and not all travelers get per diem.

We usually discuss these things via PM, and we always recommend getting good counsel from professionals, not internet forum hacks.

I have read these eligibility laws as they have pertained to my situation in the past. There was a time in my career when I trusted my employer to keep me on the best legal side of these issues, I have learned that is not their job, and most employers do not want it to be their job. Most employers cover their assets and liabilities which may or may not coincide with yours.

Back to the eligibility laws.

They are not convoluted if you take the time to read them versus projecting what you think they should read.

I would probably vote guilty, the above reasons are also probably why most persons charged with eligibility violations do all they can to settle for something before criminal trial. When you sit at a table and have the printed word in front of you and the facts in evidence these are nearly always bulletproof cases for conviction, ignorance notwithstanding.

Back to the tax liability rules.

Get a professional, in my experience the IRS is not typically as vindictive as they are made out to be for small fry such as the denizens of nukeworker.com, mostly because some nukeworkers are just tax stupid, not tax duplicitous. If in doubt, set aside enough money to cover any tax liabilities you may incur at the end of the quarter or the end of the year. Albeit, most quarterly filers are pretty sharp about tax liability and you never see them asking for help in these forums. If you know you have a problem open a dialogue with them through your tax professional, he/she will know the proper papers to file to speak on your behalf. Communicate and negotiate, it's just business.

But, above all, do not look for legal salvation here, get professional help,.....

(PS - yes I used an absolute in my post, and yes it will probably get challenged,....;-))
[/quote]

[namlive]

Per Diem has become the new killer of HP techs. At one time everyone got per diem, no matter where they lived and no one cared. The utility would pay the XYZ subcontract $45.00 (an example) an hour for every senior. XYZ subcontract would pay everyone per diem because the utility paid them either way. All you had to do was to supply XYZ with an address 50 miles (as the crow flies) away from the plant. Back then you could squeeze 10 HP techs into a post office box in Delaware. If you were a junior tech, the odd thing was that you got less per diem. 

Then around 1990 something weird happen. An unnamed site co-ordinator for a major contractor rented out both the upstairs and downstairs of his house while he was not there. It makes one groggy just to think about it. He got nailed by the IRS and this contactor took the lead in taxing per diem where one didn't meet the requirements. Oh yes, rumor has it, then said individual in trouble with the IRS took a dose report of all of his fellow contractors and handed it over to the IRS making everyone at a certain outage justify their per diem.

At this point on (Jan. 1, 1990), the industry drew a line in the sand. No per diem fraud and no testable drugs, or at least that is how I understood it. The real per diem test is simple: duplicate expenses. They go through a lot of hoops with a lot of rules to make sure everyone who draws per diem has duplicate expenses. If you think you meet all the legal requirements to get per diem and don't have duplicate expenses, think again. SRS will try to get you and they will press criminal fraud charges.

[cedugger]

Savannah River Site's procurement department continues to do everything in their power to ensure only those who are either desperate or ignorant will agree to come on site as a subcontractor and play their little game. I was a little of both when I agreed to come here.

Several RCT's reported here in April and all but one are still dealing with procurement to get their per diem approved...the one that isn't having any problems is the only one who decided not to seek any per diem reimbursements. This week, three techs received word that their PD was outright denied. It took procurement 3 months to come up with that!

New rules seem to have been introduced over the summer, one of which dictates exactly what type of dwelling you can have as your home of record. Renting a house is ok as well as an apartment at an actual apartment complex...however, renting a basement apartment or carriage house won't cut it. They also are comfortable with discriminating against you based on your marital status...if you're married with duplicate expenses you're okay...single with duplicate expenses and the only one on the lease, you're okay...share an apartment with your fiance with duplicate expenses (fiance still back home), you're NOT okay.

The score so far...6 new techs...one not claiming per diem at all...3 techs denied...my PD has been placed on hold twice...and 1 tech checking his e-mail every day waiting to get word of his denial!

If you think you'd like to play this game with the dictators at SRS procurement, then come on down. Otherwise, I'd stay clear of this place!

[Carolina Jethro]

Just say NO!

[Rennhack]

Savannah River Site's procurement department continues to do everything in their power to ensure only those who are either desperate or ignorant will agree to come on site as a subcontractor and play their little game. I was both desperate & ignorant when I agreed to come here.

Several RCT's reported here in April and all but one are still dealing with procurement to get their per diem approved...the one that isn't having any problems is the only one who decided not to seek any per diem reimbursements. This week, three techs received word that their PD was outright denied. It took procurement 3 months to come up with that!

New rules seem to have been introduced over the summer, one of which dictates exactly what type of dwelling you can have as your home of record. Renting a house is ok as well as an apartment at an actual apartment complex...however, renting a basement apartment or carriage house won't cut it. They also are comfortable with discriminating against you based on your marital status...if you're married with duplicate expenses you're okay...single with duplicate expenses and the only one on the lease, you're okay...share an apartment with your fiance with duplicate expenses (fiance still back home), you're NOT okay.

The score so far...6 new techs...one not claiming per diem at all...3 techs denied...my PD has been placed on hold twice...and 1 tech checking his e-mail every day waiting to get word of his denial!

If you think you'd like to play this game with the dictators at SRS procurement, then come on down. Otherwise, I'd stay clear of this place!

Thank you for sharing.

[pbooth]

Hello folks, if you don't have to come here, DON'T !!! The goal here is to not give any perdiem at all ! My heart goes out to all whom have been denied, lied to, basically cheated because of SRS management. What you do with your perdiem is your own business ! If you live 100 miles away, you have the right to receive it, regardless if you share an apartment with someone, whom ever ! It's just not fare ! How are we suppose to live ? It's clear, they(SRS) doesn't care about us or how we survive ! The procurement dept. drags the're feet on making determing who should and should not get perdiem just because SRS management wasted ARRA money on umbrellas, coolers, trailors which are un-occupied and are just sitting ! The list goes on and on and on !!!!! There is alot of work that needs to be done here, with outage season coming fast, it's going to be interesting to see when the smoke clears how many techs. will be here. What will SRS do then ? PBOOTH

[let-it-ride]

I know people have thought of it, but has anyone gone to the local press? Has anyone gone to outside government agencies? I know that many techs will bend over and take anything for their paycheck, but there has to be a time when enough is enough. If you continue to take it and stay, well then you deserve what you get. Things will only change if techs will stand up for each other. Sorry to say, I haven't seen that happen in 24 years

[radtech4coin]

Sorry to say I havent seen it in 35 years.

[cdorris44]

I left SRS earlier this year and has made great money. A lot of the people hired for the positions where I worked were new in the business straight off the boat and were not use to per diem, so they are going to stay no matter what. Another group hired are retirees from SRS and they are mostly locals. We can't get the power plant road techs to stand together, so why expect.

[Already Gone]

Savannah River Site's procurement department continues to do everything in their power to ensure only those who are either desperate or ignorant will agree to come on site as a subcontractor and play their little game. I was a little of both when I agreed to come here.

Several RCT's reported here in April and all but one are still dealing with procurement to get their per diem approved...the one that isn't having any problems is the only one who decided not to seek any per diem reimbursements. This week, three techs received word that their PD was outright denied. It took procurement 3 months to come up with that!

New rules seem to have been introduced over the summer, one of which dictates exactly what type of dwelling you can have as your home of record. Renting a house is ok as well as an apartment at an actual apartment complex...however, renting a basement apartment or carriage house won't cut it. They also are comfortable with discriminating against you based on your marital status...if you're married with duplicate expenses you're okay...single with duplicate expenses and the only one on the lease, you're okay...share an apartment with your fiance with duplicate expenses (fiance still back home), you're NOT okay.

The score so far...6 new techs...one not claiming per diem at all...3 techs denied...my PD has been placed on hold twice...and 1 tech checking his e-mail every day waiting to get word of his denial!

If you think you'd like to play this game with the dictators at SRS procurement, then come on down. Otherwise, I'd stay clear of this place!

This is shaping up just as we knew it would.  Look at the posts above.  There are people out there collecting money that isn't due them.  Guess what.  It is MY FREAKIN' MONEY that they are taking, and I expect government contractors to be diligent in paying it out (yeah, I know, you just spewed Coca-cola on your keyboard when you read that).
It ain't rocket science.  You are permitted to get a piece of my tax money if you are temporarily away from your tax home.  For that, you have to have a tax home.  A fiance (a person who is totally un-related to you, and for whom you are not legally responsible) paying rent on an apartment where you are not on the lease, well, that isn't your tax home.  Should have gotten yourself on the lease.  If you can't commit to the lease, you certainly can't claim to have a tie to that community (let alone that fiance).
Who do you blame?  Blame the person who took a job without having it in writing whether or not he was going to get perdiem.

[Fluffy Bunny]

I left SRS earlier this year and has made great money. A lot of the people hired for the positions where I worked were new in the business straight off the boat and were not use to per diem, so they are going to stay no matter what. Another group hired are retirees from SRS and they are mostly locals. We can't get the power plant road techs to stand together, so why expect.

I has made great money too!  But I am use to per diem!

[cedugger]

This is shaping up just as we knew it would.  Look at the posts above.  There are people out there collecting money that isn't due them.  Guess what.  It is MY FREAKIN' MONEY that they are taking, and I expect government contractors to be diligent in paying it out (yeah, I know, you just spewed Coca-cola on your keyboard when you read that).
It ain't rocket science.  You are permitted to get a piece of my tax money if you are temporarily away from your tax home.  For that, you have to have a tax home.  A fiance (a person who is totally un-related to you, and for whom you are not legally responsible) paying rent on an apartment where you are not on the lease, well, that isn't your tax home.  Should have gotten yourself on the lease.  If you can't commit to the lease, you certainly can't claim to have a tie to that community (let alone that fiance).
Who do you blame?  Blame the person who took a job without having it in writing whether or not he was going to get perdiem.

**Overly dickish comment retired via self-edit** Particular to the fiance situation...this is their home which they have shared for some time prior to taking this job, both parties on the lease (as required by many landlords), where he has been paying the entire lease while she finishes school. Does this still fit in your analysis of money that "isn't due them"? Is this now an acceptable use of your "freakin' money"?

Maybe you're speaking from a similar experience where the circumstances were different and the PD wasn't deserved...but no need to reflect that on every situation. The eligibility is there, but SRS procurement won't pay out because his fiance is on the lease with him. And since everyone over the age of 18 has to be listed on the lease, she can't be removed. Now...I'd like to get back to my Coca-Cola if I may.

Edited: In retrospect, I was an overt d-bag in my response.

[Already Gone]

Well, of course, if he is on the lease, that is his home.  Then, why won't they pay it?
My "assumption" in this case is that they just don't want to.

But my position is the same.  If it hadn't been for all those years of people collecting per diem while working in a town where they owned a house, collecting at the same place for 11 months a year for years on end, using a relative's address or PO box as their "home" address, ... etc., this would never have become such an issue.

Waiting for months on a per diem check is a pain that you might be willing to suffer, but working for months without knowing if you are ever going to be eligible for one is the same as saying that you accept the fact that you won't get it.

Without a written contract, you are powerless.  "They just don't want to" happens to be a valid legal reason for them to deny the per diem payments unless you have it guaranteed in writing that they have to pay it.  There is no law requiring them to pay you per diem even if you are eligible.

What can you do?  Don't work there.  That's your option.

[cdorris44]

Ok, Fluffy Bunny, I did not us spell check but do you get my point. 

[cedugger]

Well, of course, if he is on the lease, that is his home.  Then, why won't they pay it?
My "assumption" in this case is that they just don't want to.

But my position is the same.  If it hadn't been for all those years of people collecting per diem while working in a town where they owned a house, collecting at the same place for 11 months a year for years on end, using a relative's address or PO box as their "home" address, ... etc., this would never have become such an issue.

Waiting for months on a per diem check is a pain that you might be willing to suffer, but working for months without knowing if you are ever going to be eligible for one is the same as saying that you accept the fact that you won't get it.

Without a written contract, you are powerless.  "They just don't want to" happens to be a valid legal reason for them to deny the per diem payments unless you have it guaranteed in writing that they have to pay it.  There is no law requiring them to pay you per diem even if you are eligible.

What can you do?  Don't work there.  That's your option.

We think they're denying it simply because they can. There is a blurb in their travel compensation schedule that allows them to deny based on his apartment being "occupied by someone outside the employee's immediate family"...it's unclear as to whether this really applies here given that this is his primary residence and his fiance lives with him.

The positive side to this is that our company has been paying out the per diem this whole time and are the ones taking the financial hit, although it seems wrong for procurement to take so long in this process. You're right...not working here seems to be the only option for some!

[pbooth]

Yes there are denying it because they can and some people get off by making life hard for other people ! My advice to you all is catch the first thing smoken away from that GOD forsaken place, and smile when it's in your rearview mirror ! Don't look back and when SRS calls you to come back and they will, if you're a good tech, tell them you want a new contract written that states you will receive perdiem on a weekly basis @ $110 a day, no questions asked !!! And you don't want to be harrassed about where you live or who lives with you and if SRS can do that for you, then tell them to keep it, because they will only change the rules like they did when I was there, to suit them selves. If you get your fellow techs to stand together, like it should be, SRS would leave you guys alone and give you what you want !!!! PBOOTH

[MrHazmat]

From the local paper:
wrdw-tv: Federal prosecutors issue stern warning to future fraud at SRS
Publication: August 5, 2011

COLUMBIA, S.C. -- U.S. Attorney Bill Nettles of the South Carolina District has some strong words for the parties at Savannah River Site who stole millions of dollars worth of stimulus money.

"Fraud of stimulus packages is something we will not tolerate, and the culture of thinking it's okay must end," he told News 12.

His team of prosecutors are keeping a sharp eye on some workers at SRS.

"This investigation has been going on for some time—both the civil and criminal component of it—and we've brought it to a conclusion for these individuals," he said.

So far, they have two convictions, and they say those two individuals have been sentenced. Another will file a plea agreement later this month, and three others are in the pretrial diversion program. They've also reached settlements out of court with two other parties.

How were they able to steal from the government?

"They claim to have a primary place of residence outside of a particular radius, and then they would incur dual living expenses in the Aiken area," said Dean Eichelberger, an Assistant U.S. Attorney.

He says the money that landed in their paychecks for living expenses was money from the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009, more commonly known as the federal stimulus package.

"The lowest case is about $6,900. The highest case is upwards of . . . 70- and $80,000," he said.

He says even though the individual amounts weren't too astronomical, they add up to about $2,000,000.

"This is money that comes from the Federal Treasury. As soon as that amount of money passes one thousand dollars in the aggregate, it is a felony," he said.

They also say it's not just individual workers stealing from the government; companies are too. They already went after the Aiken County recruiting firm Southern Recruiters & Consultants, Inc.

"What this group was doing was they were facilitating the false statements of somebody saying, 'I got dual living expenses,' when in fact, [the employee was] living home with their parents, for example," said Assistant U.S. Attorney James Leventis.

That company settled out of court. They paid back $47,000. So far, $1,900,000 has been recovered overall.

Leventis says more cases continue to come in. They say that type of "per diem" fraud has been going on for a while, even before the stimulus package. However, they say regardless of where the money is coming from, it is an illegal act, and they will continue to prosecute.

The United States Department of Energy's Office of Inspector General has been working closely with the U.S. Attorney's Office in Columbia.

The DOE says $1.6 billion in stimulus dollars was allocated to the Savannah River Site. They also say the money saved or created 4,600 jobs.

http://www.wrdw.com/crimeteam12/headlines/Federa_126947123.html

In another article they named names and amounts, but I did not know if it was OK to post this.

[pbooth]

Hazmat, thank you for that info. But what about the honest people who have done the right thing, handed over the proper documents and are on the up and up ? Why should they be made to suffer, because of a few non-conformants ? SRS knows the ones who are questionable ! Go after them and give the honest people their perdeim at a decent rate ! They shouldn't be made to be under a microscope, harrassed at every turn ! They did the right thing when asked. If this doesn't happen SRS is going to look up one day and find themselves with no techs. to cover the work that has to be done. Then what will they do ? Beg people like they did when the Obama money was awarded to them, with the stipulation that they hire some road techs. It's clear to me that SRS'S management went after road techs, sure they caught a few, but what about the money they themselves wasted on umbrellas, coolers, and gift cards for the house techs. and the trailors in several areas with no occupants ? Let's put the blame where the blame belongs ! And that's only the tip of the ice burg. Those people only did what SRS management let them do, so again who's the blame ? PBOOTH

[MrHazmat]

I agree, if you come here your PD might be denied or at least be months behind IF you get it. Most Rode People will not come here unless they want to settle down and move here!!!!  I have heard stories from contractors and some have been here  6 months and still no PD AND HAVE NOT BEEN DENIED.

[MrHazmat]

Another one!!!  Has this been going on for years and nobody ever checked??

Aiken Standard: Jackson man pleads guilty to SRS per diem fraud
Publication: 8/24/2011

A Jackson man pleaded guilty in federal court Tuesday and awaits sentencing for submitting fraudulent per diem expense claims to the Department of Energy at the Savannah River Site.

Name removed, 56, who was temporarily employed at SRS, pleaded guilty to receiving per diem payments totaling nearly $26,000 on false claims that he was incurring dual living expenses when he was not, according to the U.S. Attorney's office.

Name removed claimed in forms submitted to DOE that he had a primary place of residence in Medford, Mass., and was also renting a house in the Jackson area during his temporary employment.

The investigation showed that Name removed owned the Jackson home and that other people were living in the Massachusetts home, according to the U.S. Attorney's office.

Because of this, Name removed was not incurring any dual living expenses and did not qualify to receive the per diem payments, some of which were funds provided through the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act.

Name removed has not yet been sentenced, but the maximum penalty that he can receive is a fine of $250,000 and/or imprisonment for 10 years, according to the U.S. Attorney's office. The U.S. Attorney's office has been investigating criminal and civil schemes by contractors that have so far resulted in five criminal convictions and the payment of $1.9 million, with more than $700,000 being ARRA money since 2009, according to assistant U.S. attorney James Leventis.

Name removed case was investigated by agents of DOE's Office of Inspector General and handled by assistant U.S. Attorney's Dean Eichelberger

[pbooth]

It's unfortunate that this cat, name removed did this because he like a few others have made it hard on those of us who are honest and did the right thing and handed in the correct documents. That should not in no way affect the rest of us, we did the right thing, leave us alone, we're just trying to make an honest living and support our families.The day is coming when SRS won't have anybody and can't get anybody because they change the rules to suite themselves, and all this perdeim fraud going on, SRNS also wasted a nice chunk of change on the office trailors, which are mostly un-occupied, and various trinkets for the house techs. When SRNS penalizes the people for perdiem fraud, they should penalize themselves for wasting money on the above mentioned items. If they are gonna tell it, tell it all ! Umbrellas, coolers, carharts,instumentation that was old and half worn-out with ARRA stickers on them when the ARRA money had been awarded for new instumentation, but they won't talk about that,WILL THEY   pbooth